Recommend me best heating method

[Plum]

My sense so far is that whichever final decision I go for.
The main issue of the installation will be this, accommodating a flue, presumably out through the cabintop. It will have to be sealable when on passage.

This picture shows my Taylors diesel heater in my Heard 23. Still going strong and very reliable. I leave it on low over night when on board. The section of flue above deck lifts off for stowage when not in use and replaced by a rubber cap. Mount the heater as low as possible (within 150mm of the sole) to avoid cold feet.

This pic shows the external flue in place. I have a second length i can insert to increase height. This improves draw in very windy conditions.


www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk

 

[Poignard]

Taylors paraffin heater installed opposite the heads. The tank is in the forepeak. It doesn't need any electrical supply and chucks out a tremendous amount of heat.

 

[Goldie]

I fitted a Pansy charcoal heater when my Wallas died, as it used the same flue diameter. It is a lovely thing if you can get it to work- no power draw, completely silent apart from the tinkling of the coals, and not much in the way of fumes. But I really struggled to get mine to draw. I think that a yacht facing in to the wind, with a sprayhood up, experiences a sort of negative pressure in the cabin, and the flue wants to draw down very strongly. I had to keep adding extra lengths to the flue, and also resort to heating the flue with a blowtorch to make it draw upwards. Opening the forehatch also helped, but rather defeated the objective of warming up the boat.

I had a Pascall Atkey Pansy heater on a previous boat, fantastic. To get it going and drawing properly, I used to unscrew the regulator and insert the end of my dinghy foot pump. By pumping VERY slowly and gently (otherwise it got very messy....) the stove would be roaring away and self sustaining in no time and producing a really dry heat day after day. From a cold start, this was the best way to get rid of the ‘plug’ of cold air sitting in the flue. Foil wrap some spuds, put them in the top and it does great baked potatoes too! If you have space to carry charcoal briquettes (lump wood charcoal, as sold for bbqs) it’s well worth considering if you can find a secondhand one.

 

[bromleybysea]

I had a Pascall Atkey charcoal heater. Bloody thing was a total PITA to get going. Any stove-type heater has the disadvantage of being a very hot lump of metal in a confined space. My 6-year old son burnt his hand on it. I then installed a CO monitor/alarm- a must-have with any live flame heater- and it frightened the life out of me. The things leaked CO all the time. I chucked it out and installed a Webasto. No regrets.

 

[NormanS]

I had a Pascall Atkey Pansy heater on a previous boat, fantastic. To get it going and drawing properly, I used to unscrew the regulator and insert the end of my dinghy foot pump. By pumping VERY slowly and gently (otherwise it got very messy....) the stove would be roaring away and self sustaining in no time and producing a really dry heat day after day. From a cold start, this was the best way to get rid of the ‘plug’ of cold air sitting in the flue. Foil wrap some spuds, put them in the top and it does great baked potatoes too! If you have space to carry charcoal briquettes (lump wood charcoal, as sold for bbqs) it’s well worth considering if you can find a secondhand one.

That could be a good starter for a new thread about inventive uses of dinghy pumps!

 

[dgadee]

I had a Pascall Atkey charcoal heater. Bloody thing was a total PITA to get going. Any stove-type heater has the disadvantage of being a very hot lump of metal in a confined space. My 6-year old son burnt his hand on it. I then installed a CO monitor/alarm- a must-have with any live flame heater- and it frightened the life out of me. The things leaked CO all the time. I chucked it out and installed a Webasto. No regrets.

My Sig Marine device has a small electric fan with a speed control for start up. No kids on board so no heat dangers from the exposed flue. My CO monitor has never gone off. But I think if I did have children on board I would have a different view of it as a heating source.

 

[gordmac]

I had a camper with a Propex gas heater, worked well but too noisy. Do you use gas for cooking? If you do it isn't an extra fuel although it may be difficult to get compatible gas cylinders there. Been up Norway past arctic circle and across into Sweden in winter in a motorhome with a diesel hot air blower, that hardly needed turning up to keep us warm.

 

[Graham_Wright]

You are coming up with names I am completely ignorant of and products I know nothing about.

The Chinese heaters go by the name of Planar (which seems to have been stolen from the Russian version.). They are very cheap, have variable output levels and really do chuck out the heat. They do consume electrical power though. They are copies of the Eber heaters and have small (1 inch) exhaust outlets.

 

[PetiteFleur]

I have fitted a Chinese hot air heater, but don't intend going to cold climates. Very much cheaper than the Eber/Webasto but some of the fittings are rubbish and I fitted an Eberspacher exhaust pipe + other bits. Planar are the Russian equivalent to Eber/Webasto but cheaper, dealers in the uk so service available. You would only need a 2kw, but beware of chinese 2kw as they are often 5kw sized units. There is a Facebook site for Chinese theaters- most problems with these appear to be poor installations. If you DIY they can be a cheap solution.

 

[Rappey]

I had a force 10 kerosene/diesel heater . Was OK for chilly summer evenings. I think it was around 2.4kw but the radiated heat just went upwards leading to very cold feet.
I finally swopped to a chinese parking heater ,5kw and it has been superb. Heats every corner of the boat, good for a wet clothes locker and been reliable for over 300 hrs.
All replacement parts seem to be £10.
Uses 9a when starting, just over 3 when on full and drops to 0.2a when running on low.
I would maybe want some sort of non electric heater as backup but understand your space is limited.

 

[convey]

I have a Refleks. Built by Danes for fishing boats in similar waters. Drip feeds from diesel tank, so no need for a pressure pot like the Taylors. Refleks bases their requirement tables on an outside temp of -20° C, so I guess you can be assured they work.

However, before I feedback, don't forget the value of the humble hot water bottle or two at the bottom of your sleeping bag. I'm the same in that I find if my feet aren't warm, I don't get to sleep. Any medical personnel explaining why at this point would be received gratefully. I suspect it's something to do with blood vessels being close to the surface and not insulted down there, and that by heating them, the rest of your body is heated up by the blood as well. Same boat & sleeping kit 'with', I sleep; 'without', I'm restless until exhaustion mugs me.

Taylors are neat and have a small flue, but that is then offset by the size of the tank and the requirement of it to be pumped up.
Refleks are bigger and have a bigger flue, but can use a passive feed from an external or engine tank. Some come with useful hotplates, although mine didn't.

Useful hint though, take a separate tank feed from *above* your engine feed so that if you run your diesel out using the heater, you've still got some left to get you into port.

Big pluses; no moving parts, no power required, no noise, no draft.

See comment above, Refleks do do a bulkhead mounted one that has a downward flue too, that can then be used to extend downwards and draw from the coldest air in the boat at your feet, otherwise bulkhead models will tend to pool warm air above a certain level. Not so advertised is a wall mounting kit for the other designs (with or without a hotplate), and that you can swop their flat bottoms for the same kind of downward draw design as this one. Worth asking about if you go this route. Hotplate versions have a downside of requiring a 90° angle out the back.

I think Lockgate, a British company, sets them up for use with kerosene if you use that for cooking already.

I wouldn't say no to a charcoal stove like a Pansy as I think the environmental argument is probably in their favour but diesel is less housekeeping and you can modulate the temperature from the knob, and be more sure it'll still be running in the morning.

I added one of these as a water heater. Just watched a video of two women living in a large narrowboat, using double the output size that I have, and they calculated their full-time, winter use as costing them £85 per month.

 

[Plum]

I have a Refleks. Built by Danes for fishing boats in similar waters. Drip feeds from diesel tank, so no need for a pressure pot like the Taylors.

Your comment about Taylors heaters only applies to the parafin version. The diesel version does not have a pressure tank and drip feeds.

Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk

 

[pcatterall]

If you can the 1/2 to 1 amp power draw then I would opt for a Chinese £100 2kw heater. I used to deal with Eberspacher heaters but they are massively overpriced. Allow extra for a 'proper marine silencer, decent exhaust pipe and a skin fitting.

 

[srm]

Your comment about Taylors heaters only applies to the parafin version. The diesel version does not have a pressure tank and drip feeds.

Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk

I had the Taylors diesel heater on my boat in Shetland, difficult to light and regulate, suffered from violent down drafts at time that either blew the flame out then filled that cabin with fumes or explosively reignited the vapour in the flue. When I realised that I would be living abord for the winter I fitted the Wallas mentioned in my previous post.

 

[MarkCX]

I have a Chinese 5kw diesel heater in my 23’ boat. It’s probably overpowered and if doing again I would probably go for the smaller type. Once it’s reached its set temperature it continues to tickover to the extent that I need to open the hatch to stop it climbing to 30°+, even in the middle of winter.

The biggest improvement over my previous heating arrangement is the low level output vents. My previous heater gave a noticeable boundary between hot and cold air about ⅓ of the way up from the floor.

On tickover it consumes 115ml of diesel & 0.6A per hour.

 

[convey]

I stand corrected re the diesel Taylors. So, in both cases, you'd have to have to mount the heater below the tank, or, as the guy in the video does, have a second feed tank just for the heater, pumped up from the main tank.

You can, of course, pull Eberspacher-types second hand out of car and vans. VWs and Mercs use them. I know a guy who used the water heating type, then fitted central heating radiators in his boat. Total cost was significantly less than £100. There was some kind of voodoo to it, like there's a high and a low output difference, and you go for the lower one, I think. If anyone is interested, I'll dig out the details.

Just because it's going in a boat, doesn't mean it has to cost marine prices.

 

[fredrussell]

I stand corrected re the diesel Taylors. So, in both cases, you'd have to have to mount the heater below the tank, or, as the guy in the video does, have a second feed tank just for the heater, pumped up from the main tank.

Sorry to correct you again but Taylors diesel heaters can be run with a very low consumption electric pump. My fuel tank was below heater. It’s actually a much better set up than using a gravity fed supply as it fuels at a constant rate, whereas gravity fed drip rate will change depending on weight of fuel in tank.

I had one on my 26 footer, wonderful arrangement. I assume Refleks and Dickinson heaters can run on an electric pump too.

 

[dgadee]

I assume Refleks and Dickinson heaters can run on an electric pump too.

The SIG Marine one can. Here's the manual in case anyone is interested: http://dickinsonmarine.com/dm/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/SIG-Diesel-Heaters.pdf

 

[convey]

Taylors diesel heaters can be run with a very low consumption electric pump. My fuel tank was below heater. It’s actually a much better set up than using a gravity fed supply as it fuels at a constant rate, whereas gravity fed drip rate will change depending on weight of fuel in tank.

Not so much a correction, but an addition to the equation.

So the heat output is determined by the pump? Fine, I guess, as long as your batteries don't flatten.

No, the Refleks has a very rudimentary carburetor, complete with a fuel bowl and float, and it is that which determines the flow. 6 settings. Designed to allow for a wide angle of leaning too.

If your main fuel tank is below the heater, then you can use a simple pump to pump fuel up to a secondary header tank above the heater. Any sort, manual or switched. Or, of course, you can just top it up manually.

I'm terrible at physics but I'd guess gravity is stronger than the pressure of the small fuel in a boat tank. And I'm biased towards no electrics, no moving parts.

 

[convey]

There's a cooking pot 60M version on Ebay for a reasonable price right now, with flues etc. Buy a spare cap to seal for when the weather kicks up.