Radar Detectors

nickrj

nickrj

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I recently had a tour of a Mini Transat, which while it didn't do the actual race, it was fully kitted to do so. It had a neat radar detector, which I was interested to see, because with the fleet of 70 in the actual race, I've never seen radar units in any of the photos.

The instrument was a very simple piece of equipment, with an antenna mounted on the inside of the boat, and an LED panel with four LED's - Illiminating on the starboard beam etc if a ship with radar is detected.

Can anyone tell me more about these things (I remember it was French made), what they cost, and where you can buy them? They seem like a really good compromise to running full radar - If it's good enough for the Mini transat race, then it's good enough for me...

nick.
 
Nick, they're great if the 'big boys' are running their radar. Most don't seem to South of Ushant. Michael who posts on these forums (based in la Rochelle and has published a couple of books/DVD's) had a detector fitted on his round the world trip but reckoned it was a waste of space. I realise that you're on a tight budget, but INMHO you'd be better off getting a radar set.
 
I had one on my trans-atlantic trip and eventually turned it off.

It works on pulses and something like a cigarette lighter or water pump would set the fecking thing off. I had several false alarms per day, which seriously disrupted my sleep patterns. I eventually decided that getting a decent rest was more important than avoiding a collision.
 
Hmm... Disappointing responses! I guess there are no easy answers then. Still, I'm pretty impressed that a singlehanded fleet of tiny fibreglass boats, make 4000nm (or whatever) without there being big hoohah on collisions.
 
I know I know... But to get radar, or to go sailing? It's all a compromise.

If they went off track, I'll go off track, no problem. I'd prefer to be the only one out there for 30days anyway /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

n
 
Nick, forget a radar. It eats several amps of electrickery per hour, so you'll then have to buy additional solar panels or wind generators or towed generators to run it.

The other problem with them is that the alarm also goes off for no reason e.g. wave clutter. And the alarm is not always loud enough to hear. Have you ever noticed how noisy a sailing boat is at sea? So what is the point?
 
p.s. AIS could possibly be a better solution to a radar and radar detector. The weakness in the arguement for AIS, is not all boats have them and you still have to give way to fishing boats (which don't necessarily have radar either).
 
Posts like "forget a radar" are slightly worrying, to say the least, eating a few amps is no worries generally, to NOT have one at todays prices is foolhardy. Alarms as said are EASY to amplify. Clutter is adjustable, a large ship will overide clutter.
Stingo, I know Nick is skint, but not for always...
It also stops people like YOU running into others with a bit of luck.

700 quid buys a good radar NEW. your choice dood at the end of the day, but not a sensible thing to suggest NOT to have it.
It can also be used when you are asleep for SH guys.. mk 1 eyball when awake if power id an issue, an no real excuse for that either.

Not logical or sensible advise, bordering on plain stupid these days.
 
What you're forgetting, is that Radar is a navigation aid and therefore should not be relied upon.

If I were skint, 700 squid would mean the world to me and IMHO, would be better spent on things like his cruising budget - ie doing the things that cruisers do. I made the mistake of kitting Stingo up with everything. If I hadn't, I could have departed for warmer climes at least a year earlier and IIRC, that is where Nick wants to be - cruising.

I do agree that Radar is very nice to have, but it is by no means essential.
 
Stingo, I know where u are coming from...
Yes, Nick has a tight budget, but the things are relatively so darn cheap.. not essential, but VERY high on my personal list, after sailing without for many years, then with, no going back.
I would happily sail without autopilot, navtex, windex, electronic wind indicator, log, plotters, liferaft even, if the choice was radar or the above. its purely WHERE you place the priorites.

Joe.
 
I have heard of these but can remember the make - similar to SeaMe which is about £900, you can buy budget radar for that! I know its probably out of your budget but if you do decide to look at radar take a look at the American dealers. Just bought a JRC 10 CRT unit which is classed as 'small professional' eg fishing, costal tug etc. The spec is much better than any of the LCD jobs including those costing thousands. Includes signal processing/averaging which is the comercial answer to wave clutter, only shows returns that are stable for a few passes which waves arn't also allows a watch mode wher you select the period it is off for and then the no of sweeps so allows you to minimise power consumption to about the same as a tri-colour. Cost including VAT delivery & duty was less than £1600. The nearest equivelent in UK was over £2300.
 
Hi...If you are going to spend any considerable time in any area with heavy commercial shipping...especially that is prone to fog...then it is foolhardy to not have a basic radar...especially at today's prices..take care !
 
Radar really is worthwhile. Safety, convenience, comfort, peace of mind and you can go to sea in bad viz. You can get into harbour in fog, too. In the last five years, off the top of my head, I've entered Ramsgate, Dover, St Peter Port, St Helier, Dartmouth, Falmouth, Fowey, and Chichester in viz that you wouldn't do without radar. In good viz at night radar can make a confused maze of lights look clear and understandable even with dozens of fishing vessels, fish farms and so on.

Divide the price by 3 to get the cost in pints - does that help (sorry, don't know the price of a pint these days, but not far off?). If you can possibly afford MARPA you won't regret it even if you have to go for a very second hand set. Don't worry about the electricity - that can always be sorted out one way or another.
 
I would guess you have to divide by 1 or 1.5 to get the number of pints, at least that's where I live.
If one buys a radar, but does not have enough electricity, you have to add the cost of the solar panels or the wind-generator to obtain the necessary electricity to run the radar. Sometimes this would also mean more battery capacity. Therefore the prices quoted have to be doubled! N.B. This is true also for a lot of other equipment or luxuries on board, such as a fridge!
 
But how much diesel can he carry and being on a tight budget, can he afford it?
 
My best moment during sailing was always when the sails were set and the engine turned off. To get rid of the humping of the diesel, although rather well insulated was pure joy.
 
yes and no to the radar question.You need it twice a year if only coasting, and then you are quaking without it. I think both radar and AIS are the way to go.It really depends where you sail.No ships, no worries! no night sailing in bad weather, no worries either.Fog is always a danger even off west coast of France. A friend who used radar at night in the Atlantic said it warned him of rains squalls approaching at night and this was a godsend.
sympathise with those who fitted everything before going, as this puts off the event.Seize the time off,retire or whatever, and then you will choose when to sail and not go out if bad visibility is likely.Good weather forecasts on board are more important than anything, GriB downloads from www.grib.us are the best thing since th sliced pan.
www.franksingleton.clara.net is the starting point for shortwave weather reception.He is a retired w forecaster and offshore sailor.
when you try to get weather by SSB at home much interfereance from gadgets in you house make the signal useless.Same in Marinas with noisy mains, and loads of alloy masts around.
Experiment when at anchor far from the madding crowd!check with a ship you can see the name of on passage and ask him if he can see your radar return until you are 5 miles away.In my case the alloy mas t gave a return.Hoist your new radar reflector, maybe you became invisible due to the cancellation effect(masking)? I carry a radar reflector on the backstay in bad visibility because I should.lastly for today, if you fit a radar, you are obliged under maritime law to use it and keep a watch. Does anybody know if you fit AIS are you required to keep a continuous watch on this bit of gear? At least all this stuff is voluntary fit presently.I'd quite like a RACON if caught out in the peasoup.Apparently you can use it if scared witless by the sound of approaching heavy engines! Sailcraft have one advantage over power in Fog, they can at least listen better if no engine is running. Of course you will need to run the engine to power all the electronics you have fitted!
Now for that fifth service battery!Oops! heavier 100 amp alternator, bigger diodes, control panels.Think I'll go back to the KISS principle and sail on a nice big lake in Ireland, like Lough Derg, no hazards to speak of and nice places to hire a yacht like Dromineer, Co Tipperary.
 
Re: Radar

Before we left we really wondered about radar. After all it's very expensive, and we were leaving the very busy Channel/Estuary/Southern North Sea area.

We were convinced by arguments from friends, particulary a couple who had sailed a KISS 32' westsail from NZ to Mallorca, who talked about its value in fog. Since then, we have had cause to bless it, and would rate it with self-steering and GPS and depth sounder as one of the 4 most valuable things (ie above electronic plotters, fridge,water-makers, freezer, SSB - some but not all of which we also have.)

Particularly useful amongst fishing boats at night but also when approaching a poor coastline in vis - eg we found it useful coming into Sete in day light when the radar showed us land was 3 nM away but we couldn't see it or the shape of the lowlying headlands.

We do have MARPA which is useful, and we have an alarm you can turn off, and you can set it to look at regular intervals. These mean you can have a look round every now and then, not be woken up by clutter (which can happen) and rest your power. It is of course good practice to turn your engine on in fog, but sometimes you can't - but if the radar then fails then ears, loud fog alarms, VHF listened to and (depending on your point of view) prayer will have to be good enough.

On the other hand we sailed around said busy areas without it for years and we were fine, if slightly more tense at times. Food is even more important than radar if the budget's really tight!
 
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