R.Y.A at it again!
- Thread starter Birdseye
- Start date
capnsensible
Well-known member
I suppose an ICC can't harm but I feel guilty about wasting the RYA's postage if it's of no practical value given a YM certificate (with photo
Thats a fair one as well, I reckon.
ctva
Well-known member
But you DO NOT NEED TO JOIN to get an ICC. Lots of things cost £45, uncanny, eh.Uncanny how the cost of an ICC works out exactly the same as RYA membership, though.
zoidberg
Well-known member
Your £45 keeps a couple of young things employed at RYA Towers, down Hamble way.
Like ALL organisations, the larger they get, the larger they want to get. It has long since ceased to have its roots in 'yachting'; it is now a self-appointed 'governing body' that the MCA and the Home Office tolerates 'cos it's simpler and cheaper so to do. You need to go to a couple of their cocktail parties and suss out the guest list to get a feel for what they're about.
It has appointed itself, and it appoints its own 'in crowd' of Council members from among school friends, cronies and neighbours of neighbours.
The rest are simply 'the drones', the worker bees.
Like ALL organisations, the larger they get, the larger they want to get. It has long since ceased to have its roots in 'yachting'; it is now a self-appointed 'governing body' that the MCA and the Home Office tolerates 'cos it's simpler and cheaper so to do. You need to go to a couple of their cocktail parties and suss out the guest list to get a feel for what they're about.
It has appointed itself, and it appoints its own 'in crowd' of Council members from among school friends, cronies and neighbours of neighbours.
The rest are simply 'the drones', the worker bees.
laika
Well-known member
How do I get an invite? Not so interested in the guest list but I'd be happy to get a feel for what they're about from the quality of the cocktails
RobbieW
Well-known member
Bad choice of example on my part because I suppose YMI is technically an instructor qualification rather than a sailing qualification. Croatia formally accepts RYA certs of Day Skipper and above but YMI is not listed. But you get the idea
I suppose an ICC can't harm but I feel guilty about wasting the RYA's postage if it's of no practical value given a YM certificate (with photo
The advantage I see for an ICC is that it is printed with a translation of the holders assessed skill into a number of languages. On the copy I have available, issued in '07, thats the main European languages but doesnt include Greek or any of the Slavic ones - perhaps it should given those are the countries where it seems to be most useful to yachties.
Sandy
Well-known member
Do you need an ICC?
Do you plan to use Red Diesel in Europe before 01/04/2019.
Do you have a Q flag?
laika
Well-known member
Yes: that's a good reason.
When you say "available" do you mean your current valid ICC is on the boat?
Iain C
Active member
Personally I'm fine with the RYA setup, as a member I think it's fair value. What I do have more of a problem with is actually how shonky the eligibility criteria are.
I needed an ICC for a bareboat charter in the Med around 10 years ago. I was chartering a Bavaria 40. I got one...automatically, because (IIRC) I was both a dinghy instructor and had my safety boat ticket (that was done in tidal waters). So off I went to skipper a Bav 40 around Sardinia...and of course the eagle eyed would notice that as far as the RYA were concerned, I'd never once even stepped foot on a yacht.
Now, as it happens I'd done several thousand miles of cruising over a long period of time and knew what I was doing...however as crew I could count on one hand the number of times I'd been at the helm in marinas, and obviously I'd never actually been skipper.
I've just had to renew it...and when the form came through I saw I could tick the PWC box too so I now have that endorsement too. My PWC experience is limited to 30 mins on Lake Havasu in the USA before I got bored and gave it back...
Interestingly I have chartered some big boats (45' +) in the UK without any formal UK RYA qualifications apart from Day Skipper Shorebased and VHF. Normally a 2 minute chat with the charter company based on the fact I've had my own boat for around 10 years and have cruised the south coast, France and the Scillies is all they need interestingly enough...
I needed an ICC for a bareboat charter in the Med around 10 years ago. I was chartering a Bavaria 40. I got one...automatically, because (IIRC) I was both a dinghy instructor and had my safety boat ticket (that was done in tidal waters). So off I went to skipper a Bav 40 around Sardinia...and of course the eagle eyed would notice that as far as the RYA were concerned, I'd never once even stepped foot on a yacht.
Now, as it happens I'd done several thousand miles of cruising over a long period of time and knew what I was doing...however as crew I could count on one hand the number of times I'd been at the helm in marinas, and obviously I'd never actually been skipper.
I've just had to renew it...and when the form came through I saw I could tick the PWC box too so I now have that endorsement too. My PWC experience is limited to 30 mins on Lake Havasu in the USA before I got bored and gave it back...
Interestingly I have chartered some big boats (45' +) in the UK without any formal UK RYA qualifications apart from Day Skipper Shorebased and VHF. Normally a 2 minute chat with the charter company based on the fact I've had my own boat for around 10 years and have cruised the south coast, France and the Scillies is all they need interestingly enough...
ip485
Well-known member
I am ahppy with the arrangement, for those not memebers I see it rather as a bonus.
oldharry
Well-known member
I dont see any issue here. The state has delegated the issue of ICC's to the RYA as the official governing body of the sport. RYA choose to discount the cost to paid up members. Seems fair to me. No different to any Club arranging discounts for its members.
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JumbleDuck
Well-known member
GHA
Well-known member
Not just RYA (who don't have a monopoly), same for BSAC who offer power under 10m ICC if you have Diver Coxswain Award issued by any diving association, which is a member of the Combined Diving Associations (CDA).
Joining fee £69.00, ICC £35.00 for non members, £15.00 for members.
No big deal, just the usual forum grumpiness and anything and everything
dom
Well-known member
To be fair the opportunity was there for the taking: the 2012 Olympics & associated funding provided a perfect opportunity and the RYA took it. Revenue for y/e/ 2017 was £22m with a c.£9m subsidy coming from general taxation. Not sure but I think that's a record.
Better than funding a dodgy ferry service mind, run by a CEO with a history of bankrupting similar businesses. :ambivalence:
capnsensible
Well-known member
The Yachtmaster title goes back to 1938 and was examined by Master Mariners appointed by the Board of Trade following an Admiralty request.
The RYA then negotiated to administer the BOT exams in the early 1970s with the first exams in 1973. I believe this became the Department of Transport responsibility and subsequently the Maritime Coastguard Agency.
So effectively, its a Government authorisation.
Hope this helps.
CLB
Well-known member
I think that has been tightened up now. For many years I only had the mobo boxes ticked on my ICC and it wasnt until I did a DS sail that I got the sailing boxes ticked. I now have a full set, but only because I have the relevant qualifications in each discipline.
capnsensible
Well-known member
Bad choice of example on my part because I suppose YMI is technically an instructor qualification rather than a sailing qualification. Croatia formally accepts RYA certs of Day Skipper and above but YMI is not listed. But you get the idea
)
The Instructor bit is an endorsement on a sailing qualification. So for example, Yachtmaster Ocean is the saily bit, endosements can include sailing vessel up to 24m, Commercial and Instructor (sail).
Davy_S
Well-known member
I have not got my copy handy, but i am sure that it has the Greek language on the reverse side, anyone got one handy, I have just renewed mine but it is at another property.
Kukri
Well-known member
I have come in from the cold.
After owning and cruising in my own boats since 1970, I have just joined the RYA.
The application form did ask if I was joining to get an ICC, to which the honest answer is, "No, but I shall be applying for one in due course ."
The real reason is that having hit retirement age, after messing about in thirtysomething-feet boats for three decades and more, with no qualifications other than a Restricted VHF Certificate, which I first acquired when I needed Morse for it , I bought a significantly bigger boat; one that is capable of doing real damage if mis-handled, so I thought I would put myself through all the relevant courses, on the grounds that I haven't had almost fifty years of experience; I've had about five years of experience. with the last three repeated, many times, on the same two boats, with the same kit.
And I find, from sailing with others who have learned the RYA way of doing things that they are very often doing things in a better way than I had learned and continued to use, even silly little things like "OXO".
After owning and cruising in my own boats since 1970, I have just joined the RYA.
The application form did ask if I was joining to get an ICC, to which the honest answer is, "No, but I shall be applying for one in due course ."
The real reason is that having hit retirement age, after messing about in thirtysomething-feet boats for three decades and more, with no qualifications other than a Restricted VHF Certificate, which I first acquired when I needed Morse for it , I bought a significantly bigger boat; one that is capable of doing real damage if mis-handled, so I thought I would put myself through all the relevant courses, on the grounds that I haven't had almost fifty years of experience; I've had about five years of experience. with the last three repeated, many times, on the same two boats, with the same kit.
And I find, from sailing with others who have learned the RYA way of doing things that they are very often doing things in a better way than I had learned and continued to use, even silly little things like "OXO".
JumbleDuck
Well-known member
Being the official Olympic body is rather different from governing all recreational sailing. What rules does the RYA makes which apply to us all?
I remember when the documentation always said RYA/DoT Yachtmaster. However, as above, that's a rather different issue from being the official governing body for recreational sailing.
The buggers lasso moorings, though.