Purchasing a Yacht _ Sea trial

[Bosun Higgs]

By now the Volvo 2002 will be getting on a bit. You can expect some smoke on start up and that will also put a film of diesel on the water. No problem. Let the engine idle when warm and then does it belch smoke when you rev up - thats a sign of some wear in the bores ( pistons cooling down at idle and letting some lube oil past the rings). Mine did that but is still in use 5 years later.

Guard against expecting a second hand boat to be new - it isnt. So you arent buying perfection and wont get it. Issues like rig tuning are trivial. If you didnt have quite a few jobs on the list after purchase it would be a miracle.

 

[TQA]

Make sure you run it at full throttle in forward for at least 5 minutes 10 is better and watch the temp guage. If it keeps rising that may well mean that the heat exchanger is partially blocked.

Watch for white smoke, some black smoke would not be unusual esp from older engines but a smoke screen is not good.

Bring it back to idle and see if the idle oil pressure has dropped significantly, if yes this is a sign that you may have a worn engine.

 

[Tranona]

>Cruising speedd should be comfortable in the rev range 2-2500

It depends how old the engine is. We have a Volvo MD17C and the cruising revs are 1600 to 1800. On the subject of smoke it is not necessarily a problem. Old engines were not designed to to modern emission standards and they all smoke to some extent.

Read what the OP says - it is a Volvo 2002 - the rev range suggested is correct - and it should not smoke.

 

[Bosun Higgs]

Read what the OP says - it is a Volvo 2002 - the rev range suggested is correct - and it should not smoke.

Thats unrealistic Tranona. It will smoke when pushing the throttle forward and is likely to do so a bit after idling and due to wear. It is an old engine after all.

So a bit of light smoke is acceptable. What isnt is putting down a smokescreen like a WW2 destroyer.

 

[maby]

we should collect together the contents of this thread and publish a book - would have been useful when we bought our first boat!

 

[stownsend]

Well said Maby ! I've never got to the sea trail stage yet, hopefully will this time and this is excellent info !

Cheers

Stu

 

[snooks]

Look at the tension on the various parts of the standing rigging at various points of sail - do the leeward shrouds go slack(ish) - they may need tuning. Does it point equally well on both tacks? if not, the mast may not be vertical or may be bent.

An untuned rig isn't a reason not to buy a boat. It is, however, a reason to tune the rig

As for slack in the leeward shrouds, check out the leeward shrouds swinging around on this Contessas 32:



You would have thought the builder and numerous RTI winner would have known how to tune his own shrouds

Looking up the mast track is a better tell tail, but again this is just tuning, not a reason to walk away.

To the OP.

What is the fouling like on the bottom? This will kill your speed and enjoyment, and won't do the yacht justice.

Go hard on a beat, what's the weather helm like?, how old are the sails?, if they are baggy? Now go down below with her still hard on the wind, see if you can move around safely at an angle, check for excessive squeaking, try to open and close all of the doors, think about how you would cook a meal, tack and do it all over again.

Have a good look at all the sails, try reefing, headsail and main, check any other sail controls.

Check the engine, go through the revs in forward, and up to full revs, and keep it there for a few minutes, try some practice parking, how's the prop walk? Is it excessive? Can you live with it? Reverse around in a circle one way then the other, then try to reverse into a berth. How was it?

Don't take a packed lunch and treat it as a day out though

 

[Billjratt]

As well as most of the above, use your nose!
Any musty smells indicate damp, which may be from dribbles at windows, stanchions or shroud plates. Check the condition of wood in the corners of shelves etc, where dribbles would gather.
Take a video camera with you and use it to look under floors and round corners you can't normally see, while telling it what you're pointing at.
Look for poor-quality workmanship/bodges and if found, assume there will be more - it's a state of mind.
Look at (and/or measure) the symmetry of the furniture. Lop-sided bunks and cupboards speak to me about a home-build or a yard that didn't have high quality criteria.
Wiring and plumbing may have several generations installed without clearing out the displaced stuff properly.
none of these (and more) will keep you from the boat you've fallen in love with, but they should allow you to make a realistic and fair offer.

 

[alahol2]

Check the tabbings to the hull on the inbuilt bulkheads and furniture. They are always hidden at the end of underbunk lockers etc. A camera or video camera with a light can help considerably.

 

[ffiill]

Problem is its a bit like buying a new house or a new car.
Everything goes out the window particularly if you fall for the boat.
My sea trial was a trip from Helensburgh back over to Gourock where the boat had its permanent mooring.
Up with the sails;gentle breeze;brilliant June day-need I say more.
Were there any problems?-well I didnt spot the autopilot was not working and in all honesty I do not think the owner was aware as boat is so well balanced under sail.
It wasnt a big thing to fix as it turns out and then there was the engines circulating water pump which seized half way along the Crinan Canal.
This happened because its lubrication reservoir hadnt been filled in years-which reminds me!
Of course as I got to know the boat other things surfaced such as the boom having been refitted upside down/or the slab reefing hooks had been fitted upside down!
Generally though worth the sea trial plus a good survey.

 

[maby]

An untuned rig isn't a reason not to buy a boat. It is, however, a reason to tune the rig

...

The number of total show-stoppers is quite small. Part of the purpose of a sea trial is to assess whether or not you are likely to enjoy sailing the boat, but another part is to assess the total cost and effort involved in bringing it up to the standard you expect of it. Some owners are happy doing almost anything to their boat, but others - myself included - would call in professional help for maintenance of the standing rigging. Ideally, at the end of the sea trial you should come away with a reasonably good idea of the total amount of work that you will need to get done on the boat and be in a position to estimate the cost - which may not be the same for you as it is for someone else - depending on how much you are willing to do yourself. Only at that point are you in a position to assess the asking price and decide if you are prepared to go through with the purchase.

 

[garvellachs]

systems

As others have hinted it's easy to lose objectivity - so try to think in terms of all the boat's systems? Then check out each one in turn:

heating if fitted? (try it before the engine goes on but with shore power disconnected)
engine system (by asking beforehand insist on the engine being cold if possible);
sail system;
electrical system (esp is it charging);
bilges;
steering in port;
steering under sail;
anchor system;
freshwater system;
heads (ask if you may pump it through);

Apart from the last two, a major problem in the others can costs 100s if not 1000s to repair so it's worth checking them all out. Even if a boat is getting on, things must not just work, they must work well - the sea is unforgiving of poor maintenance or worn out gear.

 

[snooks]

Some owners are happy doing almost anything to their boat, but others - myself included - would call in professional help for maintenance of the standing rigging.

Tuning a rig is pretty simple with the correct size spanner and a flat ended screw driver. You're tuning it for cruising, not racing and it shouldn't take more than half an hour to straighten out any bends or leans.

Get the Haynes manual: sailing rigs and spars by Mat Sheahan, or the YM book sail power, they will pay for themselves with that one job

 

[Spyro]

Tuning a rig is pretty simple with the correct size spanner and a flat ended screw driver. You're tuning it for cruising, not racing and it shouldn't take more than half an hour to straighten out any bends or leans.

Get the Haynes manual: sailing rigs and spars by Mat Sheahan, or the YM book sail power, they will pay for themselves with that one job

I was always told use 2 spanners and never to use a screw driver in the bottle screws.

 

[snooks]

Get the Haynes manual: sailing rigs and spars by Mat Sheahan, or the YM book sail power, they will pay for themselves with that one job

[Update for Maby]
You could buy the May 2012 issue of PBO which I've just noticed has a 6 page feature about tuning your mast (or less relevant, 5 pages on my cruise around Cape Wrath )

 

[KellysEye]

>Read what the OP says - it is a Volvo 2002 - the rev range suggested is correct - and it should not smoke.

I did say old engines and 2002 is certainly not new but you are right about the revs. This the the Emission standard for marine diesels in 2002. As you will see nothing for that size engine, so expect it to smoke a bit.

'2002 Recreational Vessel Rule. This rule applies to new recreational marine diesel engines over 37 kW (50 hp) that are used in yachts, cruisers, and other types of pleasure craft. The 2002 rule does not apply to outboard and personal watercraft spark ignited engines, which are regulated separately'.

 

[maby]

[Update for Maby]
You could buy the May 2012 issue of PBO which I've just noticed has a 6 page feature about tuning your mast (or less relevant, 5 pages on my cruise around Cape Wrath )

Seen it - interesting, but I think I'll still pay a professional!

 

[KellysEye]

>but you would expect them to handle broadly the same on both tacks! If it will push up to near 40 degrees off the wind on one tack but is struggling at 60 on the other, it's time to sight up the mast and boom and make sure everything looks straight and broadly where the designer intended it to be

I know the problem with our boat it is because we have a Westerbeke generator on the starboard side. So upwind she points higher on starboard tack and lower on port tack, it's about 5 degrees difference, whch usually balances out. Off wind it makes no appreciable difference. I said 'weight distribution perhaps' but I am convinced that's what it is. As I said every boat I've sailed, two or three charters a year for over twenty years, fifteen different boats, had the same problem. Neither our boat or the charter boats (except one) had a poorly set up rig, The mast (masts in our case) were straight and the rigging tight. The only problem we had with one charter boat was that when going up wind the downwind shroud would flap dreadfully and the mast would bend, we tightened them up.

On the rigging front we set up our own rigging. If you tighten the bottle screws as tight as possible and then tighten the nuts it's job done and it's impossible to apply sufficient force to break the wire or anywhere close. Obviously keep an eye on the mast to make sure it is straight and not bent fore or aft unless racing.