Public Slipway (legal definitions and rights) help needed

[Conrad]

Hi

Having heard several derelict, blocked and unused slipways in the Thames referred to as Public Slipways I am searching hard for a legal definition, in particular as to what rights there are associated with them.

Does anybody know of a source of reference, a planning rule, a statute or any other peace of literature that states precisely what duties there are for these public slipways to be made available and protected. Perhaps if anyone has any examples or case studies where it was argued that a public slipway should be put back to use and they won?

Regards

Conrad

Apologies that this is reposted from the Thames forum but it is quite urgent that some clarity is found, this seems to be one of those grey areas that no one can quite put their finger on, unlike land based Rights of Ways.

 

[Tranona]

Don't think you will find there is a general definition. The land above the high water mark belongs to somebody who can permit or otherwise people to use it for access to the water. Often it will be owned by a public body such as a council or a port authority and public access will be covered by a bye law. Private owners may also allow public access posssibly with a charge.

An obvious place to start for the tidal Thames is the PLA - probably the legal department. For a more general view the RYA legal department will also know.

 

[Quandary]

Slipways

In Scotland (so may not all be relevant) most slipways which reach the water are controlled by the Crown Estate, last year when we wanted to build a new one for junior dinghy training we had to get the following approvals
Planning Approval which was mainly concerned with the access from the road ( but they required evidence of consent from the other two below)
SEPA (Scottish Environmental Protection Agency) a quango which likes to dabble in anything. little knowledge but very powerful because of its name, I think they were concerned mainly with pollution risk.
Crown Estate because it crossed the area which they control ( everything up to high water mark) They have recently been subject to a lot of attention in Scotland regarding what they had been doing with the money they have been collecting from harbours and moorings for years, so have been trying to improve their image recently, they gave us a grant for a couple of thousand pounds ( first offer was £20k but the guy who offered went on extended leave) In the end the £2k bought cement for concrete, stone, rock armour etc was all contributed by local contractors, we provide some more money and voluntary labour. Crown Estate have given very large grants in the last couple of years for marina facilities in places like E.L.Tarbert and Tobermory
If we wanted to remove it we would have to get approval from all three again but if we decided just not to use it we would not need permission from any one, however any work such as closing the access would require Planning and probably Crown Estate approval.
To conclude, if your concern is loss of public slipways I would start with the Crown Estate, they have a representative in most areas (mainly to collect mooring fees) However in certain defined harbours their role is taken over by the Harbour Authority. Both are expected to ensure that water access is maintained, if there are no slipways there are no moorings and therefore no income. If you can imply or even better prove, that there are benefits for youth sport, combating obesity and access for disabled, this multiplies the strength of the case. A direct approach through a meeting or series of meetings works much better than a letter of complaint, but after the meeting send them a letter or minute recording everything that they agreed that you want placed on record, they will then have to file it (and keep it).
Addition
If you are campaigning to maintain access to existing public slipways, I would have thought that the rules governing access itself was exactly the same as for any other public right of way (which may be lost if by prolonged disuse can be established) However it could be argued that right of access does not extend to include actual use but it would be take an extreme pedant to argue that you could access a ramp but not use it.

 

[2Tizwoz]

The Old Public Slipway

In this case held in escrow by the District Council. However as the origins of some of this law go back to the doings of Henry VIII the difficulties surrounding finding traces of particular stretches of what will have presumably been in riparian ownership will be immense.

Searching could perhaps commence with the land registry records of the particular area. Councils are imperfect record keepers however so that much of our land has no registered title. These tend to be those for which there is no great use. No doubt public slipways will fall into that category as they are primarily a liability for the owner rather than being a valuable asset. There will be no rent to be collected so that means of ensuring that records are kept under successive re-organisations or changes of officers and offices does not serve as a reminder.

The Environment Agency is the navigation authority for the rivers Ancholme, Glen,Great Ouse, Lugg, Medway, Nene, Suffolk Stour, Thames, Welland and Wye. Each of these rivers has a historic public right of navigation – a common law right of access for boating – which was established before King John appended his seal to the Magna Carta. The Agency is the present day guardian of this right.

The Environment Agency list some public slipways here

Old maps may indicate the erstwhile presence of a slipway but are unlikely to mention its ownership.

 

[Conrad]

Thanks for the replies to date, definitely seems like a grey area, it also doesn't seem that emotive, I guess this must be because where there are no slipways as a result there is not an established vocal boating community.

Thanks again any more thoughts or examples most welcome.

Reagrds

Conrad

 

[capt_courageous]

Hi
There are several public slipways in the Solent area but as you say it is not an emotive thing. I guess because most Forumites are not very dependent on them and are much more interested in moorings. The more likely users are small power boat or RIB users. Most of the slips have small tatty notices somewhere giving details. Usually about not blocking them.

 

[halcyon]

Does anybody know of a source of reference, a planning rule, a statute or any other peace of literature that states precisely what duties there are for these public slipways to be made available and protected. Perhaps if anyone has any examples or case studies where it was argued that a public slipway should be put back to use and they won?.

Mylor Yacht harbour is a case.

When they filled in New Quay to extend parking and boat storage, they were going to block the Public Slip. or 'fisherman's slip'. There was a bit of a fight, and MYH agreed to build a new Public slip, and not charge for it's use. It's the nice big slip before you reach the shops. The old one is still there, but not useable, except for a dinghy.

I think the fight was lead by Turo Boat Owners Assocciation, but I do not think any of the current committee were involved. If I see Pete I will ask him what went on if you like.

Brian

 

[Conrad]

"I think the fight was lead by Turo Boat Owners Assocciation, but I do not think any of the current committee were involved. If I see Pete I will ask him what went on if you like."

Brian[/QUOTE]

Brian

If you could ask it would be much appreciated my email is broadley@btinternet.com if that would be an easier way to reply.

Many Thanks

Conrad