Propeller fell off after 1 hour, what to do?

SolentPhill said:
Couple of points here, if you start small claims and he takes on a solicitor and you lose you could be no better off and have his legal costs, if you start it thinking you will call his bluff and then stop the action you could also be liable for his costs.
Click to expand...

Its a shame one of the forum legal team hasnt jumped in here.

Thats not the case in small claims court.

For the claimant to be left with the defendants costs the defendant would have to show the claim was malicious (completely fabricated with no substance) and also have to show why he had any costs beyond a day off work, he couldnt employ the best legal team in the UK to take on one unhappy customer(well he can but at his own expense !) .
 
nrbx said:
Hi guys,

Have found a picture, unfortunatly for the prop that i still have.

However that is definitly the old washer thing!!! No idea if its installed right from the pic though...

Its worth noting that while anti fouling i did notice the old washers, and the bits that fit in the key part of the shaft were definitly broken off and missing. So i guess hes put the faulty old ones back on hence it came off.

We at least know he did on this one.
Click to expand...

NRBX,

I do not think you digested my post. If the propeller was riding on the key and not fully engaged on the taper this arrangement is designed to fail, regardless of new lock tab or old lock tab.

No point in people shouting this is how mine is done and has never been a problem. You will never see RNLI vessel with such half assed arrangement.

The only safe way is big nut, little nut, as for cotter pins, all they are good for is catching monofilament fishing line as they will not stop a prop nut from coming loose, unless of course, they're used with a properly fitted castellated nut. A much better trick to ensure the security of the rear prop nut mechanically is to cross drill it thru a hex corner, and properly safety wire it through the cotter keyhole aka "aircraft style."

A left hand prop is (usually) less likely to come loose than a right hand prop.
 
I know that this is not at all helpful but I think the title of this post has to be the funniest of the year yet. Maybe my poor sense of humour but it makes me laugh everytime I look at it :D

Sorry Neil!
 
Searush said:
Sounds like you're starting to build up a case, but it is still your word against his at the mo. In Small Claims court, they tend to find for the customer in these sort of cases.
Click to expand...

Not always. At one of the few cases at the Small Claims Court which I lost I realised that I needed an "Expert Witness" which in this case would probably be a Marine Surveyor.
You have to quantify your loss. You should work out the cost of lifting your boat out of the water for examination, the cost of a new propellor, plus any work required to the boat, the cost of the Marine Surveyors initial inspection, and the cost of the Surveyor going to court for a day to give evidence on your behalf, and submit a claim to the Small Claims Court FORTHWITH.
No doubt your Marine Surveyor would attend and voice his opinion as to the remoteness of "persons unknown" removing the propeller nut and locking tab.
I would also ask the Boatyard where your boatyard was stored for a letter outlining how many boats have been intefered with during their ownership. (Presumably none)
 
Old Washers

Have the same arrangement on ours, not had any probs with "old" washers going back on, one thing though if the shaft was greased before the prop went back on it's possible that "hydraulicing" occurred making it feel as though everything was tight when in fact it was'nt, had this happen to myself, luckily though we felt the vibes and found the cause before the prop went awol. Is the remaining one available to inspect? if so have a look for grease on the shaft.
 
???

Jim@sea said:
Not always. At one of the few cases at the Small Claims Court which I lost I realised that I needed an "Expert Witness" which in this case would probably be a Marine Surveyor.
You have to quantify your loss. You should work out the cost of lifting your boat out of the water for examination, the cost of a new propellor, plus any work required to the boat, the cost of the Marine Surveyors initial inspection, and the cost of the Surveyor going to court for a day to give evidence on your behalf, and submit a claim to the Small Claims Court FORTHWITH.
No doubt your Marine Surveyor would attend and voice his opinion as to the remoteness of "persons unknown" removing the propeller nut and locking tab.
I would also ask the Boatyard where your boatyard was stored for a letter outlining how many boats have been intefered with during their ownership. (Presumably none)
Click to expand...


With ref to your comment about an expert witness I agree and I may like to add that rather than a letter from the knuckle dragging security guards or the
boat yard manager at Port Solent you may wish to request that someone from the Crime Bureau at Hampshire Constabulary furnish the Magistrate directly with statistics of Marine Crime and thefts from boatyards and marinas throughout the south coast in the last couple of months. While a Marine surveyor knows lots about boats, What the hell do they know about crime in the south?

One last point... actually aimed at Nrbx
You seem to have completely ignored the fact that it is a distinct possibility that someone could have attempted to steal your prop and you are intent on trying to ruin someone when a claim on your insurance is the least damaging
to everyone. Perhaps you are just being vindictive???
 
Jim@sea said:
You have to quantify your loss. You should work out the cost of lifting your boat out of the water for examination, the cost of a new propellor, plus any work required to the boat, the cost of the Marine Surveyors initial inspection, and the cost of the Surveyor going to court for a day to give evidence on your behalf, and submit a claim to the Small Claims Court FORTHWITH.
Click to expand...

[pedant]There ain't no such thing as the Small Claims Court ...[/pedant]

... just the Small Claims Track. The judge will want to know that everything has been done to settle out of court, so just slamming in a claim isn't sensible. It needs a Letter Before Action first - lots of templates googleable. Then wallop him.
 
Ubergeekian said:
[pedant]There ain't no such thing as the Small Claims Court ...[/pedant]

... just the Small Claims Track. The judge will want to know that everything has been done to settle out of court, so just slamming in a claim isn't sensible. It needs a Letter Before Action first - lots of templates googleable. Then wallop him.
Click to expand...

Yes, having just been through the process the advice from the court is to demostrate you have explored every other avenue and you need to present your evidence in the same way as any other court. This would include records of any exchanges, statements from expert witnesses detailed support for your loss (estimates for restitution).

This gives you the opportunity to get your position in front of the court first as all that goes to the other party, who may well decide to settle - including your costs. In my case it worked perfectly as the phone call came the day after and we settled over the phone. Mind you took a few weeks for the cash to come and before I withdrew the claim from the court.
 
To the guy who said along the lines of this, but the post is now gone.

"why don't you claim on your insurance instead of trying to ruin someone?". I think you will find that most insurers won't insure negligent work that causes the loss of a propeller, mine does not for starters.

I'm not trying to "ruin" anyone, you may note I have not named anyone, and I have offered to let him pay me back over 6 months for it to avoid that outcome.

I seam to have all the info I need now so I'm just waiting for my offer deadline to expire.
 
Forgot to add,

Port Solent have confirmed no propeller thefts in as long as they can remember.

And that he never signed in to do work thus proof of him having liability insurance is still AWOL as he refuses to supply that to me.

I'm well aware that someone could have tried to steal the prop, but there are quite a few facts making that a virtual zero chance.

1) I was inboard since they went on, until launch.
2) the missing prop is e non refurbed one. Why not go for the nice shiney one?
3) it was still there, and given how easily it fell off I doubt someone would have not been able to steal it.
4) they put the nut back on for me nice and tight.
5) he admitted liability when it happened.
6) he claimed he has proof he put new washers on, a big point he made, but I have a photo proving he did not.
7) the prop has very little use to anyone bar a sq52 owner in around the first 25 boats before they changed the engines, that's a small black market.
 
Last edited:
nrbx said:
Forgot to add,

Port Solent have confirmed no propeller thefts in as long as they can remember.

And that he never signed in to do work thus proof of him having liability insurance is still AWOL as he refuses to supply that to me.

I'm well aware that someone could have tried to steal the prop, but there are quite a few facts making that a virtual zero chance.

1) I was inboard since they went on, until launch.
2) the missing prop is e non refurbed one. Why not go for the nice shiney one?
3) it was still there, and given how easily it fell off I doubt someone would have not been able to steal it.
4) they put the nut back on for me nice and tight.
5) he admitted liability when it happened.
6) he claimed he has proof he put new washers on, a big point he made, but I have a photo proving he did not.
7) the prop has very little use to anyone bar a sq52 owner in around the first 25 boats before they changed the engines, that's a small black market.
Click to expand...

I sign in every time at Port Solent, was there 3 days this week, and he should sign in and they should have a copy of his insurance, ive just had to renew my details with them and quite right too. Id say kick him out if hes not insured, hes a disgrace to people who pay there ins, just like un insured drives, imagine he causes your boat to catch fire while hes working on another one, id doubt the marina would pay up, they would say hes trespassing and wave good bye to your claim.
 
nrbx said:
Port Solent have confirmed no propeller thefts in as long as they can remember.

And that he never signed in to do work thus proof of him having liability insurance is still AWOL as he refuses to supply that to me.

I'm well aware that someone could have tried to steal the prop, but there are quite a few facts making that a virtual zero chance....
Click to expand...

Letter Before Action and then sue his sorry transom off.
 
As the engineer didnt register or sign in at Port Solent reception and now refuses to supply you a copy of his Public Liability Insurance, it clearly shows the kind of character you are dealing with and unfortunately probably wont get a good result.
I totally agree with your arguement that propellors dont just fall off and suspect it was most likely down to a fitting error, but without any way of proving this will pretty much get you nowhere.
We all have to register and sign in at port solent everyday and can only urge boat owners to ask for a valid copy of insurance when using contractors to avoid this sort of thing happening again.

Best of luck. Rich
 
Update....

As you'd probably expect no response to emails or post still, so will have to think of alteranate ways forward...

Boat was lifted today to fit the new prop (Thank you teignbridge propellers for delivering to me 8 days after order!!).

However the most interesting bits were what we found with the remaining prop, which we can but assume must have been installed the same given the same person did it.

Old tab washer was installed, but the tab was not bent in place. The shaft also showed that the props had not gone up nearly as far as they were after being put back on properlly.

Most worrying though was that the remainig prop had also come loose, and the nut had slipped past the tab washer bend which was not done properly also. It was hand loose and we didn't need tools to remove it let alone a hydraulic puller. So i doubt if someone had tried to steal it they would have had much of a problem.

So thank you steve from Med marine services for the re-fit today, he suspects the key was too far up the shaft and the prop was riding on them given the markings.

Some pics :)

First picture after lifting
lift1.jpg

lift2.jpg

lift3.jpg

Tab washer removed from remaining prop
lift4.jpg

lift5.jpg


Failed to upload one of the nice new shiny prop, but might have to do that later :)
Took a video of the prop looseness too, but no idea how to put that up.
 
Just a quick note to say that I am amazed your insurance company wont pay up. Have you tried being a bit more forceful with them? I dare say there first response will always be to deny liability. I personally know two people who have been paid out for props falling off, one in a marina the other mid channel.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top