Price -v- value

[[70521]]

It is the usual quality, price and speed triangle. You can have two out of the three elements.

Accountants are well known to know the price of everything, but the value of nothing.

I tend to go against the grain, price is usually the last thing I look at. If I need a bit, for anything not just the boat, I look at what it needs to do and why I need it. In other words its value. Then look at the price.

I've spent most of the winter removing stuff from the boat that the last owner had added as there was little value on having them aboard.

 

[[70521]]

someone could pay the best carpenter top dollar to put chipboard on, just a thought...

I'd get a joiner to do that.

 

[johnphilip]

The way the world is going

I guess it would be only right of me to come clean with the reason for the post, in the past I have always worked to either BS or NMEA 0400 standard and only taken agencies from what I consider quality products with good factory training and back up. I have the opportunity to take on a considerably cheaper product that is just OK (ish) iin my view and am concerned that it would harm what little reputation I have, or doesn't anybody really care as long as it's cheap.

Unless you are in a very exclusive high end niche market it is dangerous for a business to ignore opportunities with new cheaper products. Look into the supplier a bit more, are they on the way up with an increasing market share or are they a flash in the pan? Are their existing rivals static and possibly declining in their development, marketing and sales?
Many businesses fail whilst hanging on to High Standards and prices while cheaper options close the quality gap over time and steal the market. How you judge whether the new agency is reasonable product or cheap rubbish is where your business sense must come in.

 

[NormanS]

Holy ***t

In this month's PBO, there's a piece about "Classic Kit" which features a Baby Blake toilet.
Prices are "from £4,178.96"
I thought, "surely not?" However on t'internet, I found the same thing at various prices, all the way up to £10,000.
As the toilet in my boat cost slightly less than £100, and performs exactly the same function, why would I not choose by price?

 

[chewi]

In this month's PBO, there's a piece about "Classic Kit" which features a Baby Blake toilet.
Prices are "from £4,178.96"
I thought, "surely not?" However on t'internet, I found the same thing at various prices, all the way up to £10,000.
As the toilet in my boat cost slightly less than £100, and performs exactly the same function, why would I not choose by price?

But the baby blake "classic" takes a better class of s..t!
So it must be VFM.

 

[Coaster]

In this month's PBO, there's a piece about "Classic Kit" which features a Baby Blake toilet.
Prices are "from £4,178.96"
I thought, "surely not?" However on t'internet, I found the same thing at various prices, all the way up to £10,000.
As the toilet in my boat cost slightly less than £100, and performs exactly the same function, why would I not choose by price?

Of course most people should take price into account.

However the Baby Blake example is a red herring. It's similar to saying that a new but dreadful car costs £6,000 whilst a new Bentley Mulsanne is £225,000, so the sensible thing is to buy the cheap vehicle.

It ignores the numerous alternatives.

The £100 bog would be better compared with ones at £150. £200, £250 etc. If they last much longer and work better the more expensive kit may be better value.

 

[Simondjuk]

To find out if you know the difference between price and value, go and have a look at the tyres on your car.

If they bear the name of one of the big, well known brands, you understand value.

If they bear a name which is unfamiliar or an attempt mimic one of the big brands, you understand only price.

 

[johnphilip]

To find out if you know the difference between price and value, go and have a look at the tyres on your car.

If they bear the name of one of the big, well known brands, you understand value.

If they bear a name which is unfamiliar or an attempt mimic one of the big brands, you understand only price.

Where do you have the evidence that smaller or less well publicised means lower quality and poor value for money?

 

[Simondjuk]

Relating to tyres specifically, have you ever experienced the gross inadequacy of budget brands? It's one area in which you truly get what you pay for. The same does not necessarily apply in all fields, but tyres illustrate graphically how some people fail to grasp the difference between price and value.

If you want evidence, Google up some tyre tests and compare the wet stopping distances. Most of the budget brands will put you in the back of that artic, or through that pushchair, when a quality tyre would have stopped you short. That sort of value is worth between 40% and 80% more on the price ticket, to my mind at least.

 

[LittleShip]

To find out if you know the difference between price and value, go and have a look at the tyres on your car.

If they bear the name of one of the big, well known brands, you understand value.

If they bear a name which is unfamiliar or an attempt mimic one of the big brands, you understand only price.

That's interesting point of view.....

Not disagreeing but some of the continental tyres these days are higher rated for breaking, economy and quietness than the most well know products.

Having just gone through the process of buying new tyres, I was surprised that "Black circles" seemed to be the only company that gave the information on their products.

I have used the same company for tyres for years and they never talked about anything but price, as if they were all the same just priced differently. Personally I like all the information on a product before I buy and like most here I then decide on the VFM.

Interesting thread this one, I use to sell a top end product and many times people would say they are getting 3 quotes and they would choose the middle one. I always offered a revisit to go through the quotes afterwards to help them choose and/or to discuss the differences. Most times my second visit got me the sale.

Peoples VFM is based on price in most cases and not the quality required.

Tom.

 

[dslittle]

You buy cheap, you buy twice.....and i've done that a few times! Quality is the key, finding the best quality product you can afford.

Some time ago I did not buy 115ml of Duralac from my local chandlers at £14.95 because I was able to buy 250ml of Duralac from eliseparts.com for £6.95.
Whilst I have always tried to support my local chandlery, i am not prepared to may inflated prices for goods that i can get elsewhere. I know thecarguments about size, rates availabilty etc but I really don't consider the Lotus Elise to be a mass produced product and therefore eliseparts cannot be compared to Halfords, B&Q etc so their buying power will not be much greater than my chandlery.
Identical quality at a quarter of the price - not marine!!!

 

[Simondjuk]

That's interesting point of view.....

Not disagreeing but some of the continental tyres these days are higher rated for breaking, economy and quietness than the most well know products.

Having just gone through the process of buying new tyres, I was surprised that "Black circles" seemed to be the only company that gave the information on their products.

I have used the same company for tyres for years and they never talked about anything but price, as if they were all the same just priced differently. Personally I like all the information on a product before I buy and like most here I then decide on the VFM.

Interesting thread this one, I use to sell a top end product and many times people would say they are getting 3 quotes and they would choose the middle one. I always offered a revisit to go through the quotes afterwards to help them choose and/or to discuss the differences. Most times my second visit got me the sale.

Peoples VFM is based on price in most cases and not the quality required.

Tom.

When you say continental, do you mean as in the brand, Continental, or made on the continent? If the brand, then I'd consider them a premium product anyway. Amongst the best in fact.

If you're referencing the location of manufacture, then there are many variables. There are good, bad and indifferent tyres made in the far east, for example. Some cost much more than others and yet offer better value nonetheless.

 

[knuterikt]

A question that I have often wanted to, but have, for years refrained from asking. Why is the question so often, (and not just on this forum) where can I get the cheapest product/job done? This makes me wonder what is the rationale behind this. Is it that people genuinely believe that all stuff/workmanship is broadly the same regardless of price, or are PBOers simply tightwads and price is the main motivator with quality, reliability or reputation coming a poor second. This is a genuine question and is not designed to start any kind of backlash, just that I really would like to know the answer. Is it that people think that cheap = value or historically people think that they have been poorly served at the higher end, assuming they have ever bought in that area and thus can speak from personal experience.

Most people have limited budgets, money saved give more money for other things.

People tend to have perceptions on quality based on (necessarily not in this order)
Own experience
Others experience
Marketing
Internet fora like this..

It's important to remember that people talk more about negative experiences than positive.
More customers create more publicity.

Based on my experience there is no correlation between price and quality (some exceptions linked to cost of materials and production methods).
In your OP you didn't distinguish between work and equipment.

Pricing of equipment is not based on quality- / production- / development- cost but what the manufacturer expect the customers to be willing to pay..

Paying someone to do a specific job there are lots of variables
Hourly pay, some plan and execute a job effectively some don't
Fixed price easier to compare - I prefer this.

I would never let price alone decide whom to buy from, but I think it's okay to ask a possible vendor why his/her offer is x £ higher/lower than the competitor.

I guess it would be only right of me to come clean with the reason for the post, in the past I have always worked to either BS or NMEA 0400 standard and only taken agencies from what I consider quality products with good factory training and back up. I have the opportunity to take on a considerably cheaper product that is just OK (ish) iin my view and am concerned that it would harm what little reputation I have, or doesn't anybody really care as long as it's cheap.

Sometimes the discussion will how good i good enough?

I like to deal with suppliers that represent more than one vendor if they can give me unbiased advice.

If I was selling and installing equipment, support from the supplier would be important.

 

[David2452]

If I was selling and installing equipment, support from the supplier would be important.

That is my major concern with the product, manufacturers support goes to my available customer support.

 

[knuterikt]

That is my major concern with the product, manufacturers support goes to my available customer support.

We are circling back to the real vs perceived quality of product & support.
Only way to know is to talk with other customers..

 

[Rigger Mortice]

Only way to know is to talk with other customers..

You certainly can't rely on that either. Somebody who has, for whatever reason, only ever had BMW's can't really give you an objective assessment if he has nothing to compare the marque with.

We see it time and time again on this forum. Somebody asks about a product and lot's of peeps pipe up with whatever it is that they own.

 

[Vara]

We see it time and time again on this forum. Somebody asks about a product and lot's of peeps pipe up with whatever it is that they own.

That is true but quite often a significant number will endorse a certain product which statistically makes more sense, some examples which spring to mind are the SH AIS and Plotter combination, the Nelson Spinflo cooker, there are more I'm sure.

 

[RAI]

Cheaper manufacture often leads the supposedly better quality products to lose their quality. Take blocks for example. I changed my main sheet fiddle blocks that had lasted 35 years by new ones from the same brand name. The new ones have UV damage and failing bearings after five years.
Spares support is important too, but how to know in advance. My top quality (most expensive) wind instruments are no longer supported by the manufacturer, which has new incompatible ones now, so spare parts = luck on eBay. I replaced them with mucho-cheapo-but-still-works stuff. I can still get spare parts for them too (eight years on).
After 30 years of stalwart service, my engine manufacturer decides to remove my model from his spare parts list. I do not buy his brand again but in another 35 years will I still get spare parts for the new one?
Maybe for the OP, transparency might help. dividing the estimate into parts and labour. The parts price can include alternative equipment at different prices and different support guarantees.

 

[blackbeard]

Slight variation on topic ...
I used to know of a lovely old classic yacht which was maintained as cheaply as possible; never an expensive job when a cheap solution might do. Last heard of in a very sad and unseaworthy condition. To bring her back from her present state would now take something well into six figures.
Another, similar, yacht was cared for rather better. It cost, of course (wooden boat!), but the cost was very carefully planned for. Still sailing and still giving delight.

Alternative plan. If the cost frightens you, get a smaller boat ...

 

[srah1953]

It reminds me of a clothing add which used Ellen mcArthur, who said that X clothes were by far the best and she never wore anything else. I always wondered how she knew they were the best if she never wore anything else............