Prestige 550 Flybridge

Hi Joachim,

Most people reference a boat to how they use it. What would help is if they have more information of how you will use it i.e. Med, Northern Europe and then how will it be used, family or couple and lastly how used, weekends, hollidays or retirement toy! Cheers

Paul
 
Well, I will keep it in SoF at my place in Port Vauban. Classical couple use for holidays and the occasional long weekend. Essentially I'm just comparing the 550 Prestige with the new Princess 56 and what I'm really after is some info how the build quality and the general arrangement of the Prestige stands up to real life use.
Joachim
 
Hi Joachim,

I am have this exact same model being built now for delivery to Canet-en-Roussillon at the end of May. I can give you no feedback yet on fuel consumption or performance, but I can give you the reasons why I chose this make and model above the Princess 56.

In my opinion there is no doubt that the build finish and materials used on the Princess are of a definitely higher quality than those found on the Prestige, and indeed I have stated directly to the senior Prestige management that they need to up their game in that area if they want to make further inroads into the luxury high-end market. But ultimately on that point I decided that - from my perspective - it was like buying a top of the range Ford against an Audi/Mercedes... ultimately they are all just cars that get from A to B in a similar fashion. And already at the top end of my budget, that the 25% additional cost of the Princess did not overcome the other substantial plus points of the Prestige against the Princess. The main ones being the exterior styling, the design and layout of the internal spaces, and the pod drives. Aesthetically I love the look of the 550 which I find very contemporary, not a design that will seem dated anytime soon. Whereas the Princess I found a little more conservative and one which could perhaps seem yesterday's design in a few years time. I also really preferred the Prestige owner's cabin, with its separate entrance, walk-in wardrobe, shower etc. And I loved the saloon area, with its vast windows. My wife and I both felt that this was a boat that we would really enjoy living on. Finally, as a beginner to sailing, the clincher was the extra control that the pod drive's seem to offer.

Whether or not this boat will age as well as the Princess, with the wear and tear of usage, we will find out over the years to come!

Mark
 
Joachim said:
I'm considering buying this boat. Who can share experiences regarding quality, fuel consumption and overall performance?
Thanks
Joachim
Click to expand...
Joachim
There are many great things with the Prestige range imho, especially the feeling of space, the use of glass, and the exterior looks. But the internal furniture cabinet work is pretty poor, and you have to decide whether you want Ford or Mercedes, as MAFWeiss said

However I would look VERY carefully at the GRP hull construction before buying one. I have seen with my own eyes a recent build Jeanneau of approx 40feet that suffered some problems. A piece of hull was removed between keel and chine. I, and the very experienced shipwrights working on the boat, were all astonished to see how the hull is built. The hull is cored, and the laminate thicknesses either side of the core were thin. Even if the core had been executed perfectly the two laminates were too thin for me to be comfortale with the boat, but alas the coring was not done correctly. The adhesive (brick red colour) appeared to have been applied to the inside of the hull with a trowel with grooves in it, and the "ridges" of adhesive formed by the trowel were perfectly shaped in many places, ie the core had never touched them, let alone bonded to them. That is a cardinal sin in my book and lots of other peoples' books, and makes you think "yoghurt pot". Therefore I urge you to consider the hull construction very carefully and decide if you are happy with it, before you buy. I have no axe to grind and I actually quite like the design of this range of boats, but I'm reporting here what I've seen with my own eyes. The mercedes/Ford analogy ceases to work here I think becuase there is imho no point in cutting cost to the point where you have a yoghurt pot

So I'd much prefer the Princess 56 out of those two. The Princess will have a nicely moulded hull without coring in the bottom, which costs more I'm afraid :). Maybe see you around in Antibes. I've been on Mole Sud 10 years. New boat arriving there in June
 
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Jeanneau hulls

jfm said:
The hull is cored, and the laminate thicknesses either side of the core were thin. Even if the core had been executed perfectly the two laminates were too thin for me to be comfortale with the boat, but alas the coring was not done correctly. The adhesive (brick red colour) appeared to have been applied to the inside of the hull with a trowel with grooves in it, and the "ridges" of adhesive formed by the trowel were perfectly shaped in many places, ie the core had never touched them, let alone bonded to them.
Click to expand...

I came accross an interesting investigation report about an incident with a new Prestige 42S which drives collided with a shoal in May 2010. The IPS500, didn't fell off but ruptured the transom and the boat sank in roughly 12 minutes. The report states (pics on p. 13) that the thickness of the transom was 8mm. (1.5mm. fiberglass + 5mm. core + 1.5mm. fiberglass): http://www.turvallisuustutkinta.fi/...tion&ssbinary=true&blobheader=application/pdf

Overall, the investigators don't mince their words about the causes of the incident:
"The drive unit did not break off in a controlled way so that the hull of the boat would have remained watertight, but instead the impact caused by the collision broke the weakly-constructed hull of the boat."

"The construction of Jeanneau Prestige 42S was found to be weak at the joint between the transom and the bottom, and the joint of the IPS drive unit and hull carelessly and poorly completed"

This also raises interesting questions whether such drives are really designed to "fell off" in case of a grounding? The report mentions another incident with similar IPS issues, while Volvo Penta in its statement at the end of the report says it works "in most cases of grounding"...
 
Hardmy said:
I came accross an interesting investigation report about an incident with a new Prestige 42S which drives collided with a shoal in May 2010. The IPS500, didn't fell off but ruptured the transom and the boat sank in roughly 12 minutes. The report states (pics on p. 13) that the thickness of the transom was 8mm. (1.5mm. fiberglass + 5mm. core + 1.5mm. fiberglass): http://www.turvallisuustutkinta.fi/...tion&ssbinary=true&blobheader=application/pdf

Overall, the investigators don't mince their words about the causes of the incident:
"The drive unit did not break off in a controlled way so that the hull of the boat would have remained watertight, but instead the impact caused by the collision broke the weakly-constructed hull of the boat."

"The construction of Jeanneau Prestige 42S was found to be weak at the joint between the transom and the bottom, and the joint of the IPS drive unit and hull carelessly and poorly completed"

This also raises interesting questions whether such drives are really designed to "fell off" in case of a grounding? The report mentions another incident with similar IPS issues, while Volvo Penta in its statement at the end of the report says it works "in most cases of grounding"...
Click to expand...

I've only just picked upon this thread as any post with jfm contribution is well worth a read.

There is I think a 550 here in swanwick on I p s drives what I will say is that the questionable construction isn't in my opinion just on the French built yard boats I'd say we have it closer to the uk too.

I'm still not sure that I'd be happy with an I p s boat of any make if I had to factor in the day when I'm going to ground it or hit a submersed object that's going to either render the boat unusable or worse it sinks fast!!

Quite how volvos design for it to shear off in order to save the boat from sinking was ever conceived to be a safe bet, when there now blaming the builders for the thin layup around the I p s pod, I suppose its there clause get out when the worst happens with the loss of life, and quite frankly I wonder how this action will stack up with the owners insurers.

The checked and the egg situation would come into force in any claim, as boat builders going to quote there hull is correct layup and strength , Volvo would say pod didn't shear as hull wasn't strong enough to make it shear.

Buy the princess!!!!

My buyer, have you looked at reliability issues, search on here for it, have you also factored high end extra service costs over a shaft drive boat? And who can do it in Antibes, I've just had a week out there servicing two boats, lovely!!
 
The report linked to by Hardmy makes worrying reading. I don't want to rain on parades and realise there are several Jeanneau owners on here. However, I have seen and touched in last 6 months two separate jeanneau motorboat hulls (in 30-40 foot range) cut apart on the underside between keel and chine and was pretty disturbed by the quality I saw. In one case as explained above the coring was not bonded correctly and in both cases the laminate was what you could colloquially describe as yoghurt pot thin. This Finnish report reveals various shortcomings: figures 5/27/28 show glued on stringers not integrated to the glass/resin matrix; figure 14 shows poor hull lamination; figure 15 makes me concerned about pooled resin with too little glass.

The tech guy from Jeanneau says in his rebuttal letter that the sunken Prestige 42 complies with all regulations, and I'm not saying these hulls don't. He might even think figures 5/14/27/28 are ok for all I know. All I'm saying is that these hulls (and it may be a subset of Jeanneau's hulls, not all of them; they have several factories) seem not to be built to good quality standards such as you would find on many other mainstream brands. This is quite a pity: I was close to buying a Prestige 60 a while back and I like a lot of their clever design features very much, but I now wonder if I might have had a lucky escape. I think it would be good to research further and find out if there is a particular Jeanneau series or factory that is associated with "figures 5/27/28" hulls and then you only need to avoid those ones not others. Unless OP gets that info and it turns out ok, OP would be very well advised to concentrate on the Princess 56 imho
 
The report, together with JFMs experience, will cause me to cross Jeanneau off my list. Their reply in particular is not confidence inspiring. Also crossed off IPS!

Of course hitting a reef at 24 knots could sink any boat!

I found the discussion of the design of looking out from inside a postbox interesting. Too many modern boats have very restricted views from the inside steering position through highly sloped tinted glass.
 
Whitelighter said:
I was going to ask:

If you hit a reef with a shaft drive boat, it's still going to rip the shafts out and punch the p brackets through the hull with the same end result no?
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Oh yes, it may well do. But that isn't the point: my comments are about the jeanneau GRP quality generally in the 2 boats I saw, and in the Finland sunk boat, and i think that quality will cause problems even if you don't smash into a rock as hard as Mr Finland did, or at all. Hence I'm suggesting to OP he gets the princess 56 out of the two boats he listed. All imho

On both the boats i looked at there was water inside the hull including between the coring at the laminate that the coring was meant to be bonded to, and this was sloshing about causing high moisture readings and a dampish boat but there was no way to drain it.

I would expect there is (a) a level of smashing/grounding that these hulls can withstand; (b) a level of smashing/grounding that would sink any boat; but most importantly (c) a wide band of smashing/grounding intensity that would sink these boats but not an equivalent sized PrinFairSeekFerrettiWindy et al
 
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Scary stuff indeed. But fwiw, this Princess sank for the very reason whitelighter describes and was only doing five knots at the time of grounding -> http://venenetti.fi/uutiset/helsingin-hovioikeus-selanteen-veneen-karilleajo-oli-rikos

Though it did take a bit longer to sink giving the skipper enough time to beach the boat.

Edit: only now read the paper. Adding it to John's findings paints a pretty bleak picture of their quality indeed. Amazing.
 
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Whitelighter said:
I was going to ask:

If you hit a reef with a shaft drive boat, it's still going to rip the shafts out and punch the p brackets through the hull with the same end result no?
Click to expand...
Kieron, the degree of protrusion with an IPS is significantly more than that of a shaft drive, so the risk level increases as a consequence.
 
MAFWeiss said:
Hi Joachim,

I am have this exact same model being built now for delivery to Canet-en-Roussillon at the end of May. I can give you no feedback yet on fuel consumption or performance, but I can give you the reasons why I chose this make and model above the Princess 56.

In my opinion there is no doubt that the build finish and materials used on the Princess are of a definitely higher quality than those found on the Prestige, and indeed I have stated directly to the senior Prestige management that they need to up their game in that area if they want to make further inroads into the luxury high-end market. But ultimately on that point I decided that - from my perspective - it was like buying a top of the range Ford against an Audi/Mercedes... ultimately they are all just cars that get from A to B in a similar fashion. And already at the top end of my budget, that the 25% additional cost of the Princess did not overcome the other substantial plus points of the Prestige against the Princess. The main ones being the exterior styling, the design and layout of the internal spaces, and the pod drives. Aesthetically I love the look of the 550 which I find very contemporary, not a design that will seem dated anytime soon. Whereas the Princess I found a little more conservative and one which could perhaps seem yesterday's design in a few years time. I also really preferred the Prestige owner's cabin, with its separate entrance, walk-in wardrobe, shower etc. And I loved the saloon area, with its vast windows. My wife and I both felt that this was a boat that we would really enjoy living on. Finally, as a beginner to sailing, the clincher was the extra control that the pod drive's seem to offer.

Whether or not this boat will age as well as the Princess, with the wear and tear of usage, we will find out over the years to come!

Mark
Click to expand...
Great post. I think it shows the maze that people consider on buying a boat.
JFM, I take your concern totally.. I would never buy one of these French yard boats after walking across the flexing saloon floor at a boat show, never mind the hull construction, but that is each to his own. I guess in most circumstances , it isnt going to sink.
I cant put my hand up to vast atlantic boat destroying waves, but in the occasional stupid spots I have found myself in, at least I didnt have to worry about the boat. I dont know how you price that in your considerations.
 
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