Pre brexit concern...should I apply for residence certificate now.

[Portofino]

The problem is that UK citizens will soon be what Schengen calls third country nationals and will most likely face the restriction of maximum 90 days in any 180 in all of Schengen. I believe that is what OP is trying to avoid. Switzerland is not a Schengen member but I believe the same rules apply since they have an agreement with Schengen.

CH has not allways been Schengen . Our permit predates this .

And they have had a history of pick n mix .

But nether the less - re over 90 days ( or what ever ) -is that not usual just a visa ,or visa extension issue anyhow ?
Aside as there’s loads of EU in the U.K. - Ok mostly working ( eg some 400;000 Fr in London alone ) there talk of leaving parts of the citizens rights as they are ?
I just can,t see even in a hard in terms of trade Exit , leading to tit for tat , chucking out “ economic contributors “ .
Sure more admin - eventually in the main EU .
Anyways as said ^^^^ wait n see

 

[lindsay]

In the meantime those who have the opportunity can see about getting legally a second country passport. Those born in Northern Ireland have it made. Others may trawl through the immigration status of spouse, parents or grandparents. That might provide some mix n match openings in whatever is decided in three years time.??......or whenever

 

[Tranona]

The problem is that UK citizens will soon be what Schengen calls third country nationals and will most likely face the restriction of maximum 90 days in any 180 in all of Schengen. I believe that is what OP is trying to avoid. Switzerland is not a Schengen member but I believe the same rules apply since they have an agreement with Schengen.

Do you have a source for this? or is it the usual speculation that surrounds this subject. AFAIK there has never been any proposals that this will be the case. The only idea that has been floated is a possible on line travel visa system - but no talk of any time restrictions.

 

[Artic Warrior]

But to be honest all info around my question asked is welcome info for sure

 

[RobbieW]

Do you have a source for this? or is it the usual speculation that surrounds this subject. AFAIK there has never been any proposals that this will be the case. The only idea that has been floated is a possible on line travel visa system - but no talk of any time restrictions.

If what you're questioning is the 90 in 180 then thats the default Schengen position for third country nationals, as a Google search will confirm. If you're questioning the application of that rule to UK nationals then, yes it is supposition - but likely in the case of a no-deal brexit.

 

[GrahamM376]

But to be honest all info around my question asked is welcome info for sure

One important point often not researched enough is health care away from UK. Once "elderly", private medical policies become exorbitant and available free treatment with EHIC varies. I'm registered with a Dr. near Lisbon but if I visit a health centre in Faro, which the system allows, I'm told to go to emergency and wait 20 hours or more for non urgent. There are private clinics where X ray, endoscopy etc. only cost around €80 and Drs. charges around €50 so it won't break the bank. However, although treatment expertise is good in State hospitals, they're overcrowded, short of staff and money. Think UK problems x 10. Don't even think about State geriatric care here when the time comes, stay in the UK system.

 

[macd]

If what you're questioning is the 90 in 180 then thats the default Schengen position for third country nationals, as a Google search will confirm. If you're questioning the application of that rule to UK nationals then, yes it is supposition - but likely in the case of a no-deal brexit.

It certainly seems to be the worst-case fear, without which the OP would probably not have begun this thread. As suggested previously, all the indications are that there is little point seeking a 'residency' remedy to that just yet, and no harm keeping a watching brief.
(Other suggested remedies, such as Irish passports...no reason not to start that ball rolling now. Anyone have an Irish grandparent willing to adopt a 68 year old...?)

 

[Artic Warrior]

Mmm my thoughts too regarding health care.
I'm away 11 months a year Asia and Greece and have had to go private lately but affordable in greece and Asia luckily

 

[jordanbasset]

If what you're questioning is the 90 in 180 then thats the default Schengen position for third country nationals, as a Google search will confirm. If you're questioning the application of that rule to UK nationals then, yes it is supposition - but likely in the case of a no-deal brexit.

Correct, if we crash out with no deal that is very likely to be the situation. But even if we get a deal I seriously doubt this will be on the top of the negotiating list of concerns for either party.
I can see some agreement for people already resident in the E.U. or the UK, but for those of us who spend 6 months or so at a time in a E.U. country such as Greece without being resident I doubt there will be any deal. In the big scheme of things the few hundred, maybe a few thousand of us we will not be important enough to worry about so I do suspect we will revert to the default position of being allowed in for 90 days in any 180

 

[Artic Warrior]

I've got an Irish surname so I'm half way there

 

[Tranona]

Correct, if we crash out with no deal that is very likely to be the situation. But even if we get a deal I seriously doubt this will be on the top of the negotiating list of concerns for either party.
I can see some agreement for people already resident in the E.U. or the UK, but for those of us who spend 6 months or so at a time in a E.U. country such as Greece without being resident I doubt there will be any deal. In the big scheme of things the few hundred, maybe a few thousand of us we will not be important enough to worry about so I do suspect we will revert to the default position of being allowed in for 90 days in any 180

It is not a trivial issue and the EU is likely to want much more generous terms for its own citizens and the tourist industry across the EU are unlikely to be happy about such restrictions.

Movement of people is the one area where despite all the wrangling, reciprocity is still the principle - and the EU is far more interested in getting the best deal for its citizens given that there are near 3 times as many of them in the UK (and still coming at the rate of 100000 a year) as there are UK citizens in the EU. Add to that the imbalance of volumes of travellers in favour of the EU then the logistical and economic impact of restrictions would fall on the EU.

 

[jordanbasset]

It is not a trivial issue and the EU is likely to want much more generous terms for its own citizens and the tourist industry across the EU are unlikely to be happy about such restrictions.

Movement of people is the one area where despite all the wrangling, reciprocity is still the principle - and the EU is far more interested in getting the best deal for its citizens given that there are near 3 times as many of them in the UK (and still coming at the rate of 100000 a year) as there are UK citizens in the EU. Add to that the imbalance of volumes of travellers in favour of the EU then the logistical and economic impact of restrictions would fall on the EU.

Oh I am sure the E.U. would like freedom of movement to continue but I really cannot see the current UK Government going for it. As I say I think for those already here or in another E.U. country come Brexit day they will keep the freedom to live and work where they are. For those of us that come and go over the year for a few months here and there I doubt we will be accomodated, as I doubt the UK would reciprocate. But I hope I am wrong and you are right and the UK Government does continue to sign up to freedom of movement post Brexit
As for tourism most is for a few weeks at a time and so will not be affected as people will still be allowed 90 days in any 180.

But getting back to the OP I agree with others who are saying do not do anything for a while, wait a few months to see what is actually agreed.

 

[macd]

I've got an Irish surname so I'm half way there

...and if your forum name's anything to go by, you'll be familiar with tales of sitting for days at borders waiting for your carnet to be processed. Oh, joy! :ambivalence:

 

[Tranona]

Oh I am sure the E.U. would like freedom of movement to continue but I really cannot see the current UK Government going for it. As I say I think for those already here or in another E.U. country come Brexit day they will keep the freedom to live and work where they are. For those of us that come and go over the year for a few months here and there I doubt we will be accomodated, as I doubt the UK would reciprocate. But I hope I am wrong and you are right and the UK Government does continue to sign up to freedom of movement post Brexit
As for tourism most is for a few weeks at a time and so will not be affected as people will still be allowed 90 days in any 180.

But getting back to the OP I agree with others who are saying do not do anything for a while, wait a few months to see what is actually agreed.

I can't see any reason why the two "freedoms" have to be directly linked. The UK is already proposing a registration scheme for those who want the freedom to work and live in the UK. The key thing is not freedom per se but the rights of different categories of people. It is inevitable that these will be created - the challenge will be how to monitor an control.

Once you have established the principle of different categories it is not difficult to establish a category of "visitor" with a permit or visa that allows (or prohibits) specific activities and sets time frames that need not be the same as the blanket third country rules that currently exist.

 

[Portofino]

I can't see any reason why the two "freedoms" have to be directly linked. The UK is already proposing a registration scheme for those who want the freedom to work and live in the UK. The key thing is not freedom per se but the rights of different categories of people. It is inevitable that these will be created - the challenge will be how to monitor an control.

Once you have established the principle of different categories it is not difficult to establish a category of "visitor" with a permit or visa that allows (or prohibits) specific activities and sets time frames that need not be the same as the blanket third country rules that currently exist.

Yup that’s exactly my view of how the landscape will evolve .

Just hark back to imagery @ time of the Brexit referendum, the overcrowded dingys the overwhelmed Italian and Turkish authorities, the Mrs Merkel - 1 million invite for these refugees , the fencing off at the Hungarian border etc, etc
The camps at Calais etc .

It’s that call it “ border control “ and “ movement control “ that we want back .
If there’s a farmer in Boston having problems recruiting sprout pickers in December and a load of East EU guys can be shipped in to do the work then fine , - as long as they don,t have the freedom to stay in the U.K. after the 1 month or so temp work is finished, bring in there families, fall on state benefits, state schools , out NHS etc etc .
Similiar is the refugee arriving in Lampudosa (sp?) Italy ( or any other African border ) from central Africa - then after being granted refugee status by IT, —- relocating under the EU freedom of movement laws to the U.K. .

Of course a French or German Banker can come and work in the city either in the same Co @ the U.K. branch or simply accept a job @ say RBS - this guy is of economic benefit .
If he / she settles then after say a period of time we the U.K. think fit - not Brussels we may consider granting or not full or partial citizenship. If he / she requests ?

That’s the point - we write ,and if necessary re-write the immigration rules as we go along retaining full sovereignty of our borders .
Mark Carney a Canadian none EU ( assume we have some sort of treaty with Canada? Re immigrants) - is working happily in London .
Hopefully we will make our own rules / policies that we think fit as we go along .
His wife is in London too .
Suspect he’s left alone to go about his normal business - while he is in gainfull employment .
Of course should he fall off his bike and sprain a wrist in London the full force of our NHS and other emergency services will fix him up .
Same for the 400;000 French living in London .
Agree I envisage some form of visa / registration—- as I said more admin .

 

[rivonia]

We took out residency in CYPRUS. We have now all the documents. We have registered under the CYPRUS Tax system. This means at presnt I pay zero tax. It means we can travel freely in all Europe and being a british passport holder also the UK. Not bad eh. So my advice would be to go for it.

 

[RAI]

This has some relevance to the current discussion about the future UK/EU mobility relationship.
https://ec.europa.eu/commission/sit...ity-future-relationship_21february2018_en.pdf

 

[BrianH]

The problem is that UK citizens will soon be what Schengen calls third country nationals and will most likely face the restriction of maximum 90 days in any 180 in all of Schengen. I believe that is what OP is trying to avoid. Switzerland is not a Schengen member but I believe the same rules apply since they have an agreement with Schengen.

Forgive my pedantry but perhaps you meant that Switzerland is not a EU member rather than Schengen member, which, of course, it is, becoming a full member in 2009.

Along with three other non-EU but EFTA member states, (Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway), Schengen is not a purely EU institution as those four have agreements to allow full association, permitting unrestricted travel between any and all signatory states.

.

 

[Artic Warrior]

...and if your forum name's anything to go by, you'll be familiar with tales of sitting for days at borders waiting for your carnet to be processed. Oh, joy! :ambivalence:

.... an artic warrior stuck in the Greek sunshine hee hee

 

[RAI]

My advice is get an address and apply for residency, some where in the EU27, while it is easy to get. You can always move away again. Post Brexit, things will be different and not likely better, from a mobility point of view.