Portable A/Cs again!!

[pcatterall]

I know its been done to death but we are more or less static for the rest of the season and with shore power.
I have a space for one of these portable devices and a route to get the hot air out. The cabin is around 12cubic m so I thought one of the smaller ones would do.
I see that dehumidifiers are also popular here by the med, is it worth considering one instead of the A/C? just getting the humidity down would be a bonus.
Any one used either?

 

[rob2]

In essence they're the same thing, just on a different scale. A dehumidifier certainly can make life more comfortable and can be combined with other ways of cooling the boat: rigging an awning and wetting the decks for example. An A/C unit is likely to be a bit noisy within the confined space of the cabin, but with a mains powered unit yo should be able to chill beers in there! Just think of the A/C in your car set on cold or used with heat for the comparison.

Rob.

 

[nigelmercier]

In essence they're the same thing, just on a different scale. A dehumidifier certainly can make life more comfortable and can be combined with other ways of cooling the boat...

Not all dehumidifiers blow cold air, the one on my boat blows hot.

I'm also considering a portable A/C unit, but must have a built-in dehumidifier function as it will be replacing my dehumidifier.

I've got a 7,000 BTU unit in my office at home, the room is about 15m² and 2m high. The A/C unit really struggles on a hot day, even with the reflective blinds closed, and this is in the UK! It is better to have a unit that can easily cope, so it isn't running at full whack the whole time. On a hot day you may want to cool by as much as 20°, so consider what size heater you would need to raise the temperature by this much.

I rather like the specification of the Amcor SF12000E 12000 BTU Slimline (3.5KW of cooling, 5A power draw), they also do a 10000 BTU model:

http://www.amcorstyle.com/product.php?cid=1&subcid=2&pid=7

10,000 BTU: http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00CPMVOS8/dolcetto-21
12,000 BTU: http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/B00CRW9WAS/dolcetto-21

 

[BrianH]

I make regular sorties out of my home marina in the Adriatic and when away in anchorages close to sea breezes have little problem. However, this year I am much longer in my marina that is some distance inland (Italian lagoons) and cabin temperatures have been nudging 40°C at times. When this is coupled with windless conditions it becomes untenable and sleeping practically impossible, especially as the resident mosquito population requires screens, further limiting air flow - if any.

With un-metered shore power a portable AC unit seemed logical but they are all too massive for a 31' boat. The local Carrefour has the smallest at 64cm x 43cm x 29cm and reasonably priced at €219 but it's still a large lump to have stuck in a compact living space.

Evaporator systems seem smaller and lighter but the local experts say they are useless in this area of high humidity and no one stocks them... I'm not convinced as the result could hardly be worse. So still looking.

 

[nigelmercier]

Evaporator systems seem smaller and lighter but the local experts say they are useless in this area of high humidity and no one stocks them... I'm not convinced as the result could hardly be worse. So still looking.

Evaporator systems are no better than a fan directed at damp skin, and they can cause huge problems with condensation.

 

[BrianH]

Evaporator systems are no better than a fan directed at damp skin, and they can cause huge problems with condensation.

You must be right, it's what the locals tell me. But "a fan directed at damp skin" is what I'm using now and it's better than nothing. And condensation was never a problem here with the normal temperatures; it would only be turned on occasionally.

So perhaps I'll keep looking for that really compact AC unit instead. If I don't find one I can always go home - it's what I usually do for August when it gets consistently too hot and too crowded everywhere.

Thanks for your input.

 

[pcatterall]

Yes Barnacle, same dilema here. I used evaporator systems in Saudi with excellent results but they were hopless in Nigeria!!
I gues we are somewhere in between! They are doing evaporators in Mr Briccolage, they blurb claims 10 degrees reduction on external temps which would be fine if this is acheived. Much less power needed of course and easier to site as venting not an issue.

 

[BrianH]

Yes Barnacle, same dilema here. I used evaporator systems in Saudi with excellent results but they were hopless in Nigeria!!
I gues we are somewhere in between! They are doing evaporators in Mr Briccolage, they blurb claims 10 degrees reduction on external temps which would be fine if this is acheived. Much less power needed of course and easier to site as venting not an issue.

If cheap enough I'd give it a go. Maybe a cooler sauna is more comfortable than a drier but hotter sauna

Interesting that Mr Briccolage has outlets not only in France but also in such places as Andorra, Serbia and Macedonia - but not Italy.

Your comments will be valued whatever you do decide to get.

 

[pcatterall]

Went out and bought the 9000BTU ac from mr b this morning. It has made the saloon habitable all day and when the sun disapeared I opened up through to the fwd berths which are now nice and cool for bed time.
It was about 35 outside today and the cooler got it down quickly to 28 but then sort of got stuck until the sun went, it then cooled the inside down quickly to 25
( though it remained at 33 outside for a long time)
Those few degrees dont sound much but it feels much better than that I s'pose because the air is circulating all round giving a breeze feeling.
I have fitted the unit where the steps in the companion way are. ( had to rejig the steps) venting is back into the engine compartment and then out.
The air flows along the passage between the galley and 'dinette' so when the door to teh heads/fwd cabin.
is open it can be directed down there.
The louvres have to direct the air up towards the roof so it can cool the air up there first then work its way down!!
Saloon is only 2x3x2meters so maybee 1200btu would have more bite.
Any way, its in it works and it is a big imrovement!!

 

[nigelmercier]

Went out and bought the 9000BTU ac from mr b this morning.

Out of interest, what model and cost?

 

[ccscott49]

HFL in germany do a proper job portable AC, with a pump and sea water cooling, I have one and its an excellent bit of kit, have a google fpor them. Dunno how much they cost however as I bought mine second hand, for 200 euros.

 

[William_H]

I am pleased to hear that UK finally has a heat wave. I wish all my UK forum frinds good sailing and long live the heatwave.
Re Aircon here in Oz we seldom see A/C in boats except the big mobos. We don't see so much living on boats and it is simpler to stay at home when it is too hot cos there is always plenty of good sailing weather. Here in summer it is very seldome we don't get a cooling sea breeze by lunch time.
However A/c is definitely the go at home. I have double brick house which after a few days of 35+ temps gets quite heat soaked.
Aircons come in the window rattler style one unit, half in and half outside in a wall cut out or window. These are falling out of favour to the split unit type. Here a relatively small wall unit is plumbed to a large compressor unit outside. These commonly come in reverse cycle (heating mode). They do require a refrig expert to evacuate the system after plumbing in so are hardly portable.
A last kind though rare is the portable compressor type where the 2 units are connected bya flexible conduit (gas in, gas out, out electrics)
You need to pass one unit through a window then seal the window with the conduit still in place. All split untis are vastly quieter (inside) than the single unit types. As they seem to be all made in China they should be available in UK.
NB the evaporative type are no good where there is humidity and it is always humid by the sea so probably not successful though very convenient. good luck olewill

 

[BrianH]

HFL in germany do a proper job portable AC, with a pump and sea water cooling, I have one and its an excellent bit of kit, have a google fpor them. Dunno how much they cost however as I bought mine second hand, for 200 euros.

That looks interesting, especially the dimensions, although at 25kg a bit heavy. Difficult to find pricing, everyone is very cagy and require contacting, which implies expensive and certainly nothing like €200 - lucky you.

 

[BrianH]

I have fitted the unit where the steps in the companion way are. ( had to rejig the steps) venting is back into the engine compartment and then out.

That's a great solution and it had me measuring up my companionway steps and space behind them. It would be interesting to know what the dimensions of your unit are.

 

[MASH]

It was pointed out to me by a heating engineer that these portable systems are considerably less effective than the traditional "split" system (with a remote heat exchanger) because they use the air in the space they've just cooled to run through the heat exchanger and vent it outside, thus sucking an equal volume of hot air in from outside to replace it - which then has to be cooled...
Thus the cooling ability between a split system and a portable cannot be judged by comparing BTUs as they work in such a different manner.

The watercooled German system alluded to above sounds like a split system and I expect would be a great deal more effective.

I have a portable at home and it is very heavy and bulky. I can't imagine it being suitable for any normal sized yacht, just too cumbersome.

 

[pcatterall]

The portable in question came from Carrefour not mr bricolage as I reported. Cost was 199 euros with a 2 year gaurentee.
Dimensions 33 wide 43 deep and 80 high (cm) wieghs 25 kg. Hot air pipe supplied 15cm diameter.
Its 38 outside and 28 inside. It seems to be a Carrefour special as the only name on it is 'Home'. It has a remote and a timer so I can switch it off after my usuall night time read!!
I was using awnings and did find that they kept the cabins cooler longer into the day. After mid day the temps had equalised and then it became better to sit out under the awnings. In the evenings although the temps were little different in or out it was far more pleasant outside, even with fans below it was fresher outside.
I am now investigating better deck and cabin side insulation to make the ac more effective.
I believe that I can make the unit secure enough to sail with it in place......25kg loose on wheels could be a bit of a liability!!
I would still consider a proper built in unit but this has been a cheap and chearful solution so we can enjoy this summer

 

[Bobobolinsky]

In the tropics, I had a window type on the deck, and got the local canopy maker to make a canvas duct to connect to the hatch.
Here I have been given R2D2, which takes up a lot of space below, but I'll put up with it for the comfort.
Work in a chilled distribution depot, so it's 2-3 degrees n there continually

 

[BrianH]

The portable in question came from Carrefour not mr bricolage as I reported. Cost was 199 euros with a 2 year gaurentee.
Dimensions 33 wide 43 deep and 80 high (cm) wieghs 25 kg. Hot air pipe supplied 15cm diameter.

Thanks for the informative update. That looks similar to the one I referred to in my post #4; it too was badged as 'Carrefour Home' but the dimensions are not the same, particularly the height, which seems excessive, and the weight is 2.5 kg more - "The local Carrefour has the smallest at 64cm x 43cm x 29cm and reasonably priced at €219".

As the cabin temperature is now a mere 34°C and quite supportable at the moment with a little wind, plus my plan is to stay only another two weeks before going home before the really hot and crowded August starts, I'll keep looking for something more suitable for next year.

In the evenings although the temps were little different in or out it was far more pleasant outside, even with fans below it was fresher outside.

Here too, but I prefer not to get devoured by the mosquitos that infest the Italian lagoons and sally forth at dusk. One can use repellents but they are not infallible - as well as being repellent to me too.