Polish registration?

[Poignard]

Not necessarily so... Even a boat that is owned and crewed by an EU National if physically removed from the EU becomes vat due again after 3 or 4 years of absence.

Not sure anyone knows exactly how a boat that is owned by someone that is a resident of a country that leaves the EU stands ..

I suspect the uk and all of its citizens' assets become non eu assets. With dispensations for those with residential status in EU countries.

Then you have the issue of eu residents using non eu vessels in countries where they do not have residential status.

It is a mess, and I suspect unless you are really a citizen of an EU country, absent a deal you will be dealt with in the the same manner as US citizens and their boats are dealt with now.

If the boat is registered in an EU Member State what is to prevent it remaining there? Even though it's owner may be limited as to how many days a year he is allowed to visit, under what law can he be compelled to remove it?

Suppose, for example, I took a caravan to France, left it in a campsite after paying the dues and came home for as long as I liked, or had to, what is to prevent its remaining until I returned ?

 

[Poignard]

[..]

Not sure anyone knows exactly how a boat that is owned by someone that is a resident of a country that leaves the EU stands ..

I suspect the uk and all of its citizens' assets become non eu assets. With dispensations for those with residential status in EU countries.

Then you have the issue of eu residents using non eu vessels in countries where they do not have residential status.

It is a mess, and I suspect unless you are really a citizen of an EU country, absent a deal you will be dealt with in the the same manner as US citizens and their boats are dealt with now.

 

[Irish Rover]

But registration makes no difference to that at all. My boat is EU VAT paid and will remain so as it is in the EU zone on transition day and will remain EU VAT paid forever under SSR. Or Polish or US or any recognised nation‘s registration in the world.

Absolutely correct and I'm only quoting your post to re-emphasise the point you've made. Neither the registration state/flag of a boat or the nationality/citizenship of its owner has anything to do with the VAT status of the boat.
If the boat is sold outside the EU it will lose its VAT paid status.
If the boat leaves the EU for more than 3 years it MAY lose its VAT paid status.
If the boat is flying a non EU flag it would be advisable to have your papers to hand proving its VAT paid status and the boat's physical presence in the EU on 01/01/21.
I simply cannot see why the owner of a UK registered boat in the EU would be bothered going to all the trouble and expense of moving to the Polish, Belgian, Irish or any other register. The SSR is such an excellent scheme for leisure boats and other countries do not have streamlined, online systems like OFCOM for registering your VHF, AIS, EPIRB etc. Try getting a ships radio licence in Ireland and see what I mean.

 

[Lomax]

Sorry for jumping in, but it sounds like you guys might be able to help! What will happen to the "EU VAT paid" status of my boat if it isn't in EU waters on 31/12? I am an EU national resident in the UK. I plan to take my boat across to live on the European canals, but it's all been delayed because, yeah, bloody Covid. I would not be able to afford paying the VAT. Could getting my boat registered in an EU country before 31/12 help in any way, or is it time to abandon the whole project?

 

[Koeketiene]

Sorry for jumping in, but it sounds like you guys might be able to help! What will happen to the "EU VAT paid" status of my boat if it isn't in EU waters on 31/12? I am an EU national resident in the UK. I plan to take my boat across to live on the European canals, but it's all been delayed because, yeah, bloody Covid. I would not be able to afford paying the VAT. Could getting my boat registered in an EU country before 31/12 help in any way, or is it time to abandon the whole project?

Is your boat UK registered or registered in your home (or another EU27) country?
If the latter is the case, I sincerely doubt anyone will care where your boat was on 31/12/2020.

 

[Lomax]

Is your boat UK registered or registered in your home (or another EU27) country?

My boat is not registered anywhere, as far as I know. Bought privately in 2016, no VAT paid. I do have a receipt though

 

[Koeketiene]

My boat is not registered anywhere, as far as I know. Bought privately in 2016, no VAT paid. I do have a receipt though

Interesting.

 

[Lomax]

If it was registered in Holland (where she was built) there should be a "brandmerk" somewhere on the hull - despite crawling all over her for four years I've never seen trace of one. I've sanded and painted the hull so would likely have spotted it even if filled in. If the previous UK owner had registered her in the UK I would have expected this information to have been provided at the time of sale. So yeah, as far as I know... TBH it's been a pretty crazy four years and it's never occurred to me that it was something I needed to worry about. Well, not until we started getting close to Brexit day, anyway.

 

[Irish Rover]

My boat is not registered anywhere, as far as I know. Bought privately in 2016, no VAT paid. I do have a receipt though

As far as I know there's no need to register a private boat under 24 meters which is being used exclusively in UK waters. That said, for UK residents, it's such a simple procedure under the SSR I would imagine it's sensible to do so. Assuming you bought from a private owner VAT would not have been payable on the transaction. However it's likely VAT was paid at some stage or the boat is deemed VAT exempt because of it's age - you'll need to check its history. If the boat is physically in the UK on 31/12 it will no longer have EU VAT paid status and you will only be able to take it to the EU on Temporary Admission for a period of 18 months [renewable once you sail out of the EU for a day and sign in on reentry]. If you can now establish your VAT status as paid and physically get your boat to an EU country by 31/12 it will have EU VAT PAID status from 01/01/21.

 

[RupertW]

Is your boat UK registered or registered in your home (or another EU27) country?
If the latter is the case, I sincerely doubt anyone will care where your boat was on 31/12/2020.

Registration doesn’t matter at all for VAT, nor does where you paid VAT, the only thing that does is the location on 31/12. So if it’s in the UK then taking it to the EU for more than 18 months means you have to pay to import it there.

 

[Bouba]

It’s a very bleak situation when your only choices are to sign your boat over to Lomax, marry Irish Rover or give a million pounds to Malta?

 

[Momac]

Interesting.

Why do you say that?
In the UK its not mandatory for boats to be registered with the MCA.

 

[Koeketiene]

Why do you say that?
In the UK its not mandatory for boats to be registered with the MCA.

I know.
As Irish Rover mentioned in #29, as a UK resident you don't have to register as long as you stick to UK waters.
However, Lomax said in #24 that his plan was to take his boat across Europe, so the boat would need to be registered somewhere at some point.
He has also said that he bought his boat 4 years ago. I am pretty sure Brexit was already 'a thing' back in 2016.

 

[Koeketiene]

Registration doesn’t matter at all for VAT, nor does where you paid VAT, the only thing that does is the location on 31/12. So if it’s in the UK then taking it to the EU for more than 18 months means you have to pay to import it there.

I beg to differ, but I won't go into too much detail.
However, suffice it to say that some countries require proof of the VAT status when you register the boat.

In practice: in over 25 years of boat ownership (and plenty of foreign travel), I have NEVER been asked to prove the VAT status of my boat when boarded by cumstoms officials.
If the boat flies the ensign of an EU country, I sincerely doubt any official would bother you.

 

[Momac]

I am pretty sure Brexit was already 'a thing' back in 2016.

The referendum was in 2016.
Part 3 registration looks to be quite simple but it does not prove ownership of the boat.
Do you think all boats wishing to travel between UK and EU will need to be part 1 registered ?

 

[RupertW]

I beg to differ, but I won't go into too much detail.
However, suffice it to say that some countries require proof of the VAT status when you register the boat.

In practice: in over 25 years of boat ownership (and plenty of foreign travel), I have NEVER been asked to prove the VAT status of my boat when boarded by cumstoms officials.
If the boat flies the ensign of an EU country, I sincerely doubt any official would bother you.

It’s the other way round - registration doesn’t matter at all for VAT status.

And I have certainly been asked to show proof of VAT status - though not for some years. I suspect that will happen again post Brexit but that is just a guess.

 

[Lomax]

I actually bought the boat because of the Brexit referendum result. I had been saving up for the deposit on a mortgage, but suddenly that didn't seem so appealing...

WRT flag and VAT, this is what the RYA have to say:



So yes, flag does matter when it comes to VAT - if the owner can prove he is "established in the EU". Which as a Swedish citizen I certainly am.

 

[Graham376]

So yes, flag does matter when it comes to VAT - if the owner can prove he is "established in the EU". Which as a Swedish citizen I certainly am.

Flag doesn't matter, it's the status of the boat which counts. If no chargeable event has taken place then no VAT due. My boat is UK flagged and I'm also a resident in the EU, I don't have to change flag/registration.

 

[Lomax]

Flag doesn't matter

That appears to be incorrect. My reading of the RYA's explanation is that a boat that is registered in an EU nation and owned by an EU citizen will retain its VAT paid status after Dec 31st, even if it is not in EU waters at that time. With a British flag that would not be the case. Or do you have some other information?

 

[RupertW]

That appears to be incorrect. My reading of the RYA's explanation is that a boat that is registered in an EU nation and owned by an EU citizen will retain its VAT paid status after Dec 31st, even if it is not in EU waters at that time. With a British flag that would not be the case. Or do you have some other information?

That’s not what the over

I actually bought the boat because of the Brexit referendum result. I had been saving up for the deposit on a mortgage, but suddenly that didn't seem so appealing...

WRT flag and VAT, this is what the RYA have to say:

View attachment 104935

So yes, flag does matter when it comes to VAT - if the owner can prove he is "established in the EU". Which as a Swedish citizen I certainly am.

Weird - I just can’t see that section in the link you shared