Plastic Coated Guard Wires

[Stemar]

As fitted to Jazzcat. They're a bit over 35 years old, so not to be trusted, but if I take the plastic off and inspect the wire, will I know if it's OK?

 

[mrangry]

I have tried removing the plastic from my Beneteau and it is a nightmare to try and remove. Good luck

 

[neil_s]

Against prevailing opinion, I still like plastic covered wire. I do replace it every twelve years, though!

 

[awol]

Stanley knife to slice along the wire then peel the cover off.

 

[Spirit (of Glenans)]

Against prevailing opinion, I still like plastic covered wire. I do replace it every twelve years, though!

For what it's worth, they're not approved by the bodies that govern offshore racing. IMHO the recommendations of these bodies make the most sense when it comes to safety considerations on board

 

[LadyInBed]

if I take the plastic off and inspect the wire, will I know if it's OK?

That's that I did, but I ended up replacing the top wire anyway, as I wanted a size larger.
Re stripping method, it wasn't difficult, hold a sharp knife like a spokeshave and run it along the length of the wire, then just peel it off.

 

[Boathook]

As fitted to Jazzcat. They're a bit over 35 years old, so not to be trusted, but if I take the plastic off and inspect the wire, will I know if it's OK?

I think that you will find the wire to thin after removal of the plastic coating. Possibly fine for the bottom wire though.

 

[Stemar]

So the consensus is that I'll be able to see if the wires have been weakened by corrosion. I'm not on the boat, but the bare bits I could see didn't strike me as being seriously undersized. The designer obviously thought they were strong enough, because the plastic adds nothing to the strength.

 

[pcatterall]

As fitted to Jazzcat. They're a bit over 35 years old, so not to be trusted, but if I take the plastic off and inspect the wire, will I know if it's OK?

Is the wire stainless? The ones on our Neptunian were not. They were badly corroded under the plastic seal at the end of the wire. I replaced with plastic covered to maintain the appearance but in stainless. The advice ( which I ignored) was that stainless could suffer cavity corrosion where the wire emerged from the sheaf. After 10 years they still look fine. Just cutting back the plastic by 10mm or so should give a good idea of the wires condition. If the outer is damaged anywhere ( by abrasion perhaps) then that area would be worth cutting back also.

 

[Neeves]

We, eventually, replaced our plastic covered wires on Josepheline with Dyneema. Dyneema is also not liked because the dyneema can be easily cut through (melted) on long passages when headsail sheets rub on one place continuously - we don't have this problem, headsail sheets are well above the guard rails

A word of comfort - on a cat they are not quite as critical as on a mono simply because its easier and offers more security to lean inboard and hold onto support from the cabin roof.

But 35 years old must put them into the questionable category - and not worth the risk. Its not a difficult upgrade, its not that expensive.

Jonathan

 

[Concerto]

Just been reading a web page on standing rigging and read this.
"Due to the spiral nature of the wire, water, salt, crud and grime will wind its way inside the plastic cover. The wire gets coated with grime effectively sealing the inner core wires from oxygen which leads to a breakdown in the stainless steel surface protection which then leads to corrosion and failure.
The same applies to pvc coated guard wires which quite rightly have been banned by those who wish to sail the arc.
If you have plastic coated guard wires, that are there to save your life, throw them away and replace with plain stainless or at the very least strip away the plastic coating.
Just remember that Stainless Steel requires oxygen to maintain its protection qualities and anything that reduces this is an avoidable risk. "
Standing Rigging

 

[MoodySabre]

Get rid of them. I had them my Snappie years ago and one gave way as soon as any real weight was applied (by me tripping and falling on it). Was rusted badly but no sign.

 

[ashtead]

I suspect if you asked XM rigging or suchlike even with their knowledge of Bavs which fitted plastic covered in the past that they would replace with new plain version- if it’s that bad in needs the plastic removing why not replace if it could save a life in future?

 

[tudorsailor]

Easy to replace and not a major cost in the greater scheme of things. Measure carefully and also note exactly the end fittings. On mine the thread for the pelican hook was not the same as the thread for the fork and apparently this is common. Ideally give rigger/supplier one of each to make sure they swage on the correct fittings. Measurements do not have to be correct to the mm as you tighten as required.
I ordered from CB Rigging and took the wires out in luggage to Greece. Not as heavy as I thought that they would be.
TS

 

[oldgit]

Just replaced the wire on my flybridge. The white plastic coated wire was suspect, original and over 30 years old.
Reason for replacement was several wire strands had broken due to constant flexing at the eye terminal. stripping back the plastic coating reveal no corrosion or degradation of the stainless wire inside.

 

[Neeves]

You have not mentioned what conclusions you have drawn - and I do like to hear what people do after requesting help

But

Coincidentally

We are going to recycle our guard rail life lines, for a terrestrial application. They were on our cat for around 15 years, were plastic coated and replaced with Dyneema. We keep Josepheline on a swing mooring and sail 365, no storing for the winter. Since removal they have been stored in a dry workshop (looking for a new use). I had originally thought to keep the old lines in case we did not like the new replacement Dyneema and wanted to know the size of the originals - that has not been the case - but Dyneema is no more user friendly than thin stainless. In retrospect I would have preferred 10mm polyester covered dyneema with appropriate stanchions - as they would have been significantly more comfort able to hang on to (especially for those not used to the motion of any yacht).

I stripped off the plastic coating on two of the lower lines which are 3mm, the top line is 4mm.

There was no sign of damage but on removing the cover one wire on each had failed and there was 'rust' in short patches (maybe 30mm long) intermittently but preferentially where the wires passed through the stanchions. The rust was not deep - it 'seems' superficial. We may have exacerbated the apparent corrosion at the stanchions as we had sleeved the wires at the stanchions, we must have noted wear of the cover, and had used sticky back as a precautionary extra cover.


We are going to use the old lifelines to allow us to suspend a sprinkler system on a timer to stop the garden (on which we invested much time during Covid lockdowns and confinement) from dehydrating when we make our next long term cruise. The project currently seems a bit of a waste of time as we have just had a months worth of rain in a day with more to follow. The wires are just under 10m long and we will join 2 wires together using the threaded part of the turnbuckle on each and a barrel bolts sleeve to join them.

Jonathan

 

[johnalison]

I agree with those who suggest replacing them with wire but I don’t regard ‘lifelines’ as something to be relied on anyway. Their prime use, as I see it, is for guidance when walking round the boat when it is in harbour. At sea, the only security is given by clipping onto something designed for the purpose. It would be entirely possible to sail safely without lifelines, as a few do.

 

[Poignard]

I agree with those who suggest replacing them with wire but I don’t regard ‘lifelines’ as something to be relied on anyway. Their prime use, as I see it, is for guidance when walking round the boat when it is in harbour. At sea, the only security is given by clipping onto something designed for the purpose. It would be entirely possible to sail safely without lifelines, as a few do.

If I was having a new yacht built I would have rigid guardrails mounted inboard as pilot boats have.

 

[Stemar]

You have not mentioned what conclusions you have drawn - and I do like to hear what people do after requesting help

Me too - it's always nice to hear the outcome.

I haven't drawn any definite conclusions yet, as I have other, more urgent, things to deal with. However, I am tending towards replacement, which will be a relatively small addition to the rigger's bill while he's replacing all my standing rigging.

 

[Concerto]

Me too - it's always nice to hear the outcome.

I haven't drawn any definite conclusions yet, as I have other, more urgent, things to deal with. However, I am tending towards replacement, which will be a relatively small addition to the rigger's bill while he's replacing all my standing rigging.

Good idea.