poeds
New Member
Has anybody got any thoughts regarding a used Pershing 37 or similar compared to Princess Sunseeker or Absolute models? Is Pershing worth considering?
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Pershing
- Thread starter poeds
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Wandering Star
Well-Known Member
There was a Pershing (about 60 foot I'd guess) in Porto Colom, Mallorca and I thought it looked very nice for a mobo painted in it's grey livery. Turned out Michael Schumacher was on board! If it's good enough for him i'm sure the quality is first class. The same boat passed at speed a couple of days later as we sailed for Gibraltar and the driver considerately altered course to leave us a good distance off.
Cheers, Brian.
Cheers, Brian.
PowerYachtBlog
Well-Known Member
Weighs a couple tons more, is only on shafts, is less spacious but more sea worthy.
Has also a higher quality feel coming about it.
Sold two of these one of them to a friend / boat repair yard owner (among best in South med) and he is very happy with it. He does warranty work for Fairline and Azimut.
She drinks also about 30-40% more fuel due to it being on shafts and more heavy.
I sold a few Pershing's from 37 to the 62 in my past and they always had among the most clean surveys. Considering they are fast boats is no small detail.
Has also a higher quality feel coming about it.
Sold two of these one of them to a friend / boat repair yard owner (among best in South med) and he is very happy with it. He does warranty work for Fairline and Azimut.
She drinks also about 30-40% more fuel due to it being on shafts and more heavy.
I sold a few Pershing's from 37 to the 62 in my past and they always had among the most clean surveys. Considering they are fast boats is no small detail.
D
Deleted User YDKXO
Guest
Yes definitely worth considering. V classy driver's boat although probably not as much accomodation as sterndrive competitors
Ferretti 881RPH Dreamer
Well-Known Member
Hey thats a 80+ Pershing and he had been mooring at Cala d'or,,,
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Well, my thought is that there's no such thing as a Prin/SS/Abs boat comparable to a P37.
You'd better look at an Itama 38, if you want to make a sensible comparison.
And fwiw, I'd probably go for it rather than the P37, AOTBE.
PowerYachtBlog
Well-Known Member
Damn how much I agree with you Mapis. You knew I would I am sure of that! 
The Itama 38 is a beast of a boat heavier then the Pershing double the seawothiness and it cuts through anything.
Less flashy for sure, you have to be a certian kind of boater for it with a lot culture I guess. Same if you go for an old Magnum 38 or 40.
Though the 38 has the sweeter of lines of the Itama if you can say that, but I think only the old 54 had nice as it lines, I still prefare the old 42/48 or 46/50 to it. But the 38is sea-worthy as much as these bigger models.
The Itama 38 is a beast of a boat heavier then the Pershing double the seawothiness and it cuts through anything.
Less flashy for sure, you have to be a certian kind of boater for it with a lot culture I guess. Same if you go for an old Magnum 38 or 40.
Though the 38 has the sweeter of lines of the Itama if you can say that, but I think only the old 54 had nice as it lines, I still prefare the old 42/48 or 46/50 to it. But the 38is sea-worthy as much as these bigger models.
poeds
New Member
Thank you for the replies so far, much appreciated
I had not considered Itama, but wow the photos I have just looked over are very impressive you can feel the class and quality.
I had not considered Itama, but wow the photos I have just looked over are very impressive you can feel the class and quality.
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Precisely. Which is the main reason why I would prefer the I38 to the P37, more than aesthetical reasons alone.
Imho, Pershing has never been able to transfer the experience and the results achieved with bigger hulls, Arnesons, etc. to smaller boats.
Then again, they probably didn't even try very hard, since bigger boats is where they made money...
PowerYachtBlog
Well-Known Member
I would not entirely say that.
The 37 had an off shoot version called 38 Endurance, think made in two or three hulls only. This model was the same as the 37 minus the radar arch, Arneson surface drives, and a bit bigger batihng platform.
Hull one competed in the Endurance championship 2001 (this in 2003 became Powerboat P1) with Yanmar engines I think. This model was presented in Genoa 2000 but made little customer attention.
Fair to say the experience of Pershing in surface drives also came much of it from the 70, where they experimented a lot in this model from jet drives as in Hull1. to SDs later on. The 54 (classic of the range) which on prototype was named as 50 originally was released on shafts. You can see this in the aft cabin design! But this model performed so well with Arnesons SD that shafts became unheard of in this model.
The 54 is still by many regarded as one of the best handling Pershings (medium to large sizes), altough many will say the new 56/58 is better especially in head seas.
What I can say is what impresses the most of the 54 is the least of movement up and down (beceggio) with the surface drives which seems to be the problem on many boats who equip Surface drives on hull not created for them. Baia yachts suceed very well in this, but there experience in surface drives is second to none using them since the eighties on the B50 and now on all the range.
Edit - Pershing also competed in Venezia - Monte Carlo race in early ninties. I think it was the 57 model equipped with surface drives.
The 37 had an off shoot version called 38 Endurance, think made in two or three hulls only. This model was the same as the 37 minus the radar arch, Arneson surface drives, and a bit bigger batihng platform.
Hull one competed in the Endurance championship 2001 (this in 2003 became Powerboat P1) with Yanmar engines I think. This model was presented in Genoa 2000 but made little customer attention.
Fair to say the experience of Pershing in surface drives also came much of it from the 70, where they experimented a lot in this model from jet drives as in Hull1. to SDs later on. The 54 (classic of the range) which on prototype was named as 50 originally was released on shafts. You can see this in the aft cabin design! But this model performed so well with Arnesons SD that shafts became unheard of in this model.
The 54 is still by many regarded as one of the best handling Pershings (medium to large sizes), altough many will say the new 56/58 is better especially in head seas.
What I can say is what impresses the most of the 54 is the least of movement up and down (beceggio) with the surface drives which seems to be the problem on many boats who equip Surface drives on hull not created for them. Baia yachts suceed very well in this, but there experience in surface drives is second to none using them since the eighties on the B50 and now on all the range.
Edit - Pershing also competed in Venezia - Monte Carlo race in early ninties. I think it was the 57 model equipped with surface drives.
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DougH
Well-Known Member
When you come to sell your boat, a Princess/Fairline/Sunseeker/Sealine will be fairly easy to sell if you are UK based.
NO MATTER WHAT ANY ONE TELLS YOU PERSHING/ABSOLUTE ETC ARE PIGS SELL IN THE UK AND ARE ONLY POPULAR IN THE MED.
Note, I am not commenting on their quality of build etc.
I now await the flack.
PowerYachtBlog
Well-Known Member
Cranchi and Absolute sell pretty good in the UK used market as well, as do some other US and French brands.
Altough the lack of vision of UK buyers still impresses me for a couple of reasons;
All the boats mentioned above are indeed made in UK to Italian Med looks and uses.
Why do you need an aft sunpad over there, or an extended flybridge is beyond my understanding. They could have actually been made anywhere in the World, fact is the above have nothing British about them. May be Sealine has just that small bit left of it, and its a big MB...
If you would have told me Broom (or similar) though I would have actually understood your point.
One last thing the world is very global and I have seen many boats transported all over. A friend of myn actually recently bough a Doral from the UK a month ago, and one a Cranchi about 6 months ago.
One last thing is also sometimes a known make being it Azimut or Fairline can also work both ways. I am seeing Fairline 48 Phantoms loosing over half there purchase price being only 2 years old and this from a Fairline dealer. So if you have a 48 Phantom you will have to sell more or less the same price, if you want to sell.
Altough the lack of vision of UK buyers still impresses me for a couple of reasons;
All the boats mentioned above are indeed made in UK to Italian Med looks and uses.
Why do you need an aft sunpad over there, or an extended flybridge is beyond my understanding. They could have actually been made anywhere in the World, fact is the above have nothing British about them. May be Sealine has just that small bit left of it, and its a big MB...
If you would have told me Broom (or similar) though I would have actually understood your point.
One last thing the world is very global and I have seen many boats transported all over. A friend of myn actually recently bough a Doral from the UK a month ago, and one a Cranchi about 6 months ago.
One last thing is also sometimes a known make being it Azimut or Fairline can also work both ways. I am seeing Fairline 48 Phantoms loosing over half there purchase price being only 2 years old and this from a Fairline dealer. So if you have a 48 Phantom you will have to sell more or less the same price, if you want to sell.
DougH
Well-Known Member
All possible true, but please read post. I SAID IF HE WAS UK BASED.
I beleive you are a Broker/Dealer so I can understand your stance.
I just do not agree with you.
PowerYachtBlog
Well-Known Member
Well DougH I do agree with what you say form a certain POV, and in the above I am trying to give you reasons on facts why this is in real matters does not make sense.
We also have to wait what the invasion of the Germans and French (see Bavaria and Beneteau group) producers will leave on the current sub fifty feet size in a couple years time on the British market.
The Italians had always the disadvantage that they cost same or more of the Brits but with the French and German it will be a very different story me thinks where price and value come at a more competitive side.
But you are right for selling later the boats you mention are normally more easy to sell in the UK island.
We also have to wait what the invasion of the Germans and French (see Bavaria and Beneteau group) producers will leave on the current sub fifty feet size in a couple years time on the British market.
The Italians had always the disadvantage that they cost same or more of the Brits but with the French and German it will be a very different story me thinks where price and value come at a more competitive side.
But you are right for selling later the boats you mention are normally more easy to sell in the UK island.
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poeds
New Member
cheers for the headsup about resale. I am based in Cyprus at the moment (ROC)
Nick_H
Well-Known Member
Cranchi and Absolute will sell in the UK at a push, because they both have or had established dealers, but they certainly don't sell well, which is probably why your friend bought a Cranchi from the UK, beacuse no-one here wanted it.
If you took your red white and green blinkers off for a minute, you'd notice that Brit built flybridges do make more concessions to the UK style of boating, for instance they generally have bigger more comfortable saloons than the bus stops you find on a lot of Italian boats (Aicon 56 being a prime example, which sold well in Italy, but the only new one sent to the UK hung around for years before being sold off cheap). That alone is a good enough reason to buy a Brit boat over an Azimut 55 or the Aicon mentioned above if you'll spend more time lounging indoors.
It's also not just a British thing, you wont find many Scandinavians who would choose any mainstream Italian flybridge over a Princess for instance, because they also appreciate the understated styling and better layouts of many of the British built boats.
You are of course free to think that only Italians can build good boats, but it's quite condescending to suggest that the only reason British buyers don't agree with you is through a lack of vision.
PowerYachtBlog
Well-Known Member
Nick H first of all my reply to Doug was not good as in quality but more a design element.
Second I never stated Italian only build good boats, what I merely stated that from a design stand point of view what currently (or since 10 years+) the top 4 (Sealine, Princ,Fline, Sseeker) British builders are doing do not make much sense for the rainy British use.
You have currently a Princess 57 in South of France so that practically put you out of the equation.
I dont see this much of bigger saloons in the British design to mention versus say an Azimut 55. I crewed a Princess 58 a while ago, the saloon was more or less the same size that of Azimut 55, and actually for a saloon use the Azimuts does work better with the galley up configuration infront of the dining in the raised part. I will always think for any use this works much better then in between the cabins as it is for the Princess 58 or 54. Princess actually changed this poor layout for a 16-18 meter flybridge yacht!
Even the poor Aicon mentioned here had actually a better layout (similar to an Az 55) with a galley up solution then to that of the Princess 58 or 54.
Scandinavia is a very interesting subject where indeed the British builders have good sales there, fair to them they build a good distribution in the place over the years, but Absolute with the newer more enclosed models have sold a couple boats in the past couple seasons apparently. The Italians always ignored this market apart Cranchi and Gobbi and some others because they always tought it was a sub fifty market. Recently things have changed and the attention is also going a bit there. Though building a good distribution is never easy for any yacht builder and always a challenge
EDIT: I add this, there is also the problem of Volvo engines which most Italian builders due to the HP they loose in hot weather had in the past dont like to use. Azimut had some trouble with this in the 90s for a loss of declared speed of 3 knots from max.
Even Malta has actually the same format. British boats are quite popular here, and only in the last 10 years have Italian makes started to penetrate the local market, mostly Azimut and Atlantis. Cranchi has established itself before. Considering we come as a nation for 200 years + under British rule where many still think British is BEST very much makes sense. We had that problem also in Autos back until the 90s where British cars started to suck. And again the Volvo after sales service also here comes again.
But you can also continue to think I am a big supporter of Italian yachts, which on actualy facts it is not entirely true.
You can also see check my Blog where in it there is a very international approach without being supporter to a side and another and stating most important facts.
Which is sometimes very much misintrepted today and twisted to a new reality not only in the boating World but anything that is surround by $$$$
Now the truth remains that Italians along with the US have revolutionarized the Motor Boating industry from the technical side to the design elements....
And most of the boats and yachts produced today are just part of that revolution! Nonetheless I am one of the thinkers who I think the Brits build a very good boat for a good price, and well enginerred and nearly bought one twice. ALso the longevity of the makes and good management has always been something very well done and to be admired!
Second I never stated Italian only build good boats, what I merely stated that from a design stand point of view what currently (or since 10 years+) the top 4 (Sealine, Princ,Fline, Sseeker) British builders are doing do not make much sense for the rainy British use.
You have currently a Princess 57 in South of France so that practically put you out of the equation.
I dont see this much of bigger saloons in the British design to mention versus say an Azimut 55. I crewed a Princess 58 a while ago, the saloon was more or less the same size that of Azimut 55, and actually for a saloon use the Azimuts does work better with the galley up configuration infront of the dining in the raised part. I will always think for any use this works much better then in between the cabins as it is for the Princess 58 or 54. Princess actually changed this poor layout for a 16-18 meter flybridge yacht!
Even the poor Aicon mentioned here had actually a better layout (similar to an Az 55) with a galley up solution then to that of the Princess 58 or 54.
Scandinavia is a very interesting subject where indeed the British builders have good sales there, fair to them they build a good distribution in the place over the years, but Absolute with the newer more enclosed models have sold a couple boats in the past couple seasons apparently. The Italians always ignored this market apart Cranchi and Gobbi and some others because they always tought it was a sub fifty market. Recently things have changed and the attention is also going a bit there. Though building a good distribution is never easy for any yacht builder and always a challenge
EDIT: I add this, there is also the problem of Volvo engines which most Italian builders due to the HP they loose in hot weather had in the past dont like to use. Azimut had some trouble with this in the 90s for a loss of declared speed of 3 knots from max.
Even Malta has actually the same format. British boats are quite popular here, and only in the last 10 years have Italian makes started to penetrate the local market, mostly Azimut and Atlantis. Cranchi has established itself before. Considering we come as a nation for 200 years + under British rule where many still think British is BEST very much makes sense. We had that problem also in Autos back until the 90s where British cars started to suck. And again the Volvo after sales service also here comes again.
But you can also continue to think I am a big supporter of Italian yachts, which on actualy facts it is not entirely true.
You can also see check my Blog where in it there is a very international approach without being supporter to a side and another and stating most important facts.
Which is sometimes very much misintrepted today and twisted to a new reality not only in the boating World but anything that is surround by $$$$
Now the truth remains that Italians along with the US have revolutionarized the Motor Boating industry from the technical side to the design elements....
And most of the boats and yachts produced today are just part of that revolution! Nonetheless I am one of the thinkers who I think the Brits build a very good boat for a good price, and well enginerred and nearly bought one twice. ALso the longevity of the makes and good management has always been something very well done and to be admired!
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DougH
Well-Known Member
PowerYachtBlog,
Could I ask a personal question that I assure you has no hidden meaning,
'Are you a British National and is English your first language?'
Doug
Could I ask a personal question that I assure you has no hidden meaning,
'Are you a British National and is English your first language?'
Doug
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Aha, I must have missed that.
Blimey W, you could as well use PowerYachtBible as your alias!
PowerYachtBlog
Well-Known Member
No I am Maltese as born in Malta and English is like a second (first in some areas) language.
Have a lot of family around England, eight in total. Two living around London area, and the rest from Midlands upwards, with three being in Scotland.
