Origo on Bio ethanol?

[Kilo]

Anyone any thoughts on using bio ethanol in an origo stove? I know it's relatively expensive but burns cleaner, with little or no CO produced as far as I can establish.
Not sure about the water content but think there's less moisture produced too.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

Ethanol is ethanol (C2H5OH), regardless of its origins. The impurities may differ according to the source, and that will change the smell, but the bottom line is that the bio bit is irrelevant to the functioning of the cooker. The water content will, of course, cause the flame to be hotter or colder, but that should be stated on the label. It's very difficult to produce alcohol with less than about 4% water.

Burning the same amount of ethanol produces exactly the same amount of moisture and CO2; again the bio bit is irrelevant.

 

[RAI]

Anyone any thoughts on using bio ethanol in an origo stove? I know it's relatively expensive but burns cleaner, with little or no CO produced as far as I can establish.
Not sure about the water content but think there's less moisture produced too.

Burning (CH3CH2OH) is going to produce some CO2 and lots of water.
Biofuel Basics

 

[Bilgediver]

Less smell? Definitely worth it.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

Anyone any thoughts on using bio ethanol in an origo stove? I know it's relatively expensive but burns cleaner, with little or no CO produced as far as I can establish.
Not sure about the water content but think there's less moisture produced too.

Carbon monoxide is the product of non stoichiometric combustion it's the absence of sufficient oxygen not the fuel bio ethylene or whatever that produces it.

C2H5OH ( ethanol bio or otherwise ) + 302 =2 CO2 + 3H20 plus energy released.

 

[davidej]

I thought most (or all) ethanol is bio. That’s why many object to the use of potentially food producing land for the grain to be fermented to make it.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

I thought most (or all) ethanol is bio. That’s why many object to the use of potentially food producing land for the grain to be fermented to make it.

A fair amount is produced from natural gas.

Producing the ethanol fuel for V2 rockets increased food shortages in WW2 Germany; each rocket required the alcohol produced from 30 tonnes of potatoes! In fact, post-war assessments showed that the V2 caused more damage to the German economy (including casualties) than it did to the targets.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

I thought most (or all) ethanol is bio. That’s why many object to the use of potentially food producing land for the grain to be fermented to make it.

Some comes from the petrochemical industry via the hydration of ethane all bio ethanol comes from a variety of processes where the feedstock is a grown crop either sugar beet / cane or grain.

 

[Refueler]

Maybe this can help :

Biothenol vs Ethanol, A Comparison

Ethanol and Bioethanol are same compounds - its the production and source material that is different.

I cannot see why one cannot use either .... brings to mind the question of De-Natured vs Normal ...

 

[Refueler]

I thought most (or all) ethanol is bio. That’s why many object to the use of potentially food producing land for the grain to be fermented to make it.

Common Ethanol is usually formed from Ethylene.

Bio version is termed Bio because of the organic sources used to produce the base components to form Ethanol.

 

[jamie N]

I run my Origo 6000 on Bio-Ethanol, and have for several years. It's as good as alcool à brûler, and makes using UK Meths seem like being in an L.S.Lowry painting.

 

[Praxinoscope]

I have used Bio ethanol in my Origo 3000 for the last 5 years, in place of meths.
Works perfectly with no ‘meths pong’.

 

[thinwater]

In the US nearly all ethanol is bio. But there is no difference. And many would debate which is ethically better (for example, food crops should go for food, and tearing up forest for farms is not better than drilling).

The smells are denaturants. They are not differnt for bioethanol, though there are many choices (set by UK law--I'm sure they are different from US). You really should not smell them when buring. But many people do not cover the stove cartridge between uses because they have lost to the cover gasket. The cover saves a LOT of evaporation. Read about it in the manual. You can cut a disk from butyl or nitrile rubber (not silicone or neoprene).

 

[Dellquay13]

I’ve been using the bio ethanol sold as hacienda bbq fluid from B&Q in my origo for years with no issue

 

[Kilo]

Interesting replies, thanks all.

 

[rotrax]

As an aside, when I was racing big time I had a 205 litre drum of Methanol each season for fuelling the track bikes.

We often got the fondue pot out and used Methanol as the fuel. My mate with a little Thames motorboat had some for his alcohol stove too.

Less smell than Methalated Spirit and appeared to burn as hot.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

As an aside, when I was racing big time I had a 205 litre drum of Methanol each season for fuelling the track bikes.

We often got the fondue pot out and used Methanol as the fuel. My mate with a little Thames motorboat had some for his alcohol stove too.

Less smell than Methalated Spirit and appeared to burn as hot.

Methylated Spirit was ethanol but with the addition of some methanol and pyridine to make it both poisonous and undrinkable. I am surprised that your methanol wasn't laced with pyridine to stop people trying to drink it. It makes you go blind, daft and will eventually kill you but people still do drink it .

 

[VicS]

Methylated Spirit was ethanol but with the addition of some methanol and pyridine to make it both poisonous and undrinkable. I am surprised that your methanol wasn't laced with pyridine to stop people trying to drink it. It makes you go blind, daft and will eventually kill you but people still do drink it .

This information is somewhat dated ( but also included methyl violet which gave it its familiar colour)

The modern equivalent of the old coloured "Mineralised" methylated sprit is "Completely denatured alcohol" ( CDA)
The standard formulation for CDA produced in the UK is for every 100 parts by volume of alcohol to be mixed mixed with 3 parts by volume of isopropyl alcohol, 3 parts by volume of methyl ethyl ketone and one gram of denatonium benzoate. Colouring with methyl violet is optional but usually seems to be included

The safety data for La Hacienda bioethanol indicates that it is CDA without colouring

There is no requirement that I am aware of for methanol to contain pyridine .

 

[rotrax]

Methylated Spirit was ethanol but with the addition of some methanol and pyridine to make it both poisonous and undrinkable. I am surprised that your methanol wasn't laced with pyridine to stop people trying to drink it. It makes you go blind, daft and will eventually kill you but people still do drink it .

My Methanol came from a local Pharmaceutical Company who's CEO was a customer in our Classic bike shop.

It was used as a re-agent in the bulk manufacture of pharmaceuticals. Nothing was added, plus it contained less water than normal Methanol.

His company used 2,000 litres during the manufacture of each batch. The HMRC man was a regular visitor as fuel duty was paid on each lorryload and reclaimed when the used stuff went back.

My drum or two 'fell off the back' of said lorry, but was unused pure stuff.

My bikes always went really well on the stuff, and it was free.

 

[VicS]

My Methanol came from a local Pharmaceutical Company who's CEO was a customer in our Classic bike shop.

It was used as a re-agent in the bulk manufacture of pharmaceuticals. Nothing was added, plus it contained less water than normal Methanol.

His company used 2,000 litres during the manufacture of each batch. The HMRC man was a regular visitor as fuel duty was paid on each lorryload and reclaimed when the used stuff went back.

My drum or two 'fell off the back' of said lorry, but was unused pure stuff.

My bikes always went really well on the stuff, and it was free.

That may have been "Industrial denatured alcohol " (IDA), previously known as "Industrial methylated sprit" (IMS) or more likely "Trade specific denatured alcohol". (TSDA) There are a number of approved formulations for TSDA for various uses.