Ore and Alde entrance...advice for first timer please!

Marmalade said:
:-( he's big but he only draws 3ft - less than half oour draft:confused:
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On our first visit many years ago, we were early on the tide so was hanging about killing time when a largish yacht, about 40ft came by and went straight in. I thought if he can, so can we, so followed him.
We later found out that he was a centreboard boat from Boston Lincs and could float on a heavy dew. We made it OK though.
 
In my 0.9m deep yacht I like to cross the bar at low water when possible. I did it a couple of weeks ago on a highish low tide of 1m above chart datum, and the minimum depth I recorded was 1.4 m.

the advantage of crossing at LW if you can is that if you’re coming or going from the south you have a fair tide in the Alde and also at sea. It also means you can clearly see most of the shingle banks as the waves break on them.
 
I took the pictures while anchored a few hundred metres from weir point (outside) I let the flood get going and pop around the corner.... misses that long slog from the safe water buoy . Just keep right in on the beach......
 
Slowboat35 said:
Just follow your instinct and blaze the trail as you describe, you'll not go far wrong.

There's far too much hype and mythology talked and written about this place. Most of it is just that; hype and mythology.
It gets a reputation because careless people are careless about the manner in which they enter or exit and sometimes get stuck.

There's no witchcraft about it. Enter or leave on a rising tide is a good starting plan...
However it would be a daunting place to get pinned on a shingle bank so just ensure you don't!

The latest surveys are readily available on t'internet (Visit My Harbour.com being one of the best) and unless there's been a huge storm since they were made the bottom won't have changed appreciably, just as with any other chart. You can also call up the harbourmaster if you really feel the need for up to the minute advice.

Just don't be too adventurous on your timings, allow a decent margin of (depth) error but above all comply with the bouyage. PUNCTILIOUSLY.
You don't have to be much off track on the sight-lines to find shallower water so be accurate - really accurate at keeping to the tracks given and don't allow yourself to be swept off it by the often fairly strong cross current. Drift angles of 30 degrees are not unlikely with a 2.5Kt tide if you're taking it slowly - in my book you're better having the confidence to proceed at a sensible clip and keep large drift-angles to the minimum. Don't let the tide sag you below the required track.

It's just careful and thoroughly aware boat-handling, that's all.

Make yourself aware of the current flow in the river too, it'll be hoofing out at 3-4 or more Kts for some time after low tide and pouring in at the same rate long after high tide - progress in the narrows of the entrance and soon inside can be quite alarming/surprising in both directions. Throttle setting tends to be either idle and hurtling ahead or full ahead and barely making headway depending on how the current is running! The strong current area doesn't extend much beyond the shingle banks near the entrance. Big, sudden cross currents exist there too - bit it's fun!

DON'T look too much at precipitous and alrming gravel banks close by - as long as you're on track. Sometimes you're in 5-8 or more metres of water a mere boat length from the shore.

It feels a bit of a challenge first time but if you take the published advice and are accurate in your track-keeping there is not much to be concerned about. Once you've done it once you'll relish coming back for more. What you'll discover inside is more that worth the effort, believe me!
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What an excellent post! I totally agree with you about the myth and hype; we seem to live in an age where something that required respect, 'feel' and common sense is now blown out of all proportion to 'big up' the danger aspect. Southwold harbour falls in to the same category; it's claimed many yachts over the years but many of them were attempting the entrance when it was clearly unwise to do so (strong onshore breeze etc).

If the OP follows Slowboat's advice he/she can't go far wrong.
 
xyachtdave said:
I’ve not been in here before and would normally just be brave and trail blaze this myself with the pilot book in the cockpit!

However the ECP suggests ‘frequent massive changes’ and essential consulting of recent surveys... which have not taken place this year for obvious reasons.

Can anyone local offer any reassuring words of wisdom for XYD and his 2 metre draft boat please?

Thanks!
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Sounds like the river Ythan at Newburgh , but we dont
Slowboat35 said:
Just follow your instinct and blaze the trail as you describe, you'll not go far wrong.

There's far too much hype and mythology talked and written about this place. Most of it is just that; hype and mythology.
It gets a reputation because careless people are careless about the manner in which they enter or exit and sometimes get stuck.

There's no witchcraft about it. Enter or leave on a rising tide is a good starting plan...
However it would be a daunting place to get pinned on a shingle bank so just ensure you don't!

The latest surveys are readily available on t'internet (Visit My Harbour.com being one of the best) and unless there's been a huge storm since they were made the bottom won't have changed appreciably, just as with any other chart. You can also call up the harbourmaster if you really feel the need for up to the minute advice.

Just don't be too adventurous on your timings, allow a decent margin of (depth) error but above all comply with the bouyage. PUNCTILIOUSLY.
You don't have to be much off track on the sight-lines to find shallower water so be accurate - really accurate at keeping to the tracks given and don't allow yourself to be swept off it by the often fairly strong cross current. Drift angles of 30 degrees are not unlikely with a 2.5Kt tide if you're taking it slowly - in my book you're better having the confidence to proceed at a sensible clip and keep large drift-angles to the minimum. Don't let the tide sag you below the required track.

It's just careful and thoroughly aware boat-handling, that's all.

Make yourself aware of the current flow in the river too, it'll be hoofing out at 3-4 or more Kts for some time after low tide and pouring in at the same rate long after high tide - progress in the narrows of the entrance and soon inside can be quite alarming/surprising in both directions. Throttle setting tends to be either idle and hurtling ahead or full ahead and barely making headway depending on how the current is running! The strong current area doesn't extend much beyond the shingle banks near the entrance. Big, sudden cross currents exist there too - bit it's fun!

DON'T look too much at precipitous and alrming gravel banks close by - as long as you're on track. Sometimes you're in 5-8 or more metres of water a mere boat length from the shore.

It feels a bit of a challenge first time but if you take the published advice and are accurate in your track-keeping there is not much to be concerned about. Once you've done it once you'll relish coming back for more. What you'll discover inside is more that worth the effort, believe me!
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seems like the river Ythan at Newburgh , but it does not have marking bouys !!
 
I went in to the Ore yesterday almost three hours after LW at the bar. The tide was roaring in and there was never less than 4m under me (Vim draws 1.2m) past the buoys. I then shaped up for the river keeping slightly closer to the landward bank. The depth increased to 5 - 6m but then started to fluctuate wildly once abeam the northern shoal. I went to mid-river but this didn't make any difference and I bounced off the gravel twice. I didn't want to go any closer to the spit as it was clearly shallow.

Very surprised this happened mid-flood. Anyone know where best water is currently?

After that it was a joy and I had a fetch all the way to my new mooring off Slaughden.
 
Was it here (X) you touched? Because there's an annoying heap of shingle that often trips you up.
unnamed.png
I left the Ore last weekend at LW+1, using Navionics and carefully following the deeper channel, and there was so much water beneath me I didn't even bother to make a note: at least 3m I'd say. (EDIT: 3m in the river, that is. Between the buoys the minimum depth was 1.5m)
 
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oilybilge said:
Was it here (X) you touched? Because there's an annoying heap of shingle that often trips you up.
View attachment 98561
I left the Ore last weekend at LW+1, using Navionics and carefully following the deeper channel, and there was so much water beneath me I didn't even bother to make a note: at least 3m I'd say.
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I suspect that catches a few people out, it has made me gulp a few times. You think you are past the worst bit and relax because you are safely in the river, then the sounder alarm goes off!
 
oilybilge said:
Was it here (X) you touched? Because there's an annoying heap of shingle that often trips you up.
View attachment 98561
I left the Ore last weekend at LW+1, using Navionics and carefully following the deeper channel, and there was so much water beneath me I didn't even bother to make a note: at least 3m I'd say.
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Well that's interesting. My (up to date) Navionics shows the area you have in white with 5.1m as 0-2m:

IMG_5378.jpg
 
MikeBz said:
Well that's interesting. My (up to date) Navionics shows the area you have in white with 5.1m as 0-2m:

View attachment 98568
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With a sounding of 5m right on the contour! Something wrong there - and not the first time for Navionics. Looks like someone has miscoded the depth area when ingesting new data into their system.
Navionics do NOT originate data - they buy it from the hydrographic agencies and reformat it. Unfortunately, the process is not always error free.
 
Don't think Navionics can be up to date as there wasn't a survey this year.
We too touched on that spot early in the season - a little early on the tide (-2hrs - we draw 2m) and we headed back out to return later... The scary thing is; without an up to date chart, when the depth disappears - you don't know whether to turn to por or starboard to find the deep water. The Navionics chart implies it's to port by the beach; someone on here advised to hug the ness side...
 
If its helpful here’s the route I took last Sunday at LW+1 which gave me ‘plenty’ of water — sorry I can’t be more accurate but it was at least three metres.

05EC4F16-63F9-435D-89E6-2AA43C3AF43A.png
 
Marmalade said:
Don't think Navionics can be up to date as there wasn't a survey this year.
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What I meant was that the charts in my app are up-to-date with regards to what is available, and what they show is different to what Oilybilge is seeing in the same app with the same charts. I wouldn't ever expect them to be perfectly accurate or up to date, but there is a big difference.
 
oilybilge said:
Was it here (X) you touched? Because there's an annoying heap of shingle that often trips you up.
View attachment 98561
I left the Ore last weekend at LW+1, using Navionics and carefully following the deeper channel, and there was so much water beneath me I didn't even bother to make a note: at least 3m I'd say. (EDIT: 3m in the river, that is. Between the buoys the minimum depth was 1.5m)
Click to expand...

It was a bit before that abeam of North Weir Point. I had a steady 5 - 6m which then reduced very quickly to less than a metre. It was definitely shingle under me; I could tell by the noise the keel made going through it. I bounced off the second lump. It certainly concentrated the senses and I couldn't see any reason for the lump to be there. I'm going to explore in the flubber at LW as, presumably, the lump will be visible then.

I'm off to Gib tomorrow to collect a boat and bring it to Portland. No depth issues for a change!
 
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