Oil instead of ATF

[Porthandbuoy]

Moving on from the "To lock the prop or not" thread I harked back to a few weeks ago when I checked the fluid level in the gearbox. I remember the level being okay but looking like clean engine oil. Didn't think much of it at the time, but being a bit better informed I went out today armed with a Peli-Pump and 2 litres of Dextron ATF.
The stuff I pumped out was definitely engine oil. Golden coloured, not pink. Not good. The gearbox is a Kanzaki KBW20 and should have been filled with ATF (it's even printed on the filler plug!).
I've filled it with ATF and tomorrow I'll run the engine in gear to stir it up and change it again.
I decanted some of the oil into a jar and stirred it with a magnetic pick-up tool; no metal particles, so here's hoping the gearbox hasn't suffered terminal damage.

 

[The Q]

A common problem on Landrover LT 77 gearbox , they are meant to use ATF as well, but often non Landrover people and garages use ep80.

 

[Refueler]

Gearboxes ..... reminds me of the Capri 2.8i saga ...

Ford in their wisdom failed to have oil feed to one of the shafts in both the early 4 and 5 speed box . With standard gear oil at the time - the boxes soon started to whine. Fords answer was to swap to engine oil ... then lighter oil as they still had 2.8i's coming in to dealers whining.
What was their final answer ? ATF fluid ...... and it HAD to be Fords own branded ATF put in by dealer or warranty was void.

All through this - 3rd party companys were coining it in supplying recon boxes with that extra drip feed fitted ... something that Ford could have done easily ...

I had a 2.8i Special - box before year old started to whine ... but when rear offside drive shaft snapped and car crashed - I had fight with Ford about this ... ended up selling the car. (Note that the Granada using same shafts suffered same problem - due to a production batch of shafts with flaws). I replaced the 2.8i Special with the faster previous non LSD version - yep - that started to whine ...

Being friendly with various mechanics from my race car days and later with a number of dealers of the 2.8i - the sad saga was told to me .... Ford of course never came clean about it ... and ended the Capri line before they really had to do anything ..

 

[Alfie168]

I had a brand new Golf GTi in 1987 that wouldn't engage first or second when hot. I knew it was the clutch, but VW insisted on changing the gearbox oil for ATF to see if it improved it. It didn't. A new clutch did though?

 

[Stemar]

IIRC, some Volvo gearboxes run on gear oil and others - same model, but a bit newer run on ATF. I understand the innards are identical.

 

[Refueler]

IIRC, some Volvo gearboxes run on gear oil and others - same model, but a bit newer run on ATF. I understand the innards are identical.

I have XC70 and have no0 idea whatsoever what is in the box ... its a Dealer job to sort

 

[Stemar]

I have XC70 and have no0 idea whatsoever what is in the box ... its a Dealer job to sort

I was thinking about marine jobs

I'm fairly sure that my car has ATF, but only because it's automatic, and only fairly sure because I could imagine the kind of clever manual box automated by a computer using EP80, though I wonder if ATF wouldn't be used as it's less viscous so should improve mpg

 

[westernman]

The manual for my Yanmar 4HJ2 which I think might have a Kanzaki KBW20 gearbox specifies engine oil for the gearbox. Not ATF.
I use ATF in my steering!
Volvo ATF last time I bought any as it was the cheapest

 

[vyv_cox]

I was thinking about marine jobs

I'm fairly sure that my car has ATF, but only because it's automatic, and only fairly sure because I could imagine the kind of clever manual box automated by a computer using EP80, though I wonder if ATF wouldn't be used as it's less viscous so should improve mpg

ATF has more boundary lubricant than gear oil to help with items that cannot be lubricated hydrodynamically. This includes gear teeth but the need depends on tooth temperature, not something easily calculated. ATF should be good in a box specified for EP but not the reverse.

 

[Boater Sam]

When I worked on cars/trucks EP80 and EP90 oils were for rear axles, straight 80s for gearboxes. The EP additive can have bad effects on some bronze based bushes.
ATF copes better with elevated temperatures.

 

[Moodysailor]

ATF has more boundary lubricant than gear oil to help with items that cannot be lubricated hydrodynamically. This includes gear teeth but the need depends on tooth temperature, not something easily calculated. ATF should be good in a box specified for EP but not the reverse.

Not strictly accurate - ATT should be used in a transimission that specifies ATF, likewise for EP. Both ATF and EP are low foaming, helpful for when you are in the 'washing machine' internals of a transmission. EP is generally specified in higher loads (i.e lower housings or drives) where the bearing and gear loads are higher as it performs better in those applications.

I do not doubt your credentials in material knowledge, but not all transmissions can accept all oil types. I have seen multi-plate transmissions ruin clutch packs from having EP filled as it prevented the proper friction between the plates, likewise I have seen lower housings come apart due to having the wrong oil filled. I appreciate the theory, but can only offer my experience from first-hand in the field.

An earlier post is correct that VP did specify engine oil on their VP branded Hurth transmissions for a while, but a service bulletin was issued saying to change to ATF at the next interval after a few years. I understand that cold weather performance was the primary reason.