Oh so new....

[findtom]

Hello, I'm new to boating. Well I say boating but I'm still at the looking for a boat and finance stage... I have sailed most of my life (dingy, windsurfing and offshore), but not motor cruisers. My wife would really like to go boating with me but would prefer a cruiser to an out and out sailing boat.

So that's what brings me here. I'm looking for a boat, I already know I'd like it to be twin engined, heated, shower and just large enough to be comfortable for a week or two in. But ultimately I'm open minded. I would guess my budget would be about £100k, but in truth I have no idea if that is enough/too much or would a small boat be better to start with.

I have found this: http://www.swordfishmarine.co.uk/product-details.php?id=2506

Would someone who knows what to look for tell me if this looks like a good deal? How do you know the right price for age etc?

And lastly how do you finance a boat? I have looked on the internet for Marine Mortgages but havn't really found an answer yet...

Any advice would be gratefully received.

Tom.

 

[findtom]

Bump

 

[Galia]

Welcome to the forum, sorry your query appears to have been overlooked. Everyone must be still glued to HenryF's epistle of his long weekend. I'm relatively new to boating and considerbly at the opposite end of your budget. However, before I even went to look at boats I took an RYA Power Boat level 2 course and found that it, and the experience & knowledge of the instructors were well worth the 200 quid. Hopefully someone with more experience will be along shortly. In this current economic climate I imagine there will be any number of boat owners willing to "break your arm" for that sort of budget !
George

 

[findtom]

Thank you very much. I have been sailing a long time and windsurfing and took the RYA Power Boat course a few years ago. But I agree with you, it is a must!

I did speak to Burton Waters yesterday and they were really useful. I rang Lombard today but they were too busy to call me back?

Anyway any advice is really welcome.

Tom.

 

[superheat6k]

Welcome to the forum. Have you thought about an experience week aboard a 30-40' cruiser. Suggest you try Jon Mendez, Elessar or Solitaire of this parish, as these guys will provide effective instruction as well to suit your capabilities.

 

[rafiki_]

Tom, a very warm welcome to the forum. For your budget, £100k, you are easily in the budget area of a 35 to 40 foot sports cruiser with twin diesels, heating, shower in heads etc. The boat may be 10-15 years old, but must be properly maintained and serviced. This is more important than age in reality.
You could be looking at Fairline, Princess, Sealine, or an older Sunseeker. Trawl Yachtworld, Ancasta, Essex Boatyards. It will be the Southampton Boat Show in a couple of weeks, a great opportunity to spend a day or so looking for both your ideal boat and the finance.

 

[Galia]

Welcome to the forum. Have you thought about an experience week aboard a 30-40' cruiser. Suggest you try Jon Mendez, Elessar or Solitaire of this parish, as these guys will provide effective instruction as well to suit your capabilities.

Yep, excellent suggestions, I assume you are talking coastal boating as opposed to inland. Also, a day or two at SIBS (and the used boat show nearby) would let you see all the different types and layouts. Forget about the money, see what would suit you. Once you find that, then go back a few years and start looking.
George

 

[rosssavage]

http://www.boatshop24.co.uk/advert/fairline-turbo-36-unknown/39784992 Popular, bombproof fairline. Superheat6k has one.


http://www.boatshop24.co.uk/advert/sealine-f37-west-country/39769755 Newer, arguably less bombproof layup. Lots of space for the money.


http://www.boatshop24.co.uk/advert/princess-v40-cowes-isle-of-wight/39763525 Big sports cruiser. Great build quality, fast fun.

 

[alt]

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?255294-Birchwood-330-Challenger-any-good - A quick Google brought this up, mixed reviews

 

[benjenbav]

Finance may be an interesting proposition. Barclays used to be a big player in marine finance but decided to stop taking new business a few years ago. I can't claim to be an expert but it may be Lombard or Lombard or else the time-honoured: borrow against something the bank understands like, er, a house.

 

[findtom]

Welcome to the forum. Have you thought about an experience week aboard a 30-40' cruiser. Suggest you try Jon Mendez, Elessar or Solitaire of this parish, as these guys will provide effective instruction as well to suit your capabilities.

No I had not thought of that, great idea. How do I contact them to get a quote for a week?

 

[findtom]

Yep, excellent suggestions, I assume you are talking coastal boating as opposed to inland. Also, a day or two at SIBS (and the used boat show nearby) would let you see all the different types and layouts. Forget about the money, see what would suit you. Once you find that, then go back a few years and start looking.
George

Great advice thank you. Yes I'm looking for coastal boating where we can explore and things like that, (read drink wine and burn steak). I think we will go to the boat show and get a feel for what we really like. I'm goin off the flybridge idea the more I think about it....

 

[findtom]

Have any of you had good or bad experiences with finance companies? Is there a preferred method other than 10 or 14 years with Lombard?

 

[superheat6k]

No I had not thought of that, great idea. How do I contact them to get a quote for a week?

Simply PM them. I understand Evenstar (Elessar's fine Sealine 390) will be taking part in the RYA Active Marina programme at SIBS. That would be a free ride I assume, but get there early to book it.

Jon Mendez' Storeboro Royal 'Motala' is a lovely boat too.

 

[alt]

Great advice thank you. Yes I'm looking for coastal boating where we can explore and things like that, (read drink wine and burn steak). I think we will go to the boat show and get a feel for what we really like. I'm goin off the flybridge idea the more I think about it....

Depends what you're after I guess. Do you like blasting about (like me), or spend your time 'indoors' but with plenty of comforts? I think a decent sized sports cruiser is the compromise (35 to 40ft as mentioned) as if it's really blowing a stinker out you still have a cabin that you can have a few mates down and pass the day with some liquid lunch! That said, even on stinky days we're still under the canopy (loads of space and impossible to dirty) and just stick the heat on

 

[Greg2]

As others have said, do lots of research before you buy. As you are new to the pastime it is highly likely that your first boat will not be quite right. Every boat is a compromise and ownership is the only real sure fire way to start to properly understand what you like. Time invested in trawling the brokerages is time well spent and it is enjoyable to boot.

Main options are, I guess, sports cruiser, flybridge, aft-cabin (such as Broom) or coupe. There are variations on these themes and understanding what might work for you is a good first step. Experience will inevitably develop your taste and this will change over time. We have had four boats including a sports cruiser and two Brooms (aft cabin)....loved the speed thing for a few years but moved on to good sea keeping and comfort now

My advice would be not to stick to one area....travel the country as you will find that the market varies. Some areas seem to price their boats higher than others (Windermere being an example) and others may be more ready to do a deal. The south coast is an obvious one but also check out others. Sounds as though you have found Burton Waters and Essex Boatyards have also been suggested. Both have stock and brokerage boats. The only other outfit that do stock boats as well as brokerage are Norfolk Yacht Agency (they are a great outfit and we bought our boat as a stock boat from them...,before I get flamed I should say that my lad works for them). The benefit of a stock boat is that it will have been prepped by the dealer and you will get some form of warranty. With a brokerage boat it is 'buyer beware' so make share that you look carefully and get a survey done (including a mechanical inspection).

In terms of make the four main UK builders are Fairline, Sealine (just gone bust and some moulds gone to Hanse in Germany but plenty about on the used market), Sunseeker and Princess. All fairly safe buys in terms of quality (although this varies) and re-sale. There are other British builders such as Broom, Haines, Westwood etc who build quality boats. I see you are looking at a Birchwood.....just be aware that whilst they built some quality boats they have a mixed history as the company went through various iterations. Not reputed to be the best sea boats and re-sale is likely to be more difficult. American boats tend to be mass produced and consequently less expensive and there are European builders such as Azimut who compare with the likes of Princess.

Your budget is good in the used boat market and be prepared to make offers. A boat is worth what someone is prepared to pay for it and what someone is prepared to sell it for. Might sound obvious but the market means that asking prices are sometimes quite a way off the final sale price.

A bit of a ramble but hopefull of some help.......

 

[blueglass]

boats can be difficult to sell on and there is money to be lost in "working up" from a smaller boat. As others have said - lots of looking/trying/thinking and see if you can get it right first time, or at least near enough to keep you happy for several years.

 

[Andy Bav]

And lastly how do you finance a boat? I have looked on the internet for Marine Mortgages but havn't really found an answer yet...

Any advice would be gratefully received.

Tom.

An exciting time for you - and a wide target to aim at. We have a Bavaria and are very pleased with it and the price point meant we could buy new with warranties and all that comes with a new boat.

As we discovered you may find as your search progresses that your thought processes switch between newer and possibly smaller boats (that tick your boxes) or older and bigger boats... and then your mind starts to drift towards maintenance and up-keep of an older boat, and then it boils down to your confidence in dealing with any issues that could arise "on the hoof". I assume you have done your homework on berthing / marina fees and all other costs of ownership ?

There are a few threads on here discussing the merits of buying a boat with lots of engine hours versus a boat of a similar age with low engine hours and that may also give you some more information. However, as others have suggested stock boats with warranties etc will give you a good starting point. I agree with other comments as well that your first boat may not be the one you settle with - but then hopefully that is where advice on this forum may help you.

You could try SGB Finance based in Lymington aka GYLF (I think). Between them and Lombard I believe they are the main marine finance providers and I believe that if you buy new you can stretch the finance over a longer period. If you go to the boat shows they tend to do deals where they waive fees and other costs, so that could add some more cash to the pot for you.

If you do think new, dont be put off by what appear to be unaffordable screen prices. My advice would be to get some sort of in principal agreement to any finance before talking to the dealers, as you will find that as you are [technically] a cash buyer with no boat to sell, and who can move quickly, dealers will be very keen to deal with you.... and we found that walking away was quite a powerful tool to encourage them to sharpen their pencil.

Good luck with your choices.

 

[scubaman]

Hi Tom and welcome. Loads of good advice above, here's my tuppence worth on the matter. Buying a 'smaller' starter boat to play it safe has it's merits but as others have said, people who do this often end up searching for a bigger boat at the end of the first season and this will cause a lot of hassle and cost. My neighbor is currently doing just this, btw. When we were buying our first boat, largely on my wife's suggestion we went 'one step bigger' straight away and ended up staying with the same boat for eight years.

We then upgraded to a 2003 Sealine F37 and I have nothing but good things to say about her. Good accommodation, perfectly good sea keeping, modern looks and loads of practical details (as the stow away cockpit covers and table, swiveling flybridge helm seat / table arrangement, etc.). We spent four three-week holidays on her and found that the living spaces worked well. Ours had the separate shower on the stb side.

The finish might not be quite up there with the best but only actual problems we had were loose ceiling panels and other minor cosmetic faults that can and do fail with other marques as well.

I also found that prior to committing to any one boat, it was good to spend time looking a large number of different boats and different samples of your favorite. You'll learn something new on every visit you make.

Good luck!

 

[AllanG]

Have any of you had good or bad experiences with finance companies? Is there a preferred method other than 10 or 14 years with Lombard?

I have my loan with Lombard and find them good to deal with but, as others have said, there aren't too many competitors offering purely boat finance these days, so your options may be limited.

Is there any reason you specifically want a twin-engine set-up? I have a single engine Nimbus 320C, which would easily be within your budget, and whilst with four sleeping onboard it can be a bit cosy, it is a great sea boat, and the single engine helps keep the fuel and maintenance costs to a manageable level.

Anyway,.........good luck with whatever boat you finally decide upon.

Allan