New evidence prompts renewed speculation about cause of 1994 Baltic ferry disaster

[LittleSister]

852 died. Official report concluded bow door locks failed. New underwater footage show hull holed below the waterline. Collision with submarine? Explosion?

'New information' on Baltic ferry disaster that killed 852 to be assessed

 

[bikedaft]

no pics nor vid on Guardian website?

 

[LittleSister]

no pics nor vid on Guardian website?

Presumably the Discovery Channel wants you to watch their documentary, and/or wanted too much money from the Guardian. The situation may also be complicated by the legal action against the film-makers alleging violation of the designated grave.

p.s. pictures of the hole and vids (including trailer for documentary) here -
documentary-ms-estonia-has-a-large-hole-in-the-hull

 

[bikedaft]

Thanks for that. Will be intetesting to hear the outcome of the new investigation.

 

[cherod]

Presumably the Discovery Channel wants you to watch their documentary, and/or wanted too much money from the Guardian. The situation may also be complicated by the legal action against the film-makers alleging violation of the designated grave.

p.s. pictures of the hole and vids (including trailer for documentary) here -
documentary-ms-estonia-has-a-large-hole-in-the-hull

Thank you for that , most harrowing watch

 

[Kukri]

I remember it well. Hours earlier, I had been chatting to the MD of the long established Swedish shipowning company Nordström & Thulin, very well respected people, who were the minority shareholders with the Estonian Government in Estline.

I am not happy about the wreck being disturbed and filmed and I do not put any weight at all on the “new theory”. The car deck flooded; that was why she capsized. I do not see how a “hole in the hull” could do that, but the loss of the bow visor and the ramp most certainly would.

MS Estonia - Wikipedia

 

[Tomahawk]

That "hole" is across the waterline and folded inwards.

 

[sarabande]

I am not happy about the wreck being disturbed and filmed and I do not put any weight at all on the “new theory”. The car deck flooded; that was why she capsized. I do not see how a “hole in the hull” could do that, but the loss of the bow visor and the ramp most certainly would.

MS Estonia - Wikipedia

As a professional and experienced seaman, you must have reasons for being "unhappy". Would you like to share them with us ?

The free surface effect on the car deck is why the ferry capsized, but you appear to discount a breach in the hull allowing the sea to enter the car deck (or lower decks) from the side. The ship taking on a heel seems to have been pretty swift; I wonder if the water entering from the bow would have had that effect so quickly, rather than initially causing the ship to go bow down. There are numerous examples (Townsend Thorensen incl) of the cargo shifting in response to an unplanned angle of heel.

 

[jamie N]

Chum of mine was ROV pilot on the initial investigation, and quite unambiguous in thinking that the only reason for the tragedy were the bow doors.

 

[cherod]

Chum of mine was ROV pilot on the initial investigation, and quite unambiguous in thinking that the only reason for the tragedy were the bow doors.

and dismissed the hole in the hull , or did he venture a " reason " for its being ?

 

[JumbleDuck]

Chum of mine was ROV pilot on the initial investigation, and quite unambiguous in thinking that the only reason for the tragedy were the bow doors.

Presumably they are open or off now. I wonder ... if a substantial amount of water entered the car deck and swilled about, could it hammer open the doors from the inside? Are they designed to take a pounding from that direction?

 

[bikedaft]

Chum of mine was ROV pilot on the initial investigation, and quite unambiguous in thinking that the only reason for the tragedy were the bow doors.

maybe the hole in the hull is new/post sinking??

 

[bikedaft]

Presumably they are open or off now. I wonder ... if a substantial amount of water entered the car deck and swilled about, could it hammer open the doors from the inside? Are they designed to take a pounding from that direction?

there is vid of the bow door being recovered. i guess they took it ashore rather than chucking it back overboard??

 

[cherod]

maybe the hole in the hull is new/post sinking??

yes ?? ,, maybe something ran into it while it lay on the sea bed. ??

 

[matt1]

I'd like to have watched the documentary although it doesn't appear to be available in English. From what I read, the hole had appeared after the initial ROV survey many years ago, which has apparently become visible now because of the seabed subsequently shifting. I seem to remember they found the bow door several miles down course from where the ship rested, implying it left the boat some time before she sank?

 

[bikedaft]

yes ?? ,, maybe something ran into it while it lay on the sea bed. ??

trawls etc was what i was thinking. plenty wrecks get FV related damage. although it does seem a bit odd

 

[mainsail1]

There can only be one purpose in raising these questions at this late stage...........to make money out of misfortune.

 

[matt1]

Or to bring closure for the relatives, or to ensure the right lessons were learnt and not based on a false premise

 

[Deleted member 36384]

Over the years the Darbyshire loss had all sorts of reasons proposed for her sinking, mostly around her hull being so stressed during fabrication that the Typhoon split her open. This theory was supported by a surveyors notebook entries during construction that chain blocks etc had to be used to pull the steel into position on the prefabed sections to get alignment fir welding. Years later video evidence of the wreck identified that some pipe covers in the bow area had been knocked off in the storm. This allowed water to enter the bow section over a couple of days which led to the structural failure of the hull.

I think there must be a reason beyond just having a speculative look for the money to be spent on ROVs and a documentary. We should have a healthy degree of sceptaeism around investigations.

 

[cherod]

There can only be one purpose in raising these questions at this late stage...........to make money out of misfortune.

what about apportioning blame ??