My new project... MFV Elizmor

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We could all do it, provided it's something of interest and we can write a readable piece about it: just look at magazine columnists who write about their, sometimes mundane everyday life. Many comedians and commentators do no more than relate anecdotes about stuff with which we are all painfully familiar, we enjoy it because we can relate to it. See Michael McIntyre and the 'Man Drawer'. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RgUpDGAIdds

Now, I've got a few expensive problems with my boat, the hatch was ripped out in the storms and I want to trial a new hauling system.........
 
Iain C said:
Jesus people, lighten up, will you?

OK so there's been a bit of a cock up. Ellie should have had more info before she signed on the line, granted. But it's not a totally unreasonable assumption that if you found a boat in a boatyard for sale, you would be able to put it back in the water in the same manner it came out. I expect many of us would have made the same mistake, especially when caught up in the excitement of a new boat/home purchase. But then everything in life is easy, right? There's never any unforeseen issues, no? Incredible how all the bloody experts come crawling out the woodwork now rather than on page 1 of this thread. I'm sure we all understand Ellie's frustration, and also totally see the viewpoint of the yard too. I'm sure there will be a solution, even if it does come down to Ellie selling her other boat early, negotiating a discount from the lifters, biting the bullet and learning by experience.

And for goodness sake just drop it when it comes to the "handouts". No commercial operation would sponsor Elizmor unless they saw a return. We've covered this before. They didn't say "here, have some cash, go and buy yourself something nice". They gave the boat equipment, at minimal cost to themselves, that is mentioned time and time again on the UK's most popular sailing forum, the blog, and the forthcoming magazine articles in PBO. If this is too difficult a concept to grasp then I give up. Are you familiar with the concepts of advertising/product promotion/return on investment? Why don't you try and get some kit then? I guess they will say "no" as they feel you have nothing to offer in return.

There's clearly some very jealous people on this thread. Remarks about "big boat ego trip" are ridiculous. Does Ellie own a house? No, she has the boat instead. Perhaps therefor all homeowners are egotistical property tycoons? Incredible that people get so worked up over some fenders and a chart plotter whilst corporations fiddle tax, people fiddle benefits, and MPs fiddle expenses. Get a sense of perspective for goodness sake people and perhaps only contribute to the thread if you have something positive to say.

I don't see anyone flaming Dylan for the time and materials for the welly Centaur? No one calling "Shame on you Tohatsu" for offering him an outboard? Using the time of the chap from West Resins to improve Dylan's own personal holiday yacht, which shock horror he's going to sell at the end of the trip? Perhaps one of the naysayers can point out the difference, because right now I'm really struggling to see it. Two people, two boats, interesting stories, lots of great publicity and a strong internet and magazine presence...hmmm, I'm obviously missing something here. Help please people.

Good luck Ellie & Preston marina, I'm sure it will all get worked out soon. Keep the updates coming Ellie.
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Feeling a bit stressed this morning ?? JE and her sponsors must be loving all the in house fighting . More power to their elbows .
 
clyst said:
it's only out of the ordinary because someone bought a boat without doing their homework . The boat can be launched ,as I understand it it's the cost which is of concern .
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So not an occurrence happening every day in the NW TV region then.
 
Latestarter1 said:
For many years I was in the position to sponsor causes and in many cases many were marine. I had access to engines which for various reasons (ex-endurance testing, or simply redundant stock etc.) which we did not want to sell into the open market. However I did have one rule, donated equipment should always go to a body and not to an individual.

Eleanor is self-confessed live-aboard, no problem with that, she is also a smart operator and well versed in the power of marketing and the use of all the tools and experience at her disposal to purchase a very large vessel for a new home which under normal circumstances maybe beyond her means.
The type of vessel in question is not particularly rare and does come from well-respected builder, but despite all the euphoria over inclusion in the Register of Historic Ships simply gives Eleanor another lever to pull in the publicity game, nothing more nothing less.

Personally I believe that the industry owes Eleanor nothing, this is to be her home, this is not a charity and as for the gullible plonks who have donated money it leaves me staggered, I must remember this one, when I want to build an extension on my house, sponsor a brick would be a good wheeze.

Thank goodness Preston Marina felt the need in the face of the well-engineered media onslaught to put the whole matter into perspective.
Eleanor can have her big boat ego trip, however expecting concessions, hand outs or special discounts on services from our industry is a complete nonsense.
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Ohhhhh ,bliss. A voice of reason and sense in this emotive thread. Thank you.:)
 
To be quite frank what is beginning to happen on this thread is the typical British response to a successful person who has run into a challenging situation - rubbish them, slag them off, claim they had coming. Let’s face it the attributes are all there: young, female, successful, enterprising, confident; anathema to curmudgeon’s. At the end of the day it’s probably petty jealously that is being displayed.

Having found myself on a sticky wicket a couple of times in life where I was not in control of events, I can very well remember the tension, stress and sickening feelings of doubt. Perhaps these are being felt right now by the OP. The OP may be tough but it can’t help when the very media that the OP uses so effectively communicates a less supporting message.

So think about it a bit before ripping the OP apart: they are not actually doing anything wrong here, just trying to get an unforeseen problem addressed. How would you feel if you were in this situation?
 
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john said:
Ditto - good to hear a voice of reason. Let's put this thread to bed now and move on.
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No - this interesting stuff, there is no reason to "put this thread to bed now". It makes for good reading and I am very interested in the outcome.
 
Ellie is using Social Media to publicise her problem and to gain sponsorship which is totally fine, it's what Social Media thrives on, but she's experienced enough in the business to know that it's an unruly beast and by its nature can't be controlled. The suggestion in another thread of setting up a "Save Ellie" fund has I suspect done her no good at all, it's painted her in the character of wanting hand outs rather than fairly swapping equipment for publicity. Now there's a new angle with a tin being rattled in our faces the thing has got way out of control, if I was Ellie I'd step in and decline the offer of a "Save Ellie" fund and just let Preston marina carry on sorting it out; to be honest they seem like a calm and professional bunch.
 
Cardo said:
I may get flamed for this, but I really feel the urge to ask...

Ellie, why have a number of companies "sponsored" you? I see Garmin gave you a plotter, that fender co. gave you a load of fenders, and now Lewmar have supplied you a 50kg anchor.
As I understand it, this isn't some charity event, you're simply sorting out your new boat for you to live on. I appreciate you have a blog, and you post about stuff on here. Much like many other people do, who also live on boats.

I live on a boat, and I have a blog. Should I be asking the various companies to provide me free kit? I'd be quite happy to plaster their company logo on my blog if it would get me freebies.

This may be a tinge of jealousy, seeing as I've paid for all the goodies on my boat; but I simply don't understand why you're getting free stuff?

In my case, it doesn't encourage me to purchase stuff from those companies. :confused:
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I wish Ellie well, she's had the balls to contact the various suppliers and ask for their help and some have agreed. It's up to them to agree or not. I personally would not ask, along with many others. That she has is not a reason to criticise her, surely.

I agree with much of what LS says in his recent reply, but ultimately it's non of our concern, only that of the parties involved. And it was good to read the views of the marina, interesting to hear why the launch is a problem for them. Seems that JE is just going to have to bite the bullet and pay the going rate. But as has already been said, in a few months/years she'll have forgotten how much the cost was.
 
Latestarter1 said:
Personally I believe that the industry owes Eleanor nothing, this is to be her home, this is not a charity and as for the gullible plonks who have donated money it leaves me staggered, I must remember this one, when I want to build an extension on my house, sponsor a brick would be a good wheeze.
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To be fair if you want a new conservatory and go to a conservatory builder and your house is in the 'right' location and you are willing to show tom dick and harry round it and act as a reference site for them you'll be able to get a sizable discount. I've negotiated discounts on replacement windows in that my whole street had wooden windows fitted at the same time and I knew I'd kept reasonable care of them but they were still well past their best and so the rest of the streets must be too. So if they get the job to fit mine and do it well (whole other story!) then the people in the street will ask who fitted them (or just read it from their van) and so they get a 'free' advert by getting the job with me. It took a good few phone calls to make it happen and some hard ball negotiation. Wasn't free though.

But if you look at the value of what she's had "free" its not massive. But she's writing an article on getting the boat on the water for PBO and then I'd fully expect a follow-up article for the passage South which I'm sure will be an interesting read. She was a published author at 15 so she must be good with her words. So when she writes about getting stuck in some squall and having to get anchored I'm sure the article will say "I chucked the 50kg Lewmar Delta over the side, confident it would hold me in any sea, then watched on the Garmin plotter as she steadied on the chain and came to a stop" rather than "we put our rather old and rusty fisherman's anchor over the side knowing it wouldn't stand a chance but feeling we needed to try something as the rocks got ever closer, while frantically taking transit bearings and trying to plot them on our paper charts"...

People have already commented that they'd never heard of boatfenders.co.uk but would take a look when they next needed some. That was a very successful bit of sponsorship! Lewmar, Garmin and Icom are all well known. But if you are Garmin and think there is mileage in making a donation then you also have at the back of your mind that she'll have asked Raymarine and whoever else, so would I rather my company name is being mentioned than theirs...

If I was getting a letter from Ellie or a random Solent Sailor I'm going to go with Ellie because (1)she has proven she can get media presence (here, her blog etc) plus her digital marketing skills, (2)she has a mag article already secured (3) she has an adventure planned which I'm guessing not many people have done. However if Mr Solent Sailor comes and says he's planning a passage that is a serious challenge and will attract some media coverage... my moeny may go that way. 26 RHIBs went Round Ireland last summer in 10 days (well not all made it round but 26 started). They had some significant adventures. Discussed on rib fora, MASSIVE article in Power Boat and RIB mag this month. Some got kit donated. A risk for the company actually as many of them experiences kit failures which of course have been mentioned in the articles. Even stalwart kit like Icom radios misted up. **BUT** they were properly challenging some of that kit.

Thats a big boat to squidg fenders with, a heavy boat to anchor. If the big version works for her we'd all assume the smaller versions will work on our white plastic. Likewise if she uses a Garmin and an Icom and they work then no reason they wouldn't be good enough for our smaller boats... Actually I doubt Ellie will be out of mobile contact and could use an iPad!

Same applies anywhere where people spend money... ...if you want to get your kit noticed you get the 'big names' using it and talking about it so that the rest of us think we need it... If you are a gardener and the person who grows the best potatoes on the allotment uses a specific method you ask him what he does. If you post about your gardening on a blog and forum and write for gardening weekly about turning a bit of waste land into an allotment you might stand a chance of getting a new spade from Dobbies and a bag of seed potatoes from Thomson and Morgan in return for some publicity...

Cardo said:
I may get flamed for this, but I really feel the urge to ask...

Ellie, why have a number of companies "sponsored" you? <snip>
As I understand it, this isn't some charity event, you're simply sorting out your new boat for you to live on.
<snip>
Much like many other people do, who also live on boats.

I live on a boat, and I have a blog. Should I be asking the various companies to provide me free kit?
<snip>
but I simply don't understand why you're getting free stuff?
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I think there are a few things that do make Ellie stand out as different. I know nothing about you so perhaps you have some unique selling points. The boat while not unique is pretty big. Few people with liveaboards that size would move them by sea down the country (maybe from one London Marina to another). She has plans to move about on the South Coast once there. But the challenge is getting it in the water and down there...

She has some character. She knows about marketing.

Personally I think the boat is a monstrosity! But each to there own. There is a house round the corner from me thats probably with £500k+ but I wouldn't live in it if you paid me! I can certainly see its not a small live yacht with not much space.

In my case, it doesn't encourage me to purchase stuff from those companies. :confused:
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Unless its turned you off those companies its done them no harm. And trust me there is a very good chance you'll have sub-consciously absorbed something. So when you need fenders will you perhaps check the price on boatfenders.co.uk? I think what you are saying is if your local chandler wants £20 a fender and boatfenders want £30 you aren't going to get boatfenders ones just because they sponsored Ellie. That said if Ellie in an article is able to point out a special feature that makes them worth the extra you might! More likely they both want £20... but Ellie tells you in an article they seem to be lasting better than the local chandler ones on the boat next door. Marketing complete.

Radio and GPS - I suspect are harder. But it only takes a few well placed words like "easy user interface", "installed in seconds" to either make you decide the extra £10 is worth it to make using it easier or to just provide you confirmation that the decision you thought you'd already made is right...

Anchor - not something I've ever spent time considering what to buy. Would I now spend an extra minute looking at the difference between a Lewmar and a generic clone - maybe. If I anchored in dangerous places and left the boat there in any conditions would I want to feel a few extra pounds on the best brand was worth spending - yes. And if I'm reassured that a huge boat that size "picked" a Lewmar CQR style rather and a danforth style maybe that helps my decision.
 
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BlowingOldBoots said:
To be quite frank what is beginning to happen on this thread is the typical British response to a successful person who has run into a challenging situation - rubbish them, slag them off, claim they had coming. Let’s face it the attributes are all there: young, female, successful, enterprising, confident; anathema to curmudgeon’s. At the end of the day it’s probably petty jealously that is being displayed.

Having found myself on a sticky wicket a couple of times in life where I was not in control of events, I can very well remember the tension, stress and sickening feelings of doubt. Perhaps these are being felt right now by the OP. The OP may be tough but it can’t help when the very media that the OP uses so effectively communicates a less supporting message.

So think about it a bit before ripping the OP apart: they are not actually doing anything wrong here, just trying to get an unforeseen problem addressed. How would you feel if you were in this situation?
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spot on boots and no need to close thread, those miserable sods who wish that without offering any encouragement or advice should just put thread on ignore but we know they won't - keep positive ellie
 
GrahamD said:
It's called a human interest story. Ellie has chosen an ambitious project and is now in a bit of a pickle. A marine version of "Grand designs?"
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Pretty much exactly it.

Now you aren't telling me some of the Grand Design guys don't get a favour or a discount because the media are watching. I'm watching, I might now be thinking I'd like to replace all the walls in my house with glass windows held up by nothing but magnets and string. I google for suitable companies and call them up and they say yeh we did the Grand Designs house and I know even though there were problems they got it sorted. We all expect problems so I write my cheque to this company... You might not realise it but thats all been thought through by the marketeers already...

If only those magnets didn't affect the compass I could build my boat the same way too ;-)
 
Shuggy said:
Good on you, J_E. I didn't buy an old wreck until I was 34 and wish I could have done it sooner.
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That's really very funny, well done. ;)

I'm hoping that Ellie has wisely decided not to post here again until a decision has been reached or something worth reporting has happened. With luck it'll be soon.

I'm dropping out now. We've become a hubbub - might as well be lot of old women outside the bridal suite, gossiping about how productive the wedding-night might have been.

Best of luck, Ellie. Get ready to sign over what the lifters first requested - otherwise I reckon Elizmor could be another summer on the quayside. :(
 
I've been im the position of asking for help from Garmin, and I can assure everyone that you don't get deals from them without there being a very clear and demonstrable payback. We couldn't, and we had a lot going for us - except we couldn't guarantee exposure, so no deal even though we might have ended up with a product they could offer with their equipment.
 
I wouldn't be surprised if Ellie's walked away form this thread/forum.

I'm frankly a bit embarrassed by the negative, stone throwing attitude of many members. This is a real human being, not a celebrity poster. She actually reads these posts, and might be genuinely hurt by the downright nasty comments.

She's smarter than you, and got a load of freebies for whatever reason. Good luck to her. I wish I was that smart, but you don't see me knocking her for it.
But good old British keyboard warriors need to bolster their flagging egos by knocking what she did.
They did the same with Dylan and his unusual quest too.

I guess if you stick your head up, there'll always be someone to try and knock it off. Maybe it comes with the territory but I'm still ashamed of you guys.

I read this thread because I'm interested to hear what the next hurdle she overcomes is. but I've cringed reading the last 3 pages. Don't you remember your mother saying, if you've got nothing good to say, don't say it?
 
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