Moorings in Spain

[Ship's Puss]

Newbie here! (I would put up a pic but couldn't work out how)
We're hopefully looking to retire to Spain in a few years time.
How does it work there? Do you buy a mooring or rent them?
And what are the average mooring fees for a 40, a 45 and a 50 foot boat?
We can't ( yet!) agree on location but like either around Marbella or Denia/Moraira . And the length depends on how much we've saved, gleaned and won before then!
Thanks in advance
Cheers

Puss

 

[Nautorius]

Newbie here! (I would put up a pic but couldn't work out how)
We're hopefully looking to retire to Spain in a few years time.
How does it work there? Do you buy a mooring or rent them?
And what are the average mooring fees for a 40, a 45 and a 50 foot boat?
We can't ( yet!) agree on location but like either around Marbella or Denia/Moraira . And the length depends on how much we've saved, gleaned and won before then!
Thanks in advance
Cheers

Puss

Hello Puss,

At the moment it is easier to rent (lots of availability)

12m Berth (Excluding Banus is average) €8500 per annum
15m Berth (Excluding banus) is average €11,000 per annum.

However there are deals to be done so expect a discount! There are cheaper Marinas such as Marina Alcaidesa in La Linea (Next to Gibraltar) where you would pay €4500 and €5200 respectively. Or Gibraltar where prices are approx £5200 and £6200 respectively and Tax free goods.

I think if you are spending time in the Marina on the boat it is more about community (think Gibraltar or La Duquesa)

Also remember if you are in Spain more than 6 months and become resident you are liable for local taxation (Wealth Tax, Matriculation Tax on the boat as well) and may need to swop UK qualifications for Spanish ones.

Cheers

Paul from Gibraltar!

 

[Ship's Puss]

Thanks Paul. Not sure if we'll taking up residency or not, depends on the rules! (My folks moved to Spain and took residency )
The mooring fees seem comparable to what we pay at the Marina we are in, so no nasty surprises
Hadn't thought about converting licences - we don't have any at the mo - so it might be worth us doing them in Spain.
We won't be able to move move for about 9 odd years - but I like to plan in advance!
Cheers

Puss

 

[chinita]

We won't be able to move move for about 9 odd years - but I like to plan in advance!

Work on 2,300,000 Pesetas per cubic millimetre + one off Matriculation Tax of 125% of the value of your boat X four tenths of the grab co-efficient of your Delta anchor + 85% VAT and you should not be too far out

 

[lovezoo]

Thanks Paul. Not sure if we'll taking up residency or not, depends on the rules! (My folks moved to Spain and took residency )
The mooring fees seem comparable to what we pay at the Marina we are in, so no nasty surprises
Hadn't thought about converting licences - we don't have any at the mo - so it might be worth us doing them in Spain.
We won't be able to move move for about 9 odd years - but I like to plan in advance!
Cheers

Puss

Provided you import the boat and take up residency at the same time, there is no matriculation tax to pay (same goes for your car). If you move first then try and do the import more than a few months later, you have to pay the tax. So its worth making your mind up in advance to save a few €000s.

Re doing licenses:-

Non Resident: You can do your RYA qualifications in Spain in English.

Resident: You can convert your RYA qualifications, but if you don't have any you will have to get Spanish licenses and sit your test in Spanish.

Same applies to your driving license.

Its a lot of hassle, but the thermometer in my garden was reading 27C in the sun today.

 

[Hurricane]

Thanks Paul. Not sure if we'll taking up residency or not, depends on the rules! (My folks moved to Spain and took residency )
The mooring fees seem comparable to what we pay at the Marina we are in, so no nasty surprises
Hadn't thought about converting licences - we don't have any at the mo - so it might be worth us doing them in Spain.
We won't be able to move move for about 9 odd years - but I like to plan in advance!
Cheers

Puss

I'm not Spanish resident but it seems the advice on this thread is good.
So many different views but the points made here all seem correct to me.

I'd just add one little thing.
If you spend more than 183 days in Spain they will want you to become resident for tax.
That will mean all your assets in Spain will come under their rules.
Matriculation tax for one.
So, IMO you need to decide from the outset if you are going to be resident so that you can take the boat into Spain with you and thus avoid any matriculation tax.

Also there is a wealth tax operating for the next couple of years for residents and non-residents. I believe there's an allowance of 700,00 euros on wealth tax.

We are berthed a little further north than you are suggesting - Sant Carles - a British run marina (well mostly owned by a British company anyway - MDL)

 

[Ship's Puss]

Thanks very much folks - really appreciate your taking time to reply.
Apart from your garden temp lovezoo - its chuffing cold here!

Puss

 

[Nautorius]

Provided you import the boat and take up residency at the same time, there is no matriculation tax to pay (same goes for your car). If you move first then try and do the import more than a few months later, you have to pay the tax. So its worth making your mind up in advance to save a few €000s.

QUOTE]

Although Matriculation Tax would not be due in that case you would have to re-register it as a Spanish Flagged vessel and Pay 12% registration tax on the value of the boat at time of import! They get you all ways!

Paul

 

[lovezoo]

Provided you import the boat and take up residency at the same time, there is no matriculation tax to pay (same goes for your car). If you move first then try and do the import more than a few months later, you have to pay the tax. So its worth making your mind up in advance to save a few €000s.

QUOTE]

Although Matriculation Tax would not be due in that case you would have to re-register it as a Spanish Flagged vessel and Pay 12% registration tax on the value of the boat at time of import! They get you all ways!

Paul

It isnt legal to tax a private individual in that way in the EU. There is no tax payable if an EU cutizen takes his property with him when he moves within the EU.

 

[Hurricane]

Provided you import the boat and take up residency at the same time, there is no matriculation tax to pay (same goes for your car). If you move first then try and do the import more than a few months later, you have to pay the tax. So its worth making your mind up in advance to save a few €000s.

QUOTE]

Although Matriculation Tax would not be due in that case you would have to re-register it as a Spanish Flagged vessel and Pay 12% registration tax on the value of the boat at time of import! They get you all ways!

Paul

I'm with lovezoo on this one - thats not what I thought.

 

[Nautorius]

It isnt legal to tax a private individual in that way in the EU. There is no tax payable if an EU cutizen takes his property with him when he moves within the EU.

Correct, however that is not what Registration Tax is. Registration Tax is not a Tax on the Individual or the Asset. It is a Tax Charge on the Registeration of the Boat under the spanish flag. You re-register her as a Spanish Flagged vessel and the charge for registration is 12% of boat Value. By law, a Spanish Resident can only operate a Spanish flagged vessel so you have to re-register and pay the Tax.

The Tax authorities have been clamping down in Sotogrande and La Duquesa in relation to this. Several boats seized pending payment.

Paul

 

[Lozzer]

Just went for a run on my friends boat weather fantastic here. End of January and still high teens early 20's. This is going to be a short winter when it arrives..

 

[Lozzer]

Nautorious


You will be amazed at the deals you will get in Banus now. I reckon I can get an 18m berth on pier 1 or 2 for around 12k for the year.

Considering when I had a charter business here I was paying 5k per month during the summer 5 years ago. The times have changed.....

 

[lovezoo]

Correct, however that is not what Registration Tax is. Registration Tax is not a Tax on the Individual or the Asset. It is a Tax Charge on the Registeration of the Boat under the spanish flag. You re-register her as a Spanish Flagged vessel and the charge for registration is 12% of boat Value. By law, a Spanish Resident can only operate a Spanish flagged vessel so you have to re-register and pay the Tax.

The Tax authorities have been clamping down in Sotogrande and La Duquesa in relation to this. Several boats seized pending payment.

Paul

Sorry Paul, but that still doesn't apply to an EU resident moving to Spain taking his property with him. It is illegal to charge any kind of tax. If however they don't register the car/boat within a few months of moving though, they are liable to pay tax, which is perhaps what you are referring to in Sotogrande to boats that have been there some time.

 

[lovezoo]

And for future reference this is an extract from the directive:-

According to Council Directive 83/183/EEC of 28 March 1983 on tax exemptions applicable to permanent imports from a Member State of the personal property of individuals, the Member State to which a car is permanently transferred may tax use of the car in that State but that a transfer alone may not be taxed provided the car in question has been acquired under the general conditions of taxation in force in the domestic market of the Member State where it originated.
So, according to this Directive a Member State must "exempt personal property imported permanently from another Member State by private individuals from turnover tax, excise duty and other consumption taxes which normally apply to such property.
All taxes levied simply because a car is transferred from one Member State to another when its owner moves house are therefore prohibited.

However, there are some conditions to be exempted from vehicle import taxes:
- the vehicle concerned must actually have been used by the person concerned before his change of residence; Member States may require such use for a period of at least 6 months prior to the change of residence
- the vehicle must be transferred to the "importing" Member State not later than 12 months after its owner transfers his normal place of residence
- the "imported" vehicle may not be disposed of, hired out or lent during the 12 months following its duty-free "importation", except in circumstances duly justified to the satisfaction of the competent authorities of the Member State of "importation" .

And in an amendment in 1989 (89/604/EEC) they added:

...of which the person concerned has had the actual use before the change of residence is effected or the secondary residence established. In the case of motor-driven vehicles (including their trailers), caravans, mobile homes, pleasure boats and private aircraft, Member States may require that the person concerned should have had the use of them for a period of at least six months before the change of residence.

 

[Ship's Puss]

Pesky tax laws!
Def food for thought and planning.
We saw the Prestige 500 fly bridge at the boat show and really liked that, might have to consider a smaller one depending on what the taxes are like in a few years. We were considering buying in Spain rather than take one with us, which may be a better option tax wise.

Puss

 

[Steve Clayton]

We can't ( yet!) agree on location but like either around Marbella or Denia/Moraira . !
Thanks in advance
Cheers

Puss

You won't get into (berth rental) Moraira or Javea (not size; it's a virtual closed shop in these 2 marinas); you might get into Greenwich with better chances in Altea, Calpe and Denia (Denia has 3 marinas now that can take up to 50 footers).

Nobody (I think) has mentioned the G5 tax (for a non-Spanish flagged boat) that you will pay in Valencia region.

If you're looking for a place to stay in the Moraira area for local exploration etc. then drop me a private message

Seraph in Denia:

Edit: just realised - piccie of a yacht in the MB forum!

 

[Paulken]

hi there

new to this site , have you had a chance to look at Alicante marina ? close to airport and you would more likely to get a berth there than moraira. have you bought a boat yet ? what size is the boat ? we have a berth in Alicante, 12m by 4.8m for sale.

paul

 

[Ship's Puss]

Thanks for replying,
We like the Denia area ( my folks live not far from there) so Alicante is a bit far for us, but our plans are for the future in 8-10 years, I just like to plan well ahead!
Cheers
Puss