Militant dredger required

[Twister_Ken]

For reasons too tedious to recount I found myself on the shores of Pagham Harbour (one stop east of Selsey Bill) on Saturday. Jolly nice it is too. One problem, the birding community has got it banned for boats, and it has silted up a bit. Lots of jolly green oystercatchers and lesser spotted red-backed whimbrels. Not a boat in sight. And this was once a thriving harbour, so I'm told.

How do boaters fight back against birders?

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.writeforweb.com/twister1>Let's Twist Again</A>

 

[zefender]

Install wind generators!

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[AndrewB]

It is nice, isn\'t it?

Looks like the upper parts of Chichester harbour did, back in the '60s before the yachts ran riot. No antifouling, no diesel spills, no marine loos, no propellor wash constantly churning up the mud.

Long live the birds!

 

[Evadne]

Re: It is nice, isn\'t it?

Sorry Ken I have to agree with the birds here. Our mooring is in one of the less well used parts of Chichester harbour: lots of dunlin, godwits, curlew, egrets et. al. as well as the odd seal. Other parts of the harbour reflect the bustle of the Solent, and are relatively barren but if you want a quiet spot, head up Emsworth channel and turn left at Mill Rythe, but don't try it before half-tide, and don't lose the channel or you'll still be there next week. We don't need to disturb Pagham to find a nice place to moor or anchor, but there are some creatures that only thrive with the absence of humans. I don't begrudge them one small silted up harbour.

Speaking of animals, some friends saw some dolphins in the solent on Sunday, did anyone else see them?

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[oldgit]

Hah no chance mate.All i wanted was a titchy little airport built nice and handy at Cliffe,barely escaped with me life.Youse no chance luvvy./forums/images/icons/laugh.gif

<hr width=100% size=1>Two boats please one here n one in the Med

 

[sea urchin]

Pagham Harbour : How do boaters fight back against birders?

I am puzzled as you refer to boats being banned.
The byelaws for Pagham Harbour identify the tidal area of the harbour as a "public waterway", over which navigation is permitted. See the following link to the current byelaws:-
http://www.westsussex.gov.uk/cs/committee/pagharbour/pagharbour250106i6c.pdf
sections 1 (e) and 2 (xvii)
This is what you would expect to find in byelaws as a recognition of the public rights of navigation, in tidal waters, (see RYA book "Yachtsman's Lawyer" by Edmund Whelan p 76).

Bird spotters however, may like to pretend these rights dont exist.

 

[NDG]

It is very nice. Its also only a few feet deep at the moment.

It would also be ruined if it was dredged and taken over by moorings, pontoons, shower blocks, car parks. I'm with the birders on this one.

Nick

 

[[2068]]

You can't launch boats, or do "Watersports" without a permit, but it's not a restricted waterway - I don't see anything that says you couldn't potter around in a tender at high tide.

 

[Evadne]

Rule 2 (xvi)

"Mooring or leaving or launching any vessel of any kind
whatsoever, except in an emergency."

Rule 2 (xvii)

"Propelling (by any means whatsoever) any vessel of any
kind howsoever navigated propelled or moved on the
surface or through the water on an area or stretch of water
other than a public waterway except in an emergency."

Fairly comprehensive, I think. You can sail or motor in and out using the public waterways (fairways?), but no landing, anchoring or creek hopping.

P.S. It's not often I've found myself contributing twice to the same thread, six years apart.

 

[Observer]

http://www.westsussex.gov.uk/cs/committee/pagharbour/pagharbour250106i6c.pdf

The document file name/location is intriguing:

"G:\Graphics\Victoria's Fun File\Gary Rustell"

 

[fireball]

(iv) Taking, molesting or intentionally disturbing, injuring or
killing any living creature

Hmm - so if you go for a walk and get bitten by a mossie you can't touch it!!

(vi) Intentionally removing or displacing any tree, shrub,
fungus, plant, or part thereof, or any unfashioned mineral
thing including water.

So you can't throw stones into the water or paddle in it at all?

 

[sea urchin]

Anchoring & intriguing title

The file name is intriguing. It is the document published on the West Sussex County Council website attached to the Agenda of the Harbour Advisory Board meeting. see item 6c
http://www.westsussex.gov.uk/cs/committee/pagharbour/pagharbour250106age.pdf

It is the same byelaws as the council still hand out (minus the intriguing title). 1997 edition.

The rights of navigation include anchoring according to "The Yachtsman's Lawyer (Whelan RYA): "The owner of a vessel may anchor, run aground and sail back and forth." (p76) - but may not establish a permanent mooring without permission.

Are birding and boating mutually exclusive? With tolerance, and sensitivity of the needs of the wildlife, then both might coexist. Now it is silted up, I cant imagine it turning into a Poole Harbour, but just a nice place to quietly enjoy, and probably requiring local knowledge to do so from the water.

 

[fireball]

Hmm - the full colour map is interesting - according to that, Pagham harbour is fresh water ... ??!

 

[sea urchin]

The map is as intriguing as the file name! The O S map shows MHWM around the harbour edge, if the harbour were a freshwater lagoon, then the MHWM would cross the harbour mouth.

The map with the 1997 byelaws (not on the website) is based on the OS map. Perhaps the revised map is a geological prophesy, about a catastrophe in the making!
A bit of a shock for the waterfowl - the freshwater might not be to their taste!

 

[fireball]

So - could we safely assume that if the map is incorrect then the byelaws are not enforcable? Who's up for a bit of mooring laying this weekend?!

 

[sea urchin]

mmmmmm! That may be a bit rash. But found this .......
www.ryase.org.uk/site/request.php?25
Bottom of page 3 of the newsletter says: "Pagham Harbour
RYA will be submitting formal objections to the draft bylaws sent by West Sussex CC to the Secretary of State for ratification. RYA had not been consulted formally, and has unearthed a number of problems".

Cant see a problem with anchoring though.

 

[moodycruiser]

Are birding and boating mutually exclusive?

Seems to work OK in Newtown, plenty of birds still there and plenty of boats.

 

[pagham pomarine]

Birding boat, boating birder

Birding and boating together - I have an idea. A small solar boat (baby sister to the Chichester conservancy solar boat?) could offer birders the opportunity to get up close to the sea birds. They could get great photos too, and help the non birders to learn about their featherd friends! It would be carbon neutral too, and offer a gentle ride for disabled bird spotters.

A pontoon by the Pagham Harbour visitor centre would be ideal to tie off.

 

[sea urchin]

Its also only a few feet deep at the moment.

It would also be ruined if it was dredged and taken over by moorings, pontoons, shower blocks, car parks. I'm with the birders on this one.

Nick

The depth would depend on the state of the tide. Most of the harbour dries at low tide, but the channels do not dry out even at low springs. At high springs (5.5m @ Littlehampton), there would be at least 4 metres in the channels, and a metre plus over most of the rest of the Harbour. At high spring tide you can get up the channel to Sidlesham.

However, the channels are not marked or charted, and you either need local knowledge, and/or accurate equipment, in a boat that can take the ground.

Shower blocks, car parks, pontoons and moorings would certainly ruin it. It is a nature reserve, so these things would not be allowed anyway. But a nice place to anchor quietly to observe the wildlife.

 

[elton]

How do boaters fight back against birders?

Plonk loads of bird seed on the ground once in a while just around the corner?