Mast climbing: Will 8mm rope REALLY take my weight?

[Crabman]

What time and where is this happening so we can have a good laugh. Have you got good insurance, what colour flowers would you like . Seriously if your not sure use two halyards or get someone to do it for you who know what they are doing.

 

[fireball]

I agree with that but I've got fed up of saying it and the negative reaction that comes. I keep telling people not to use powered winches for mast climbing to be basically called a fool.

I use ascenders anyway - because I don't expect SWMBO or F-i-Law to be able to winch my hulk up the mast ... far better to use my legs I feel! ...

Anyway ...

Ok - Genuine question ... If my coachtop winches were set up to be powered rather than manual ... then why would I NOT use them for climbing the mast?

Assume normal 2nd line safety ...

 

[Vara]

I use ascenders anyway - because I don't expect SWMBO or F-i-Law to be able to winch my hulk up the mast ... far better to use my legs I feel! ...

Anyway ...

Ok - Genuine question ... If my coachtop winches were set up to be powered rather than manual ... then why would I NOT use them for climbing the mast?

Assume normal 2nd line safety ...

Yep that puzzles me as well, just interest as I don't have power winches.

 

[Norman_E]

I use ascenders anyway - because I don't expect SWMBO or F-i-Law to be able to winch my hulk up the mast ... far better to use my legs I feel! ...

Anyway ...

Ok - Genuine question ... If my coachtop winches were set up to be powered rather than manual ... then why would I NOT use them for climbing the mast?

Assume normal 2nd line safety ...

There was a very nasty accident, in which a woman lost her hand when pulled into the winch, and a man who came to her assistance lost some fingers. The advice from the winch makers was not to use a power winch in self tailing mode, but tail the rope by hand.

 

[Cardo]

There was a very nasty accident, in which a woman lost her hand when pulled into the winch, and a man who came to her assistance lost some fingers. The advice from the winch makers was not to use a power winch in self tailing mode, but tail the rope by hand.

The powered winch failed to stop winching when the person was nearing the top of the mast. The wife panicked and got her forearm stuck in the winch. This was severed off. A nearby skipper came over to try and help however ended up losing 8 (I think) fingers. Further help appeared and they flipped the trip switch to stop the winch.

As above, feel free to use a powered winch, however tail it off yourself.

 

[fireball]

There was a very nasty accident, in which a woman lost her hand when pulled into the winch, and a man who came to her assistance lost some fingers. The advice from the winch makers was not to use a power winch in self tailing mode, but tail the rope by hand.

The powered winch failed to stop winching when the person was nearing the top of the mast. The wife panicked and got her forearm stuck in the winch. This was severed off. A nearby skipper came over to try and help however ended up losing 8 (I think) fingers. Further help appeared and they flipped the trip switch to stop the winch.

As above, feel free to use a powered winch, however tail it off yourself.

Thanks both - I recall hearing the headline of the incident but didn't pay too much attention.
Getting trapped in winches is a hazard on any boat - usually on lines that are being loosened, but powered winches does give you the issue on hauling in too.

Manual tailing will allow the user to slip the line should the winch malfunction - but perhaps there should be a kill switch (like an outboard has) that allows you to quickly disable a runaway winch. Or just a punch switch (on the top of the unit where you'd insert a handle) to power it off...

 

[Vara]

Thanks for that, that incident had passed me by.

 

[Iain C]

And ignoring what happens down at the winch end there's plenty of scope for ripping out fittings or your bosun's chair trying to dissapear into the mast sheaves with the inevitable...

 

[Bobobolinsky]

Bought a reel of light line (2 or 3 mm. Flag halyard stuff) to use for mousing halyards. It carried a label with a SWL of 100kg, a little less than my weight. For fun, I hauled a length up the mast, cleated it off, tied a bowline a couple of feet above the deck, and stepped into it, like a stirrup. It stretched almost down to deck level, but it held my weight.

8mm: piece of cake.

Just a matter of confidence, if a man of my physique can prussic on 3mm static line, then you can do it. Just learn to tie the right knots.

 

[Pete7]

I'm worried whether 8mm is enough for one, looks like it will support a football team! Wotcha think?

We have one of those too and very good they are too. I am good for about 40 minutes before the body says enough and I have to come back down. It should come with a seat belt type widget as well which is supposed to hold you to the mast but I put it though the top loop and round the top of the mast instead when at the top because we use the spinnaker rope for a harness.

Our topping lift is 8mm, but it's not the rope that is the worry, but the little metal u shaped widget on the end. Fine for supporting the boom at rest but needs a proper knot to tie the mast ladder on or a decent carabiner.

Pete

 

[Bav34]

Jeez Judders, SSD and Crabman.

I really don't think that you understood the question.

1. I plan to climb the mast using steps attached to a 8mm topping lift.

2. I will have the main halyard attached to me as a safety line.

3. My crew will be tailing the 'slack' safety line keeping just enough tension to prevent a fall should the topping lift or associated equipment fail but not so much as to interfere with the climb.

4. The reason that I have chosen the thinner topping lift for the climb is that, as stated in the posts, I wouldn't want it as THE safety line due to load on it should I fall ... see LittleSister post.

5. My ONE concern was the discrepancy between what I could SEE ... a reasonably thin rope vs. what I READ ... it is more than strong enough.

Have YOU never asked for advice when you have a doubt over a serious issue or as per the PC brigade do we have to pass questions through you first to see whether we should even contemplate the action behind the question?

To the rest of you, many thanks.

TK ... that must have hurt your foot

 

[Jacana]

I went up my mast on a 10mm halyard only to observe it chafed half through on the spreaders as we passed part way up.

My rigger always uses his own line

 

[Baggywrinkle]

For some light bedtime reading try this ....

http://lamountaineers.org/xRopes.pdf

And here's an article on mast climbing ...

http://www.practical-sailor.com/blog/Going_Aloft_Safely-10439-1.html

 

[mcframe]

The idea of using the topping lift didn't occur to me until I looked here where even 3 strand Polypropylene shows a breaking strain of 960 kilos!!!

Or 12 of me!!!

My topping lift looks like Cruising Dyneema = 2500 kgs! Good grief.

http://www.marlowropes.com/index.ph...el-v12&catid=51:dinghy-windsurfing&Itemid=243

5mm, claimed good for 2405Kg - a friend bought some 3mm, and now claims he has the strongest bootlaces in the world ;->

 

[Pye_End]

Been wondering about a singlehanded version to this issue.

How about attaching both topping lift and halyard to the steps, but also dangling a climbing rope from the same place (may need a carabiner), and using an abseiling clog (something like this http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/inde...code/E5310010/id_colour/180/group/243/level/3) as the safety line. Presumably this would arrest any fall, but also allow you to abseil down, if you felt the need.

 

[Judders]

Jeez Judders, SSD and Crabman.

I really don't think that you understood the question.

Suit yourself, if you think you can find everything you need to know about climbing the mast safely here then it's your funeral. All I am saying is that it would be best to get someone with experience to be there with you. If that is such a daft concept to you then that's your problem; not mine.

 

[Judders]

http://www.marlowropes.com/index.ph...el-v12&catid=51:dinghy-windsurfing&Itemid=243

5mm, claimed good for 2405Kg - a friend bought some 3mm, and now claims he has the strongest bootlaces in the world ;->

Truth is though, when you've bought the mast with the standing rigging in place, you can never be quite sure what it actually is unless you really know your string. More importantly, what we do know is that the rope will usually be stronger than the fittings it runs through, particularly on an off the shelf Selden rig.

 

[Bav34]

Suit yourself, if you think you can find everything you need to know about climbing the mast safely here then it's your funeral. All I am saying is that it would be best to get someone with experience to be there with you. If that is such a daft concept to you then that's your problem; not mine.

You still don't get it do you?

I've been sailing >35 years. I've been up and down enough masts ON HALYARDS to feel I know the risks.

I have NEVER been up a mast on the sort of ladder that I have bought and most certainly NEVER gone up on rope as thin as 8mm, hence my question!

That's it!

How you got the '' if you think you can find everything you need to know about climbing the mast safely here'' bit from baffles me.

READ THE TITLE!

 

[fireball]

Suit yourself, if you think you can find everything you need to know about climbing the mast safely here then it's your funeral. All I am saying is that it would be best to get someone with experience to be there with you. If that is such a daft concept to you then that's your problem; not mine.

I know you're not trying to be condescending - but sometimes we like to just check that what we're about to do isn't plain stupid - hence a question about using an 8mm line to hoist the ladder ...

Climbing the mast is inherently dangerous - but for most of us, far less so than some of our normal day2day activities.
A Bav34 as a significantly sized, fractional rigged mast, normally with two lines to the masthead - topping lift and main halyard. A climbers safety depends on the security of both of those lines plus the stability of the mast. We can't guess at all the variables that may result in an accident as we don't know the condition of all the items that go into keeping that mast up, but the obvious ones of safety line, harness and ensuring someone sensible on deck are the main ones which we can cover here.

The OP's question of Will an 8mm rope really take my weight is relatively straight forward to answer - he's intending to use it to hoist the ladder - hence it will be a static line..
he can visually inspect the line for chaffing - most likely to occur at the mast head ...
he can check the strength of the line by putting his weight on it at deck level
he can ensure his safety harness and line also by doing the above.

Short of taking a section of line and stress testing to destruction the OP just wants to ensure that he has covered as many of the bases as possible.
He's got the input of a number of fellow sailors from here and I trust feels that he has enough data to either trust his topping lift or seek alternatives.
Knowing the OP and his better half - he doesn't need anyone else holding his hand - but I'm sure he'd welcome someone else volunteering to climb the mast for him ....

 

[LadyInBed]

I'm worried whether 8mm is enough for one,

You worry about 8mm rope when each webbing rung is held together with thread