Marina over mooring prices

Tranona said:
The second is the cost associated with building and operating a marina. I have explained some of this in a similar thread elsewhere. Most of the marinas on the South Coast are built in reclaimed intertidal marshland or shallow tidal harbours which require dredging to create depth and constant dredging to maintain water, as well as maintenance of sheet piling and piles sunk into mud for pontoons.They also need significant landside facilities and have to compete with other uses, particularly housing and industrial for land. Add to this the planning constraints and environmental issues you will easily see why there is a shortage of marinas in the areas of highest demand - therefore prices are high.
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The biggest planning constraint seems to be the RSPB. Intertidal dredging disturbs the mud in which worms live and consequently upsets the seabirds. And the RSPB won't allow that!
 
Tranona said:
There are two (almost separate) issues. First is the "benefits" to the user of having a marina berth compared to a swinging mooring and that decision is up to the individual as many here have indicated.

The second is the cost associated with building and operating a marina. I have explained some of this in a similar thread elsewhere. Most of the marinas on the South Coast are built in reclaimed intertidal marshland or shallow tidal harbours which require dredging to create depth and constant dredging to maintain water, as well as maintenance of sheet piling and piles sunk into mud for pontoons.They also need significant landside facilities and have to compete with other uses, particularly housing and industrial for land. Add to this the planning constraints and environmental issues you will easily see why there is a shortage of marinas in the areas of highest demand - therefore prices are high.

Move away from those constraints and costs (and therefore prices) tumble. Just have a glance at the marina price guide published in PBO if you don't believe it. Marinas built in old commercial docks or in economically deprived areas are relatively cheap to build and cheap to run, particularly if no dredging is involved and land does not have alternate uses. Similar conditions apply to many marinas in France. They are built in economically deprived areas where there is little competition for land and building and maintenance costs are low. In some cases (particularly in the south) marinas are parts of huge housing/holiday developments as anyone who has been to Port Grimaud will appreciate. However, where there is competition from other activities and high demand, prices will be high. Compare the Med coast prices with Brittany and Normandy - bit like comparing the Solent with the north of the UK.

The real problem is that the "cheap" locations are in places where few people want to keep their boats and/or there is nowhere locally to cruise. That (together with low building costs) is why they are cheap, and why berths in heavily populated but popular sailing areas are "expensive".
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All perfectly explained, for the initial build. Ongoing, there are maintenance costs, staff, business rates on the property and significant outpayments to HM Queen in some places.

The perceived benefit by customers is also determined by the ratio of the value of their boat to the cost of their berth.

Two boats of identical size.
Brand new £250k boat in a £5k berth - no problem
Manky old £25k boat in a £5k berth - prohibitively expensive
 
moodyNick said:
All perfectly explained, for the initial build. Ongoing, there are maintenance costs, staff, business rates on the property and significant outpayments to HM Queen in some places.

The perceived benefit by customers is also determined by the ratio of the value of their boat to the cost of their berth.

Two boats of identical size.
Brand new £250k boat in a £5k berth - no problem
Manky old £25k boat in a £5k berth - prohibitively expensive
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It isn't just perceived benefit, it's can I afford it? Or even should I even try to afford it?
 
I have the unbelievably good fortune to have a mid-river mooring in the Hamble. Prior to that, I was a denizen of Swanwick Marina. The mooring works out to about 1/5 the cost of the marina, which is its primary attraction. Besides that, being on the boat on the mooring is nothing like being in that big boat parking lot which is a marina - it's like being at anchor, as if your cruise already started :).

That being said, of course, it is a PITA to get provisions, spare parts, and tradesmen onto the boat on the mooring, and no shore power means you have to generate your own, and woe unto you should you be away for a month at a time.

On balance, I much prefer the mooring, but I understand that for full time liveaboards or weekend warriors, the cost/benefit equation may be different.
 
I prefer mooring or anchoring to marinas, except that I can sometimes enjoy a few days in one for a change. Talking to a marina manager in Portugal, where land, building costs, rates and wages costs are far lower than the UK, he was clear that anything less than 250 berths was not viable.

Whereas we tend to let private developers build and run marinas for the benefit of shareholders, many European marinas have been built in partnership with local authority, EC grants & private money and the town continues to reap benefits.

We were talking to a French TV documentary crew some years ago who were following up complaints about visitor berths being available but a shortage of long term ones for the French locals, the reason being that a condition of the EC grant was that a certain percentage of berths be reserved for visitors. Another knock-on benefit to the town in that visitors spend more money than those who live maybe 50 miles away and bring their weekend food with them. They estimated there was a shortage of up to 20,000 berths on the west coast alone.
 
Dockhead said:
On balance, ....., the cost/benefit equation may be different.
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Exactly ! Down to personal preference, affordability, practicality etc all of which are variable per owner.

There is no one simple single answer for everybody. It is very frustrating that so many people around these forums are unable to realise or accept that.
 
For those of us who live a significant travel time from our boats (it is 7-8 hours for me!), a mooring is not an option. The reason is straightforward; if I arrive (after driving or flying or whatever, it takes about the same time door to door), I can't afford to find that the weather has deteriorated and I can't get to my boat safely. I daresay I could beg a floor from my brother, but he may be away or have guests or have gone to bed! I will also arrive tired and not wanting any extra hassle, even if the weather is good. I would also (in the cheaper moorings) have the added hassle of finding somewhere to park, and what do I do with the dinghy if there is no associated marina or boat-yard? And the moorings that have associated parking and other facilities tend to be not a lot cheaper than a marina; cheaper, but by (say) 30%.

I also can't come up to check my boat if bad weather is forecast; I can't make sure the mooring is secure and the lines aren't chafing. The marina staff take care of all that, so I can sleep soundly - which i wouldn't on a mooring.

I am afraid I do get a bit fed up with the holier than thou attitude of the anti-marina people. I can see the charm of being on a mooring, and perhaps if I lived 10 minutes - or even an hour - from the boat, I'd consider it. But as I don't - and many others don't - live close to their boat, the marina provides a facility where I can be reasonably sure that when I arrive, I will definitely be able to get aboard my boat and enjoy being aboard whatever the weather. As the closest salt water to me is an hour or more's drive away, I CAN'T live close enough to a boat to make a mooring attractive.
 
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