Lines Leading aft £

[Tranona]

Yes. The important thing is that we all have differing boats, different styles and areas of sailing, and especially different physical attributes. Although I have lines back to the cockpit, none of the lines sit in the cockpit. Most of them, such as spinnaker halyard and clew outhaul have short tails, but the long tails such as jib halyard are simply put into secure coils and kept forwards. It is not especially tidy but tangles don't seem to occur and colour-coding makes selection straightforward. My plotter is inside but some sister-ships have one under the sprayhood on a bracket clear of the clutches. I don't see this as a complication so much as a simplification of use.

Exactly - what a lot of posters here forget is that modern boats are designed to have lines led aft and by and large they work well because they use good gear and either leave space on the coachroof behind the sprayhood for the tails or have dedicated bins or bags.

The problems mostly arise when converting an older boat and having done it can see why some prefer not to. I learned a lot from my first one which hopefully will mean this second one is an improvement. it is a matter of identifying the barriers and devising ways of overcoming them.

 

[Daydream believer]

I do. Not have a spray hood. I do not do camping. I gave that up when I left the boy scouts

 

[B27]

We have no fear of going on deck. We do all the adjustment we need at the mast. We r...

We.
It's all a damned sight easier with a second pair of hands.

That's equally true when the lines are led back and you're not totally committed to your autopilot.

We wanted to drop the main in a hurry in a bit of a squall the other day, not much space because another boat turned towards us.
Had I needed to go forwards, it would have been a clipping on occasion, but done with no drama in seconds from the cockpit.
A pull on the second reef tack line got the sail down enough to be considered 'tamed'.
Might try sorting out a downhaul for the main, or maybe I need to clean the slides and mast groove again.

A nice trick I've borrowed from race boats is a cam cleat on the mast, that allows a halyard to be quickly pulled most of the way at the mast, then tensioned from the cockpit with a winch. Pulling the line from the cockpit takes it out of the cleat.

 

[Daydream believer]

Nobody has mentioned the use of bags in the cockpit to organise the lines led aft. My wife made them for our Moody 336 which had lines led aft. We found them invaluable, and the system worked well, with no jamming.

I have often wondered about rope bins. Some yachts have them as a feature & one cannot help wondering what happens at night when one wants the bottom one & pulls the lot out in one big cat’s cradle. I have watched videos of the figaros racing and the cockpits are strewn with lines everywhere. Just seems a dangerous mess. I know some sailors just dump the ropes on the floor. I raced with a boat whose owner did that & we regularly had to chuck the lot over the stern to get the tangles out by trailing the lines & retrieving one at a time

 

[geem]

I do. Not have a spray hood. I do not do camping. I gave that up when I left the boy scouts

Maybe with your kind of sailing it's not important. For our kind of sailing, it is. We are having a hardtop made this winter so we can do away with a canvas sprayhood. In the heat of the tropics it's too hot under the sprayhood and without one you get badly burnt in a surprisingly short time

 

[Daydream believer]

Maybe with your kind of sailing it's not important. For our kind of sailing, it is. We are having a hardtop made this winter so we can do away with a canvas sprayhood. In the heat of the tropics it's too hot under the sprayhood and without one you get badly burnt in a surprisingly short time

Fair comment. You have a much bigger and heavier displacement boat. So moving about on deck is much easier. My boat rocks to every ripple. It is directionally unstable and the autopilot struggles. It regularly gives up. Hence I have an Aries as a backup.

However, Re the spray hood, for camping in the colder climes of the UK one really needs a camper van & that would really light the forumites up

 

[geem]

Fair comment. You have a much bigger and heavier displacement boat. So moving about on deck is much easier. My boat rocks to every ripple. It is directionally unstable and the autopilot struggles. It regularly gives up. Hence I have an Aries as a backup.

However, Re the spray hood, for camping in the colder climes of the UK one really needs a camper van & that would really light the forumites up

We replaced our autopilot last year in the Caribbean. I am very impressed with how it steers. We only ever steer to the wind when sailing. We have a Windpilot as back up but didn't use it on either leg back across the pond. The autopilot drive uses so little power connected to the new ACU400 compared to our old Raymarine S3G ACU. Our boat is directionally stable with a long fin keel and skeg hung rudder. As you say, quite a different beast to your boat, and used for a totally different purpose. There is no one size fits all and boats should be laid out differently to suit the owners requirements and type of sailing they do.
We had two failures on our 44 year old boat crossing the pond. A failed Spade connector in a relay and a failed Raymarine ST to N2K converter cable.
Both were easily fixed in 10 minutes with the spares we carry. Nothing failed on the boat itself.

 

[Daydream believer]

We replaced our autopilot last year in the Caribbean. I am very impressed with how it steers. We only ever steer to the wind when sailing. We have a Windpilot as back up but didn't use it on either leg back across the pond. The autopilot drive uses so little power connected to the new ACU400 compared to our old Raymarine S3G ACU. Our boat is directionally stable with a long fin keel and skeg hung rudder. As you say, quite a different beast to your boat, and used for a totally different purpose. There is no one size fits all and boats should be laid out differently to suit the owners requirements and type of sailing they do.
We had two failures on our 44 year old boat crossing the pond. A failed Spade connector in a relay and a failed Raymarine ST to N2K converter cable.
Both were easily fixed in 10 minutes with the spares we carry. Nothing failed on the boat itself.

That is a point. I have had several autopilots renewed and some repairs. Total 7 in 20 years. The Aries just keeps going- but not always where I want it to go

 

[srm]

The Aries just keeps going- but not always where I want it to go

A trick I devised with the original Windpilot (semi balanced auxiliary rudder and vertical axis wind vane) was to use the smallest tiller pilot to drive it instead of the windvane. I also used this idea on the Monitor gear, with the tiller pilot pin in the counterweight. Both set ups gave negligible power consumption and compass steering.

 

[johnalison]

I do. Not have a spray hood. I do not do camping. I gave that up when I left the boy scouts

I had to have somewhere to go on a cold evening when my wife wanted to listen to the Archers.

 

[steveeasy]

Well Ive been changing my set up to lines in the cockpit. The plan was to get it sorted early in the season. id bought new 6 sheave organisers. New Triple clutches. used good blocks and had a new mast ring fabricated and fitted. But ive paused partly as Ive had so much else to finish and partly as Im not completely convinced its the right thing to do. I watch so many people with lines aft, and then still go to the mast and hoist the main. then pull the lines back thru organisers to the cockpit, which just makes a lot more work.

Steveeasy

 

[Tranona]

Well Ive been changing my set up to lines in the cockpit. The plan was to get it sorted early in the season. id bought new 6 sheave organisers. New Triple clutches. used good blocks and had a new mast ring fabricated and fitted. But ive paused partly as Ive had so much else to finish and partly as Im not completely convinced its the right thing to do. I watch so many people with lines aft, and then still go to the mast and hoist the main. then pull the lines back thru organisers to the cockpit, which just makes a lot more work.

Steveeasy

Perhaps you need to fit one of these tidesmarine.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/sailtrack_catalog.pdf

 

[steveeasy]

Perhaps you need to fit one of these tidesmarine.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/sailtrack_catalog.pdf

Well I probably do, but ive sorted the Matter of the Track by extending the existing one with another piece of identical Track. would be interesting to identify the force needed to hoist my main with the existing Tack verses a new tides marine Track. There is no point having lines running aft and still going to the mast, and then pulling the lines back.

Steveeasy

 

[Poignard]

Remember the days of yore when not only did one have to go to the mast to deal with the mainsail but also onto the foredeck to change headsails?

I don't mind going to the mast but I must say I found jib roller reefing to be a godsend.

 

[Wansworth]

On my engineless 27foot sloop everything was at the mast except for the topping lift that was on a purchase on a back stay.As every rope ran smoothly and there was room on the tabernacle reefing was easy usually as I hove too

 

[johnalison]

Remember the days of yore when not only did one have to go to the mast to deal with the mainsail but also onto the foredeck to change headsails?

I don't mind going to the mast but I must say I found jib roller reefing to be a godsend.

Don’t I just. On one trip just from Zeebrugge to Ostend I had to go up four times to change the jib as the wind dropped from post-gale to nothing but the seas persisted. At the time I and many others thought that those who had furling jibs weren’t real sailors and the performance must be terrible. There was a little truth in the latter, but compensated for by always having the right amount of foresail up. I think it was Angus Primrose who disproved the former. Better cut jibs with padded luffs, and even laminate, made all the difference.

Even mainsails weren’t beyond misbehaving. On our last cruise in the Mystere we had had for thirteen years a lot of things wore out. As we were sailing back into the Blackwater it blew up and we needed a reef, at which point the tufnol gear for roller reefing give up and I spent a while clinging onto the mast while disengaging the gooseneck and winding the boom by hand. A mile further on the masthead light took fright and propelled itself into the sea in an elegant parabola.

 

[Metalicmike]

Who is keeping the boat head to wind, You need a system to keep the boat on track if you are going solo, then the control lines are not such a big issue, just you make sure that you are correctly tethered to the boat.

 

[steveeasy]

Who is keeping the boat head to wind, You need a system to keep the boat on track if you are going solo, then the control lines are not such a big issue, just you make sure that you are correctly tethered to the boat.

Actually none of the above is much of a problem hence my hesitation in drilling lots of holes in an otherwise dry coachroof. Indeed what I’m contemplating over is improving what is actually at the mast. Two self tailing winches at the mast would really assist in reefing and the mainsail. I might just run the kicker spinnaker lines back. Sort of how my boat was originally set up.
Steveeasy

 

[doug748]

Actually none of the above is much of a problem hence my hesitation in drilling lots of holes in an otherwise dry coachroof. Indeed what I’m contemplating over is improving what is actually at the mast. Two self tailing winches at the mast would really assist in reefing and the mainsail. I might just run the kicker spinnaker lines back. Sort of how my boat was originally set up.
Steveeasy

I think you are wise to hesitate.
Hearken to post 14. I wouldn't even run the kicker back to the cockpit you can tension it directly just as soon as the reef is in. The only winch you need is the main halyard and maybe the one aft of the mast for pulling down the reef in the leach - and that is just a convenience.
Remember the Contessa main is only the size of some 26 footers, I would not make a big production of it.

.

 

[B27]

... I watch so many people with lines aft, and then still go to the mast and hoist the main. then pull the lines back thru organisers to the cockpit, which just makes a lot more work.

Steveeasy

Actually, it's not more work.
Or need not be.

If we are two-up, it's super quick to hoist the main 'near enough' from the mast.
It's just easy to shift 10m of rope quickly by pulling down.
That means in a busy harbour like Salcombe, you can whip your main up in a small gap in the traffic.
It won't be perfectly tweaked for a beat, but you can faff later.
It's up and under control and you can sail.
Then it's nice to be able to set the halyard tension from the cockpit with the sheet at hand.

OTOH, single handed, I can get the main up without using auto pilot, just steering to wind and pulling from the cockpit.
That's not as quick, but it's sometimes way quicker than finding a steady wind direction and setting the autopilot and making sure I'm happy to leave the helm.

A lot of boats add a remarkable amount of friction in running the lines back.
Simple things like raising the organisers on shims or wedges to align properly and keep the string off the deck can make a big difference.
Also oversized halyards which have gone hard in 10 years of sun and stiffened with salt and dirt don't help.
That is one downside of leading lines back, lines tend to be exposed to more sun and guano.