LIBS update: eBorders will be voluntary!

[Blue5]

I agree - but nicked for what exacly? If smiffy was a brit with a brit passport what are they going to do about it? Skipper has a written note to say smiffy did nt want his details posted on a system that lets theives know he is out of the country so whats wrong with that?

No, "Smiffy" is happy for his details to be posted but jumps aboard as at last minute, so no internet or time to amend my passage plan/crew list, the nick would be I assume for supplying UKBA with incorrect information on my electronic declaration wheras if I chose not to participate, well they would have no idea who to expect

Not that I would advocate anything that is contrary to the Governments wish, being a fine upstanding citizen and all that

 

[Twister_Ken]

Sounds like Smiffy is gonna have to give up his pierhead jumps.

 

[Gludy]

What happens if some of your crew agree to be reported and others choose not to be reported?

 

[Blue5]

Dont know, but would hazard a guess that in all things official provided the numbers on the declaration match the head count it would be OK

 

[Mudplugger]

UKBA.

Various comments from recent visitors to the LIBS stand...perhaps the information given depended upon to whom you were speaking. On a personal basis, pointed out that when on floaty thing, a) don't have computer access & don't intend to....on mooring no wi-fi !
answer.. well you should be able to report by mobile!
b) suggested that if more than 5 miles off, phone unlikely to work!
answer..????
c) Suggested quite happy to fill in form...C1328 IIRC? or similar, but where to dispatch! (as per olden day's & hoisting yellow jack)
answer..requires to much admin by UKBA.
d) Happy to report on dedicated VHF....and more likely to make contact!
answer....admin requirements again!
Filled out comments card, suggesting whole package contravened free movement enshrined under EEC. Happy to report IN on VHF...but as ancient type mariner, with large yellow streak re. weather. never able to forecast with accuracy specific departure .
Informed that consultation with leisure boating fraternity was ongoing....and most of the stand visits had been very negative in regard to UKBA requirements.
Personal oppinion is that concept has been developed for/by commercial carriers, ignoring leisure activity, individual boaty or flying activity has now got them b*****ed.

 

[Searush]

Would one of our more able computer buffs be able to send a copy of this thread to the relevant Minister for "clarification"? Perhaps YM & PBO could publish it too.

A very revealing set of completely different briefings supplied to each visitor to the UKBA stand. They have no idea what they are doing whatsoever. It appears that every employee is & will continue to interpret this nonsense in a different manner. So innocent boaters will not stand a chance. What a shambles.

If you are manning a public information stand at a major exhibition, the minimum that I would expect is that there would be a simple briefing pamphlet with the relevant info that people will need. Ideally all people manning the stand should be trained to a consistent standard. Whoever set up that stand should be sacked. It is a PR catastrophy. I was concerned about the idea of e-borders for yachts before - now I am terrified. Well done UKBA you have managed to make a poor situation 100 times worse.

 

[sailorman]

Would one of our more able computer buffs be able to send a copy of this thread to the relevant Minister for "clarification"? Perhaps YM & PBO could publish it too.

A very revealing set of completely different briefings supplied to each visitor to the UKBA stand. They have no idea what they are doing whatsoever. It appears that every employee is & will continue to interpret this nonsense in a different manner. So innocent boaters will not stand a chance. What a shambles.

If you are manning a public information stand at a major exhibition, the minimum that I would expect is that there would be a simple briefing pamphlet with the relevant info that people will need. Ideally all people manning the stand should be trained to a consistent standard. Whoever set up that stand should be sacked. It is a PR catastrophy. I was concerned about the idea of e-borders for yachts before - now I am terrified. Well done UKBA you have managed to make a poor situation 100 times worse.

i have already sent the link to my mp the Rt Hon Andrew Lansley. so far 4 days nothing back yet

 

[Tidewaiter2]

Spot on Again Searush

A very revealing set of completely different briefings supplied to each visitor to the UKBA stand. They have no idea what they are doing whatsoever. It appears that every employee is & will continue to interpret this nonsense in a different manner. So innocent boaters will not stand a chance. What a shambles.

If you are manning a public information stand at a major exhibition, the minimum that I would expect is that there would be a simple briefing pamphlet with the relevant info that people will need. Ideally all people manning the stand should be trained to a consistent standard. Whoever set up that stand should be sacked. It is a PR catastrophy. I was concerned about the idea of e-borders for yachts before - now I am terrified. Well done UKBA you have managed to make a poor situation 100 times worse.[/QUOTE]

Got it in one again, Searush, we not only look similar- we think along same lines(terrifying thought!)
I had to script and deliver a major legislative and system change to our specialisms Londonwide 'customers' at very short notice-(10 days!)for my old dept few years back-

The things that aged me and my blood and tears were shed over were
1) ensuring a consistent correct appropriate message at all seminars(internal & external),
2) that all our people dealing with the 'customers' knew exactly what they were talking about,
3)didn't shoot from the hip ,
4) but referred any dodgy questions(usually to #1@ me)for a considered correct reply.
5)AND we made sure such a reply was given as soon as we could.
The care paid off at the go live date- both sides worked together to overcome the inevitable snags, fairly harmoniously, because we knew and trusted each other

From what has been posted on this and earlier threads on UKBA, just about everything i was taught about introducing changes(and we had huge changes every year, too) seems to have been ignored in prepping, calibre, and manning their LIBS stand.The devil is in the detail always, but thats boring and does not look good on the CV.

A major UKBA showcase and opportunity to get yotties reluctant cooperation, clarify and disseminate their UKBA current position,appears to have been completely blown from the reports above through lack of understanding of their target audience and it's culture/ operating environment, poor briefing of staff, calibre(we'd have put our very best, toughest and brightest 'people' people out for something big like LIBS).

Leisure sailors are actually UKBA's forward reconaissance screen and filter for those 'muddy creeks', in Solent and non Solent areas, if they had the wit to realise it.
We know our areas, and notice the strange/unusual, if only to stop our outboards getting pinched.

5 rebadged HMRC cutters, with a rib each do not a "Berlin Wall" make for UK Plc.
Particularly as Valiant seems parked up by Haslar, every time I go into Pompey, and thats before the next Govt(of whatever flavour-all politicos are the same) re-invents the Geddes Axe.

Whats wrong with a few extra lines/pages on the old C1331, bring it back and make it machine scannable? Combined HMRC & UKBA clearance. Start effective traveller profiling as well,s@d PC, the UK's safety is at stake, then we just might have a 2.5 billion IT system that worked to protect the UK.

One pokey cluster of islands off a big landmass, holding 61 million mostly mall sheep,precious few shepherds or sheep dogs among them, s~d it, it's late, i'm going to bed, see how many are still alive tomorrow.

 

[TheBoatman]

Job creation!

They have 5 boats to cover the entire UK!!! The UK border force maybe do not not know there is anything more than the Solent so I do not think anyone should help them by telling them.

They may only have 5 boats at the moment but wait until some civil servant jumps up and says "we can't possibly etc, etc".

The next move will be for HMG to set them "targets" on the amount of stops they have to make.

UKBA request more boats and people to run them to meet the targets ~ result more jobs for civil servants (public sector)

RESULT?????

Peter.

 

[Major Catastrophe]

The next move will be for HMG to set them "targets" on the amount of stops they have to make.

That's not the problem. The real trouble starts when they issue policing style targets on actual arrests/investigations....regardless of the eventual result.

 

[dulcibella]

What, is all else fails, about a campaign of courteous refusal to play this game or to pay fines? It has worked for many noble causes in the past.

 

[Major Catastrophe]

What, is all else fails, about a campaign of courteous refusal to play this game or to pay fines? It has worked for many noble causes in the past.

If you are French.

Name one campaign of courteous refusal that has worked on this government.

 

[photodog]

They may only have 5 boats at the moment but wait until some civil servant jumps up and says "we can't possibly etc, etc".

The next move will be for HMG to set them "targets" on the amount of stops they have to make.

UKBA request more boats and people to run them to meet the targets ~ result more jobs for civil servants (public sector)

RESULT?????

Peter.

One of those five is based at the entrance to our marina...

 

[Ubergeekian]

If you are French.

Name one campaign of courteous refusal that has worked on this government.

Wait until May. A Thursday in May.

 

[Major Catastrophe]

Wait until May. A Thursday in May.

Hmm. One eye replaced by Tone clone.

 

[photodog]

If you are French.

Name one campaign of courteous refusal that has worked on this government.

The Tollpuddle Martyrs?

 

[photodog]

If you are French.

Name one campaign of courteous refusal that has worked on this government.

ooh ooh I know of one... well maybe... depends on what you define as this government....

The Sky Bridge Toll Protestors.

 

[Major Catastrophe]

ooh ooh I know of one... well maybe... depends on what you define as this government....

The Sky Bridge Toll Protestors.

That barrel you are scraping is pretty shallow.

 

[Searush]

Where is Mahatma Ghandi when you need him? His campaign of civil disobedience gained independence for India, unfortunately he wasn't able to prevent its break up into India, Bangladesh & Pakistan.