Lecky question

[zoidberg]

Noticing ads for 'Lithium 12V Jumpstarters' here and there, and wondering about their usefulness if taken on board, where boat lives on moorings.
BETA 14 engine, 2-cylinder 600cc...

Experience? Knowledge? Prejudice?

 

[Aeolus]

I think that those types of devices will so rarely be needed that the initial cost plus the effort to remember to keep it charged, possibly for years, without ever using it, means that it cannot be justified.

 

[Corribee Boy]

Just to present the other side of the argument, I own one, and it's capable of starting a 2l diesel. It rarely needs charging, weighs very little and, as I don't have a dedicated start battery, it makes it on to the boat as a precaution. It's true I've never needed it but it's my back up plan. Cost about £65 perhaps ten years ago. It also has red and white lights.

 

[Tranona]

If you choose the correct type of battery for your dedicated engine start and have a means of connecting your house bank to the starter there should really never be any need for any other kind of emergency start. Starting your little Beta (or really any other small modern engine) takes very little capacity out of the battery (although high current) and the alternator puts it back very quickly so the battery should always be fully charged.

 

[Refueler]

Just to present the other side of the argument, I own one, and it's capable of starting a 2l diesel. It rarely needs charging, weighs very little and, as I don't have a dedicated start battery, it makes it on to the boat as a precaution. It's true I've never needed it but it's my back up plan. Cost about £65 perhaps ten years ago. It also has red and white lights.

Keeping such battery fully charged over length of time kills it. I would suggest you load test that battery at intervals and cycle it ... to at least give it chance to survive long term.

 

[Refueler]

Noticing ads for 'Lithium 12V Jumpstarters' here and there, and wondering about their usefulness if taken on board, where boat lives on moorings.
BETA 14 engine, 2-cylinder 600cc...

Experience? Knowledge? Prejudice?

Be careful ... too many of these 'devices' are not quite what they advertise ... the capacity and capability often are overstated to a significantly high degree. Second - majority are not designed for sustained starter motor use ... if the engine does not start on the first few turns - you are then faced with a discharged Li starter pack.

I've watched people connect such to their 'dead' battery and turn key (cars) and within seconds - nothing left.

I know people who swear by them ... but I've never seen them actually use them !!

 

[Sandy]

On the Cornish side of the the Tamar I've recently installed 200W worth of solar panels and a Victron SmartSolar 75/15 MPPT, and am very impressed with the output during October.

If you want just to keep the batteries topped up then you would need a lot less solar.

 

[Stemar]

Fit a bit of solar and a dedicated start battery and never worry about not starting because of battery problems again

 

[Refueler]

Fit a bit of solar and a dedicated start battery and never worry about not starting because of battery problems again

Just make sure enough capacity to cover reasonable expectations and a means to charge ....

Plus I would add ..... remove old style incandescent bulbs / lights .... replace with LED where possible ..... can make a difference ... not much on its own ... but as part of a systemic change can alter that A/hr need ...

 

[doug748]

Noticing ads for 'Lithium 12V Jumpstarters' here and there, and wondering about their usefulness if taken on board, where boat lives on moorings.
BETA 14 engine, 2-cylinder 600cc...

Experience? Knowledge? Prejudice?

A recovery truck used one on my dead car last month, just happened to be passing so got me out of a jam, said it was the second time he used it that morning. I think most people in the motor trade have them. Interesting that Project Farm on YouTube found even the poorest to be miles better than jump leads.

Here is a video of a UK available brand (with discount code) which seems to be ok, I have seen it boosted elsewhere so there are loads of others to look at for a second opinion:

If it is the sort of thing you want to carry in the car I can see it is worth taking it in the boat bag esp if your battery capacity is limited and you have kids wanting to charge phones etc.

.

 

[Refueler]

Think it has to be appreciated that traditional Emergency start packs are based on SLA batterys of barely adequate capacity .....

I have a 'Halfords' starter pack from years ago ... its useless now !! in fact wasn't much good when new - but it was the usual setup ... large case with ammeter / light in front ... jump leads wound onto sides ... removable panel at rear holding an SLA battery of probably 12A/hr .....

OK - if engine started on first kick ... but soon that SLA would decline in voltage ....

 

[oldmanofthehills]

On the Cornish side of the the Tamar I've recently installed 200W worth of solar panels and a Victron SmartSolar 75/15 MPPT, and am very impressed with the output during October.

If you want just to keep the batteries topped up then you would need a lot less solar.

I have just yesterday added 100W solar panel to our leisure battery bank after dim cabin lights and inability to start the ebi heater after 2 nights on mooring. And I can jump engine start from that if needed.

However not every one has knowledge or space to add solar to their boat, so a backup is useful - and we have had two occasions when the engine battery was flat for unknown reasons. Afer 5 years I cannot work out why but suspect it is draining back into leisure battery somehow

We got a lithium pack for the camper which also had or has odd engine battery flatness (old battery possibly drained by crashcam over 3 months idleness), and discovered pack has too little capacity for a 2.4L 98hp diesel, so it has cascaded to boat use with its much smaller 25hp engine, while a larger pack has been bought for van.

Both happily start their respective engines if relevant battery flat.

JDN a happy elderly boat and van owner

 

[Bouba]

They are brilliant....my one has been used to start my diesel car....and it also came with every type of phone charge plug so it can charge your phone...it also has a light and even a hammer for breaking out of the car window. I always keep it on the boat.....some of you may remember my boat fuel tank leak saga....as many might remember I did a lot pumping out over months, including pressurizing the tank with air...everything was done with 12v pumps....all powered by my little lithium battery. I’ve had it years now

 

[Hoolie]

I have a 'Halfords' starter pack from years ago ... its useless now !! in fact wasn't much good when new - but it was the usual setup ... large case with ammeter / light in front ... jump leads wound onto sides ... removable panel at rear holding an SLA battery of probably 12A/hr .....

I have one of those! It's been in the cellar for more than 15 years now - must get it out to see how it's doing ...

 

[Refueler]

I have one of those! It's been in the cellar for more than 15 years now - must get it out to see how it's doing ...

Wish you luck .... !!

 

[Gsailor]

Noticing ads for 'Lithium 12V Jumpstarters' here and there, and wondering about their usefulness if taken on board, where boat lives on moorings.
BETA 14 engine, 2-cylinder 600cc...

Experience? Knowledge? Prejudice?

They are superb.

They jump start very large engines (by magic).

They charge your mobile phone (but only 3 times before it needs recharging itself).

They have a bright light (torch).

They are cheap.

Mine holds its charge well (5 years old now).

They come in a nice small padded zipped case.

 

[Binnacle]

I'd suggest following Refueller's experience and avoid these temperamental and fussy lithium jumpstarters. They do not like being left alone either fully charged or discharged, and they need careful re-charging and storage.

One sector of battery users who have good experience of high power batteries capable of taking lots of environmental punishment is the military and motorsport. They tend to use use very carefully crafted AGM batteries such as Odyssey

ODYSSEY® Battery - Official Manufacturer's Site

Their FAQs and Support people are excellent.

 

[Poey50]

The best thing to do with a lead acid backup battery is to keep it fully charged. Storage at full charge is however the WORST thing you can do with an LFP.

 

[Bouba]

Although you shouldn’t keep lithium batteries stored fully charged....these are small relatively cheap devices that need to have a good charge in them for emergency use...which is why you buy it in the first place

 

[Poey50]

As others have said, you would need to put some work in to ensure an LFP back-up starter battery remained in good health. For a long life it would need to be only charged to mid-range but you also need to ensure that self-discharge - especially if stored in hot conditions - doesn't take it to empty. As Tranona and others suggest, it would be a lot simpler and cheaper to ensure that a lead acid starter battery is always in good condition. I have an LFP pack for the house circuits but I would not dream of replacing my Red Flash starter battery with LFP. In the highly unlikely event of failure I have a three switch system and a BMS, cabling, and fusing to enable me to start the engine from the LFP. There's no issue for occasional use but in general I share the view that LFP is best used for low-power house requirements.