Lassoing - the RYA way

[NormanS]

Hopefully if your pick up line is free and easy to pick up then there's no need to lasso the mooring. (See comments of 'seamanship' and 'common sense' and 'what's appropriate' previously made.)

May I humbly suggest that your mousing is a bit vulnerable if a bit of rope catching on it for a few moments is going to destroy it. I have never seen these weighted ropes being used or ropes with chains.... and I've only ever used a bit of multi plait when having to lasso something. (Getting it wet first encourages it to sink.)

A belief that good instructor teaches a variety of techniques and tries to educate students into choosing appropriate and seamanlike ways of doing things. I appreciate that there are lazy instructors who tick the box of 'teaching picking up a mooring' by showing the lasso technique and off the the pub before closing time, but that's another matter.

And I own a mooring and pay for it to be maintained so I know what you mean about being protective of your buoy.

The buoy on ours costs over £200 if it gets ripped off.

Someone on here a few pages back said that his lasoo was weighted with chain in the middle.

Yes, the buoy costs £200, but to employ a team of divers with a suitable boat to be able to find and retrieve the riser chain, in 15m of water, will cost another £400, not to mention the severe inconvenience of returning to my mooring after a cruise, and finding it missing.

If you are incapable of securing to a mooring in a seamanlike and non destructive manner, just don't do it. Simple.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Someone on here a few pages back said that his lasoo was weighted with chain in the middle.

Yes, the buoy costs £200, but to employ a team of divers with a suitable boat to be able to find and retrieve the riser chain, in 15m of water, will cost another £400, not to mention the severe inconvenience of returning to my mooring after a cruise, and finding it missing.

If you are incapable of securing to a mooring in a seamanlike and non destructive manner, just don't do it. Simple.

We pay a mooring maintenance company a monthly fee to certify and maintain our mooring - no matter what happens to it. The only thing they don't cover is the replacement of the buoy - hence my interest.

Which part of all my comments about being seamanlike didn't you understand. Of course you need to secure to a buoy in a safe and seamanlike way. Occasionally lassoing it first is a safe and seamanlike option. Personally, I don't do it very often, but it remains in my 'bag of tools' as an option. Simple.

And FWIW I suggest that damaging someone else's property is not seamanlike.

IMHO To say NEVER use the technique is just being belligerent.

 

[dom]

1. Arrive in a small down late in the evening and book into the local hotel. Next morning: shower, towels on the floor, room service tray slung beside the TV, pull the bed-covers back to check nothing is left and off you go.

2. Arrive in a small down late in the evening, local hotel is full and a kind chap lets you stay in his house for free. You leave the room spic and span with a nice bottle of single malt on the breakfast table.

Does the same principles not apply to public and private moorings?

 

[Poignard]

(...) Next morning: shower, towels on the floor, room service tray slung beside the TV, pull the bed-covers back to check nothing is left and off you go.
(...)

Sounds like a Tracy Emin artwork

 

[KINGFISHER 8]

Bought one of these this year - blooming brilliant ....
http://www.hookandmoor.com/works

No lasooing needed

I've recently bought one of these ... best invention since the wheel!

 

[NormanS]

We pay a mooring maintenance company a monthly fee to certify and maintain our mooring - no matter what happens to it. The only thing they don't cover is the replacement of the buoy - hence my interest.

Which part of all my comments about being seamanlike didn't you understand. Of course you need to secure to a buoy in a safe and seamanlike way. Occasionally lassoing it first is a safe and seamanlike option. Personally, I don't do it very often, but it remains in my 'bag of tools' as an option. Simple.

And FWIW I suggest that damaging someone else's property is not seamanlike.

IMHO To say NEVER use the technique is just being belligerent.

I don't consider it seamanlike to do something to someone else's property which has the potential to damage it. Lassoing a buoy has that potential.

Would you consider it alright when coming alongside another boat, to hitch a line temporarily to her stanchions?
You might, but I certainly wouldn't, because it has the potential to cause damage to another's property. I would have thought that was fairly obvious. However, I accept that in the world in which we live, there are people who have no respect for others, and they will keep on lassoing buoys, and teaching others to do likewise.

 

[dunedin]

So AWOL, what was your sweepie bet on the number of responses you would get by re-opening this hot potato?
Doing well so far

PS Somewhat glad I don't own a private mooring with this RYA encouragement of this technique

 

[flaming]

I don't consider it seamanlike to do something to someone else's property which has the potential to damage it. Lassoing a buoy has that potential.

Which is probably why everyone saying they sometimes lasso also says they don't do it, or advocate it, to private inflatable moorings.

 

[awol]

So AWOL, what was your sweepie bet on the number of responses you would get by re-opening this hot potato?
Doing well so far

I blame North Ayrshire Coonty Cooncil for pointing me to the quoted RYA page on their new visitors' mooring page. It has been very much light the blue touch paper and stand well back, hasn't it?

 

[john_morris_uk]

I don't consider it seamanlike to do something to someone else's property which has the potential to damage it. Lassoing a buoy has that potential.

Would you consider it alright when coming alongside another boat, to hitch a line temporarily to her stanchions?
You might, but I certainly wouldn't, because it has the potential to cause damage to another's property. I would have thought that was fairly obvious. However, I accept that in the world in which we live, there are people who have no respect for others, and they will keep on lassoing buoys, and teaching others to do likewise.

So what you are saying is that in your view, because some buoys have the potentially to be damaged under some circumstances, its always unseamanlike to lasso a mooring? No exceptions.

 

[NormanS]

So what you are saying is that in your view, because some buoys have the potentially to be damaged under some circumstances, its always unseamanlike to lasso a mooring? No exceptions.

Yes. Also see Luke, Chapter 23 verse 34.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Yes. Also see Luke, Chapter 23 verse 34.

"So Pilate decided to grant their demand."

That makes as much sense as your belligerence on lassoing moorings...

Seamanship - doing the sensible thing in a safe and efficient manner.

Or try TC's article: https://www.crewseekers.net/essenceofseamanship.aspx

As to whether it is ALWAYS unseamanlike to lasso a mooring buoy, I fear that you are ploughing a lonely furrow on that one.

 

[dom]

Golly this is getting deep; did Pontius Pilate lasso people's moorings on the Sea of Galilee or something

 

[NormanS]

"So Pilate decided to grant their demand."

That makes as much sense as your belligerence on lassoing moorings...

Seamanship - doing the sensible thing in a safe and efficient manner.

Or try TC's article: https://www.crewseekers.net/essenceofseamanship.aspx

As to whether it is ALWAYS unseamanlike to lasso a mooring buoy, I fear that you are ploughing a lonely furrow on that one.

Wrong! You didn't even get that right. Go and check your Bible again, and you will find that it says, "Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing" Go on, look it up!

There's a roundabout on the road near here, on a very quiet road, with not much traffic on it. If I want to turn right, it would be quicker to ignore convention and the law, and just turn right without going round the roundabout. Nine times out of ten, no harm would be done, but do you know what, I go round the roundabout, because there is the potential of causing all sorts of mayhem. You are advocating taking the shortcut, and again you are wrong. Please stop teaching a method which can damage other people's property.

 

[john_morris_uk]

Wrong! You didn't even get that right. Go and check your Bible again, and you will find that it says, "Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing" Go on, look it up!

There's a roundabout on the road near here, on a very quiet road, with not much traffic on it. If I want to turn right, it would be quicker to ignore convention and the law, and just turn right without going round the roundabout. Nine times out of ten, no harm would be done, but do you know what, I go round the roundabout, because there is the potential of causing all sorts of mayhem. You are advocating taking the shortcut, and again you are wrong. Please stop teaching a method which can damage other people's property.

Apologies, a typo in my looking up Biblegateway.

I'm afraid you are banging a very lonely drum on your campaign against 'lassoing moorings.'

I completely agree that it might be possible under some circumstances and on some moorings that it MIGHT cause damage.

However you consistently ignore my suggestions that by applying some seamanship and common sense no damage need be done. You are drawing conclusions from the exception rather than the rule.

Lassoing a mooring is only justified on some occasions on some buoys you can see are suitable and that any sensible person reduces the possibility of damage to zero by applying some common sense and seamanship.

Occasionally its a very useful trick that will continue to be taught by many people (myself included).

I've met people who won't put a line through a ladder to hold the boat for a few seconds while they climb up and put the line round a bollard etc. "The ladder isn't designed for it they bleat..." Ignoring the fact that the ladder they are looking at is rather more substantial than the mooring ring on the dockside and they are only steadying the boat for a few moments while they sort things out.

No common sense or seamanship....

 

[Tranona]

Wrong! You didn't even get that right. Go and check your Bible again, and you will find that it says, "Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing" Go on, look it up!

There's a roundabout on the road near here, on a very quiet road, with not much traffic on it. If I want to turn right, it would be quicker to ignore convention and the law, and just turn right without going round the roundabout. Nine times out of ten, no harm would be done, but do you know what, I go round the roundabout, because there is the potential of causing all sorts of mayhem. You are advocating taking the shortcut, and again you are wrong. Please stop teaching a method which can damage other people's property.

You really are taking this to extremes. Nowhere does it say this technique is the only technique. It does not automatically damage other peoples' property. The sort of buoys where it is suitable are not the type that private owners like yourself use.

What is wrong with showing people a techniques that they might find useful in certain circumstances? Much of sailing and seamanship is commonsense and making use of techniques often from a choice of alternatives. Nobody teaches absolutes - you must or must not do ....etc.

The opposite of what you are saying is that one must never lasso buoys which is just a nonsense - there are no absolutes.

 

[NormanS]

It may be a lonely drum, but if I have been able to highlight the fact that lasooing is a sloppy method used by people who either can't, or can't be bothered to attach to a mooring properly, and without the risk of causing damage, then I consider that it has been time well spent. Thanks for giving it an airing.

 

[TSB240]

Someone on here a few pages back said that his lasoo was weighted with chain in the middle.

Yes Me post 7 or 8 I believe and I also said in bold that I would never lasso a private plastic mooring which you so conveniently ignored!

The weighted lasso and chain makes contact with the mooring riser well below the buoy and in my experience the small chain locks with the larger riser chain and prevents it actually getting anywhere near the buoy. This is also the case if the risers are rarely lifted and cleaned of long kelp that has been allowed to grow on them!

The fact that the chain locks also means that you can gather the riser and check it out to see if it has suffered any degradation.



Would it be a sin for you to try it for yourself as an experiment or are you so entrenched in your view that I should be hung drawn and quartered!


As someone else says experience , common sense and practical experience should be used.....

 

[Tranona]

It may be a lonely drum, but if I have been able to highlight the fact that lasooing is a sloppy method used by people who either can't, or can't be bothered to attach to a mooring properly, and without the risk of causing damage, then I consider that it has been time well spent. Thanks for giving it an airing.

It is lonely where you are because being an absolutist is always lonely. Amazed you can get through life without recognising that people are perfectly capable of using their own judgement as to the appropriate technique to use in particular circumstances.

However, guess once you take the absolutist stance you have nowhere else to go.

 

[NormanS]

It is lonely where you are because being an absolutist is always lonely. Amazed you can get through life without recognising that people are perfectly capable of using their own judgement as to the appropriate technique to use in particular circumstances.

However, guess once you take the absolutist stance you have nowhere else to go.

Funnily enough it is always satisfying to do things correctly, and in a way that can cause no damage to others.
Unfortunately, some people just don't care.