Lassoing - the RYA way

[TSB240]

It helps a lot if the rope is wet...

(as it will be after the first failed attempt )

Or weighted!

 

[James_Calvert]

If I am praying for a speedy berthing then I always have the two ends inboard with a big loop and you cast the lines out like a pizza and it gets the job done. Lassoing with a bowline is doomed to fail many times due to the weight of the line. If you are thinking about "Rawhide" then that is what you need, stiff line that holds it's shape in air and pulls tight on pressure.

Anyway forget the bowline keep the two ends on board and remember "making the pizza".

Never having made a pizza I'm a bit unsure of the picture you are painting there...

I had the loop hanging off the end of my boathook, I guess like a dog catcher.

Not sure where I picked up the idea for that technique. Given my success with it maybe from an old Mike Peyton cartoon...

 

[DanTribe]

I have a snap hook on a spring on my own boat but still practise lassoing with SWMBO quite often.

A fascinating snippet of your private life. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Poignard]

Why do people persist on thinking that there is some sort of 'RYA way' of doing things?

There is good seamanship and poor seamanship. All the people saying that it's a rubbish technique or 'it doesn't work' are missing the point. IMHO. It's another tool in the box that is sometimes very useful.

It's NEVER been suggested it's anything other than a quick way to attach yourself to the buoy while you sort out a proper mooring line to the shackle or whatever.

What's this 'proper' way people are talking about? There are lots of ways to pick up a mooring. The proper way is any way that works that is safe and seamanlike.

When I'm examining people, that's all I'm interested in...

Exactly. If a technique works, and does no harm, I can't see any valid reason to object to it.

 

[snowleopard]

It's another tool in the box that is sometimes very useful.

I recall a cruise where I encountered half a dozen different arrangements on successive visitors' buoys. The shackle that lies flat was bad, then there was the evil one that has a metre or so of heavy chain hanging down into the water. Trying to pick up a buoy off Exmouth with it blowing a hooley against a spring tide had to be one of the worst, with the pick-up strops either missing or tangled.

If you're new to the port you have no idea what you're going to find so it pays to have a variety of options to hand. My starting point is a double-ended boathook with a conventional hook at one end and a Moorfast gadget at the other.

With nearly 5 ft of freeboard at the bow and a less-than-agile 1st mate, I generally secure a line to the bow cleat and bring it aft outside everything so I can hook on while staying close to the helm.

 

[john_morris_uk]

I don't disagree..however a quick thing to get the boat stable often turns into a several hour thing....leading to a failure somewhere. People get lazy so if a shortcut or quick thing is taught as the leading way to do it then it soon becomes the norm.

A lasso is easy...simple...quick..almost anybody can do it with some success...meaning that people will use it over other methods that lead to an instant stable secure position.

This is the reason why i don't like such "quick temporary" methods

In which case I humbly suggest you're criticising the lack of seamanship of the skipper and crew involved and not the technique itself. If they use it to pick the buoy up and 'forget' to tie up properly, why blame the picking up technique?

 

[Angele]

Bought one of these this year - blooming brilliant ....
http://www.hookandmoor.com/works

No lasooing needed

That is all very well (and I have something similar), but you need to have something to hook. As has been pointed out earlier (eg by flaming in #5), sometimes there just isn't anything easy to attach to as you approach a buoy. So the method does have its uses. Some of the time.

 

[johnalison]

That is all very well (and I have something similar), but you need to have something to hook. As has been pointed out earlier (eg by flaming in #5), sometimes there just isn't anything easy to attach to as you approach a buoy. So the method does have its uses. Some of the time.

While most of us wouldn't argue for the technique to be banned, many of us, I suspect, have misgivings about lassooing being taught, under the auspices of the RYA, as a normal way to pick up a mooring. In the kind of AWB that is usually used for instruction, manoeuvring under power, or even under sail, should not be difficult, and we would prefer that trainees spent their time learning sufficiently good boat control to allow for normal mooring techniques, of which I favour the alongside method.

 

[NormanS]

As the owner of a mooring, I am very much against the technique. My riser chain comes up to the buoy and is attached by a carefully moused shackle. Do you people who practice lassoing with your weighted rope, ever stop to think what your bit of chain may be doing to my mousing? Do you stop and think what may happen if you pull so hard that the buoy is punctured? The eye on the buoy is quite capable of supporting the weight of the riser chain, but it is not designed to take the load of a boat moored to it.

Personally, I think that the RYA, and any sailing "schools" who advocate this method are simply wrong.

Please don't do it to my mooring. Actually, I can't think why you would try, as it has a floating pennant with a pick-up buoy, which you are welcome to use if I don't need it. (But there are some numpties around)

 

[Daydream believer]

Exactly. If a technique works, and does no harm, I can't see any valid reason to object to it.

But the point that some of us would like to make is that if the buoy is an inflatable then it can do harm.
If you have a situation whereby you return to your mooring & find £300 worth of mooring missing because your buoy had sunk, having been split, then I think that you would have the hump as well.
I do not mind people using my mooring, provided they vacate it when i return ( item for another rant) & provided it is left in its original serviceable state & not damaged

Is that unreasonable??

 

[Poignard]

But the point that some of us would like to make is that if the buoy is an inflatable then it can do harm.
If you have a situation whereby you return to your mooring & find £300 worth of mooring missing because your buoy had sunk, having been split, then I think that you would have the hump as well.
I do not mind people using my mooring, provided they vacate it when i return ( item for another rant) & provided it is left in its original serviceable state & not damaged

Is that unreasonable??

I wrote:

"Like most things it's something that needs using with a bit of common sense."

and then:

"If a technique works, and does no harm, I can't see any valid reason to object to it."


Which bits of these sentences are you having difficulty understanding?

 

[Daydream believer]

I wrote:

"Like most things it's something that needs using with a bit of common sense."

Which bit of this sentence are you having difficulty understanding?

. You will see that I quoted what you wrote-- in particular:-

"Exactly. If a technique works, and does no harm, I can't see any valid reason to object to it."

I am particularly concerned about the phrase "& does no harm" -- I can assure you that it often does & the person using the technique does not know the outcome.
As for "valid reason" well moorings cost upwards of £ 300-00 plus placing etc plus inconvenience. Is that not a "valid reason"?

All some of us are asking is that visitors do not use the lasso technique on inflatable buoys

& once again - I ask - is that unreasonable-- ------------Or are you still struggling to park your twister

 

[Daydream believer]

I quoted one of your posts & it is clearly there for all to see

I am particularly concerned about the phrase "& does no harm" -- I can assure you that it often does & the person using the technique does not know the outcome.
As for "valid reason" well moorings cost upwards of £ 300-00 plus placing etc plus inconvenience. Is that not a "valid reason"?

All some of us are asking is that visitors do not use the lasso technique on inflatable buoys

& once again - I ask - is that unreasonable
I hardly feel that a simple request ( which others will echo I am sure) required the tone of your response

 

[Poignard]

Jesus wept!

Alright, alright have it your own way. It's a waste of time responding to you. You're becoming a bore.

 

[johnalison]

I am far from clear in my own mind how to identify an "inflatable" buoy. Clearly, the kind of buoys set out for visitors in places such as Salcombe or Yarmouth are robust enough for most purposes, but often one finds that one is attaching to a mooring belonging or rented by a resident boat. These are normally vaguely spherical and roughly two foot across, so how am I to know if it is inflated or not?

 

[Poignard]

I am far from clear in my own mind how to identify an "inflatable" buoy. Clearly, the kind of buoys set out for visitors in places such as Salcombe or Yarmouth are robust enough for most purposes, but often one finds that one is attaching to a mooring belonging or rented by a resident boat. These are normally vaguely spherical and roughly two foot across, so how am I to know if it is inflated or not?

Here's a photo.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=i...UICCgC&biw=1280&bih=800#imgrc=V453UheMCGM-MM:

As you can see, they're not very strong

The other way is to lassoo it. If it bursts it's an inflatable one (or deflatable!)

 

[NormanS]

I am far from clear in my own mind how to identify an "inflatable" buoy. Clearly, the kind of buoys set out for visitors in places such as Salcombe or Yarmouth are robust enough for most purposes, but often one finds that one is attaching to a mooring belonging or rented by a resident boat. These are normally vaguely spherical and roughly two foot across, so how am I to know if it is inflated or not?

If you had any practical knowledge about moorings, you would be able to recognise inflatable buoys. If in doubt, don't do it.

 

[smert]

Being a complete novice, what method should I be using to pick up a mooring such as in this photo: http://www.internationalyachtsupplies.com/mooring-buoys/mooring_buoys.jpg
In the scenario that we are stopping for lunch?

We had some own boat instruction, and the instructor had us lasso a mooring by motoring towards the bouy against the tide and using the tide to stop as we arrived at the bouy. One end of the warp was attached to a cleat and the other was loose until the bouy was lasso'ed.

For moorings with a pick up bouy I would hook the pickup, but it is the ones without the pickup, I am now unsure about!

 

[sailorman]

Being a complete novice, what method should I be using to pick up a mooring such as in this photo: http://www.internationalyachtsupplies.com/mooring-buoys/mooring_buoys.jpg
In the scenario that we are stopping for lunch?

We had some own boat instruction, and the instructor had us lasso a mooring by motoring towards the bouy against the tide and using the tide to stop as we arrived at the bouy. One end of the warp was attached to a cleat and the other was loose until the bouy was lasso'ed.

For moorings with a pick up bouy I would hook the pickup, but it is the ones without the pickup, I am now unsure about!

With that much tide i would suggest deploy a 100kg Fisherman anchor :encouragement:

 

[NormanS]

From the very small pic, it would appear that there is a strong tide running, and that there is a shackle on the top of the buoy.
Assuming you are under power, motor up to the buoy against the tide until you have it close alongside amidships, reach down and pass a line through the shackle. The tide is your friend.