Kong Anchor Chain Gripper

[bumblefish]

How would you attach this to a mooring strop? Shackle or thimble?

 

[Graham376]

I wouldn't use one, try getting that pin out on a dark windy night when you need more scope or are dragging. A chain hook is much better.

 

[duncan99210]

I agree with Graham. We used to have one, gave up on it rapidly. I fitted a bolt to the pin so as to make removing it easier but the pin itself got bent in the first bit of wind we encountered. Binned in favour of a simple hook which has lasted years.

 

[Refueler]

I wouldn't use one, try getting that pin out on a dark windy night when you need more scope or are dragging. A chain hook is much better.

Or just simply suitable rope stopper .... that way if all else fails - cut free !

 

[Stemar]

Better still, a rope stopper with a hook on the end Far less likely to need to cut it, but you still have the option. I just describer my snubber.

 

[Refueler]

Better still, a rope stopper with a hook on the end Far less likely to need to cut it, but you still have the option. I just describer my snubber.

Had a chain hook 'jump' ... not a great lover of them ... basic rope for me if needed.

 

[Skylark]

Had a chain hook 'jump' ... not a great lover of them ... basic rope for me if needed.

Rolling hitch ?

 

[Refueler]

Rolling hitch ?

Depends on situation at the time ... but yes of course if needed.

I've even used a cow hitch but led BOTH ends back as one to the samson post to ensure the hitch is pulled tight into the chain.

If its a short stop ... I have a line that even slips through a link and back. But not for serious stops etc.

 

[Roberto]

How would you attach this to a mooring strop? Shackle or thimble?

I have one snubber with that shackle (among several different ones), I used a steel thimble with 12strand spliced rope, by memory a 16mm fits fine. A bit of leverage is needed to twist open a 16mm thimble to insert the Kong and then closing it back.

regards

 

[Star-Lord]

For my snubber I use one of these, great bits of kit. Yes you do need the Leatherman (or pliers) to undo it but that is easy. I use a hook and a shorter snubber for benign weather or overnight stop. The advantages of these is they are secure. A hook will un hook and a knot will slip or refuse to un knot. I actually have a few snubbers with these Kongs on ordered from Jimmy Green. I have some secured on a rope splice and some on a stainless steel thimble.

 

[vyv_cox]

For my snubber I use one of these, great bits of kit. Yes you do need the Leatherman (or pliers) to undo it but that is easy. I use a hook and a shorter snubber for benign weather or overnight stop. The advantages of these is they are secure. A hook will un hook and a knot will slip or refuse to un knot. I actually have a few snubbers with these Kongs on ordered from Jimmy Green. I have some secured on a rope splice and some on a stainless steel thimble.

A chain hook will not come off the chain provided there is sufficient loop of chain that it is always slack at the extremity of snubber elasticity. I have used chain hooks, simply tied to the snubber with a bowline, for something like 15 years, in winds to around 50 knots. Not once has one come off the chain.
Last season alone I saw two snubbers attached with rolling hitches that had to be cut off. Several others previously. It's not the loss of rope that's the problem, it's the time it takes in emergency.

 

[Refueler]

A chain hook will not come off the chain provided there is sufficient loop of chain that it is always slack at the extremity of snubber elasticity. I have used chain hooks, simply tied to the snubber with a bowline, for something like 15 years, in winds to around 50 knots. Not once has one come off the chain.
Last season alone I saw two snubbers attached with rolling hitches that had to be cut off. Several others previously. It's not the loss of rope that's the problem, it's the time it takes in emergency.

If it takes that long as you imply to cut - then I suggest you have a crap knife !! My Swedish Steel Hunting knife will go through a 10mm plait like butter ... especially if its under a lot of weight ...

That also brings me to a point ... if you are going to cut a line that's under tension - where do you cut ? 1. at the point it goes over side of boat ? 2. Half way back to cleat ? Or 3. right back at cleat / fast point ?

May I suggest you do it at point 3 - to save your gonads or face from the recoil ? A synthetic rope can carry a lot of energy in it when it breaks or is cut under tension. So its better to have the flying length ahead of you going away when cut ..

Just a little point that may save you ..

I know we are not talking ships here - but on board ship - axes are at hand for stubborn lines ... no fluffing about with knives .. its get the bloody axe and quick about it !!

 

[LadyInBed]

That also brings me to a point ... if you are going to cut a line that's under tension - where do you cut ? 1. at the point it goes over side of boat ? 2. Half way back to cleat ? Or 3. right back at cleat / fast point

None of the above!
Take in the chain until you have removed the tension on the snubber then you can choose where to cut if it is necessary, but you will probably be able to reel in more chain and undo the snubber.

 

[Refueler]

None of the above!
Take in the chain until you have removed the tension on the snubber then you can choose where to cut if it is necessary, but you will probably be able to reel in more chain and undo the snubber.

That's IF you can .. my point was when you cannot ... and if a line is under tension - the knife has far better chance of cutting quick than a slack line ... Illustrating the line has a recoil or as we call it on ship - Snap Back ... which can seriously injure.
Of course if you can get chain in to undo / remove snubber ... but imagine when you cannot ..

 

[Neeves]

A chain hook will not come off the chain provided there is sufficient loop of chain that it is always slack at the extremity of snubber elasticity. I have used chain hooks, simply tied to the snubber with a bowline, for something like 15 years, in winds to around 50 knots. Not once has one come off the chain.
Last season alone I saw two snubbers attached with rolling hitches that had to be cut off. Several others previously. It's not the loss of rope that's the problem, it's the time it takes in emergency.

Vyv's comment works well.

However snubbers only offer elesticity if they are long, think minimum deck length, and thin. Beefy snubbers don't stretch very well. If you 'commence' your snubber at the bow then there is a very good chance that during a lull your long snubber is on the seabed - and the chain can then fall out. The best way to have a deck length snubber is to commence the snubber well aft of the bow (I think Vyv's secures his snubber from the amidships cleats) we run ours from the transom. If you follow Vyv and our practice you can have a long snubber, not much beyond the bow, that lazy loop of chain and the length beyond the bow will be sufficiently short it cannot touch the seabed.

You need to devise a way of getting the snubber 'outboard' and without there being too much abrasion - different yachts, different solutions - but a small block on a strop can allow the snubber to be routed over the bow roller (with the snubber in a nylon tubular tape or hosepipe). Snubbers are consumables and are hardly expensive.

There are many ways to secure snubber to chain - none are perfect Some are simply not designed for the task and can bend - they can then be dangerous as you cannot release them (the pin of the Witchard hook being one example). I would not touch the Mantus plate hook (at all)), the one the centre of this thread appears (from reports above) to bend, the Oscalutti 'claw' bends. Look for a cast hook - better still - invest in the hook in the Cromox range.

If you showed our hooks to anyone in the lifting industry - they would laugh. Our hooks were discarded decades ago. Newer and better hooks have been designed for lifting - quite why those who make cast hooks for marine use have not simply copied lifting hooks is a bit of a mystery. It costs no more the cast a decent hook as one that is rubbish.

I make my own hooks, we use a bridle (so requirements are slightly different), or I have lifting hooks galvanised

Jonathan

 

[LadyInBed]

That's IF you can .. my point was when you cannot

I've never been in a situation where I couldn't untension a snubber. Even without a windlass, a rolling hitch onto the chain, rope back to sheet winch and tension. If necessary, repeat with second line to other sheet winch and keep alternating until I got to the snubber / chain connection.

 

[Roberto]

I think the OP was asking about the Kong for attaching a "mooring strop".
I have the impression everyone is talking about their experiences with anchor snubbers, which may -or may not- be the question asked.
Would you use a chain hook/rolling hitches with a vertical chain on a concrete quay in a tidal area, or to the chain of a mooring buoy, if you wanted the mooring to last for a few days, with alternate slack and tension? Possibly yes, each to his own.
Among the several options (let's add chain loops, wire loops, direct shackles, rope loops, rope knots, etc etc) there are occasions where one means may suit better than others. The OP shackle (I have myself much reduced its use in anchor snubbers) has a number of occasions where it has its purpose, like anything else.

 

[vyv_cox]

That's IF you can .. my point was when you cannot ... and if a line is under tension - the knife has far better chance of cutting quick than a slack line ... Illustrating the line has a recoil or as we call it on ship - Snap Back ... which can seriously injure.
Of course if you can get chain in to undo / remove snubber ... but imagine when you cannot ..

Your comment cannot apply to a yacht with a windlass. All of the rope must be removed if the chain is going to be returned to the locker. As said, it is difficult to imagine a circumstance in which the tension in the snubber cannot be released by hauling in the chain. My hook always falls off at this stage.

 

[GHA]

I've never been in a situation where I couldn't untension a snubber. Even without a windlass, a rolling hitch onto the chain, rope back to sheet winch and tension. If necessary, repeat with second line to other sheet winch and keep alternating until I got to the snubber / chain connection.

Absolutely, just like getting the hook up when the windlass is bust, leapfrog lines from the halyard winches on the mast. Spare chainhook speeds that up, been there, solo, engineless..
There's always a way, otherwise better to just stay home. Hardly rocket science, is it?

 

[Refueler]

Of course there's a way ... like my combo of genny and anchor to get back to HYCo berth when engine failed.

But I have to say - if I have time and situation is not so serious - I will spend the time to get slack in to undo rope or remove hook .. but in event its blowing a hoolie ... getting bloody uncomfortable ... a good knife works wonders for the soul !!