Ketch Rigs - How best to use them

94 hits and no replies says it all.

There is no one answer. Some ketches reef well down to jib and mizzen. Some have the mizzen almost as a steadying sail. Some have the mizzen as a real contribution to the sailplan.

So the answer is "It depends".

Experiment and find out what suits your boat best?
 
There could be a book in this question. I agree with
John above, "it depends"

I've sailed ketches where the mizzen is a lablility and they sailed better as sloops, I've sailed ones where the first reef is "drop the main".

Mizzen staysails can be good fun.

The best advice I can give is experiment and see what works best for your boat.
 
On the Moody Halberdier we had, the first 'reef' was to drop the mizzen otherwise we'd get a lot of weather helm. After that the genoa and main were gradually reefed at the same time (in mast main reefing).

Would agree that the mizzen staysail was great fun in the right conditions - although a bit like knitting to set.
 
On a Hillyard 11 tonner (35"OD) with a staysail ketch rig, we too first took one deep reef in the main, then lost it, rolling in the genny a bit, then as wind increased lost the genny, before (force 7)loosing the mizzen, to (force 8+)bare poles. Mizzen staysails are fun, with a decent height of mizzen mast, but our one worked better twinned (nearly the same cut)with the poled out genoa,,,,,, running with no main or mizzen, sometimes with the staysail sheeted hard midships to provide some directional stability.

Ketches are more fun because there's more bits of string to play with. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
we have a cutter ketch and whilst we are still learing how to sail it, we find that the minute any wind of consequence pipes up, that the first thing we do is to roll away the genoa, pull out the staysail and put a reef in the main and with the mizzen also up she says fairly well balanced. Any more and we put a second reef in the main and one in the mizzen, then, since we haven't got the 3rd reef rigged yet, we drop the main. Any more than this and I get rid of everything, and resort to the iron horse below. We will be coming out of the water soon and I hope to rig the 3rd reefing point in the main and the second in the mizzen, then we should be able to play a bit more, but with the staysail out and the mizzen raised, she seems to be very well balanced.
 
As others have said it depends...

We tend not to use the mizzen going upwind and reef the main first. Reaching we use all three sails and generally just drop the main when the apparent wind reaches 25 knots. Going downwind (if we can't be bothered to set the twins or a kite) we use the mizzen and genoa.
 
I suspect that any guidance you receive, will be general, certainly in the past a significant no, seem to think that ketches won't go to windward with the mizzen up! My westerly 33 would tack thru 65- 70deg quite happily with the mizzen in play, but only 75-80deg with it down. F5-6, was much happier with the Mainsail away & full genny & mizzen, as Genny was a furler, if wind picked up more, just had to put some rolls in. Off the wind, Broad reaching, Mizzen staysail was worth at least an extra knot but not able to carry it when close reaching. If able to set Spinnaker, Main, Mizzen, Mizzen Staysail, life really got interesting!! particularly in a F4-5. Downwind tended to drop mizzen and set Spinnaker, as often would get backwinding. Big advantage as far as I was concerned, was that sails were a little more easily handled by the family. It might help if you posted some boat detail, as I am sure someone else would have specific advice. HTH
 
I find it depends on what crew I have, if singlehanded I use the main and genoa as a sloop, if I have plenty of crew who need occupying we get the mizen up but other than occupational therapy it doesn`t seem to add much to boat speed. I have been tempted by a mizen staysail but our cruising chute is enough to play with, in strong winds, mizen and part rolled genny.
 
I have a Pentland Ketch so my experience reflects Mudplugger with his "next size up" Giles design.

Can also use them as sunshades if there isn't a lot of wind . .

Seriously tho' as the others have said experiment & have a bit of fun. So much depends on the relative sizes and positions of sails & masts. The Mizzen can also be a useful steadying sail when motoring towards the wind (but not straight into it!) Genoa & mizzen can be very good for close quarter manouvering in harbour under sail (or sailing in/ out of an anchorage) especially when short handed - and roller reefing the genoa will control your speed as well.
 
"Off the wind, Broad reaching, Mizzen staysail was worth at least an extra knot but not able to carry it when close reaching."

Interesting, cos I would have thought the 'Centre of Effort' was then much further back, with potential for broaching.

Or was the mizzen itself not in use, just the staysail?
 
Mizzen staysail definitely worth its weight. We carry it with the wind 60 degrees or more off the bow and the helm doesn't start to load up until the apparent wind approaches 18kts. At 60 degrees the effect is marginal, but the advantage increases as the wind comes aft.
 
Sailed more miles without the main. Mizzen, we thought was small, but did over power to windward, had reefing points (2) put in. Best sailing down wind - mizzen sheeted in and the Genny 3/4 with a matching sail set on an inner forestay, both poled out. Magic, 60 degrees off the wind, bulletproof & enjoyable downwind rig. Generally ketches have lower mast height & therefore a better & lower sail plan. Obviously not to everyone's taste!
 
We generally sail with the mizzen up all the time. It's the first sail we get out too. I was told not to use it when sailing downwind as it steals wind from the main but I experimented and gained an extra half knot when hoisting the mizzen in f4/f5.

Since this bit of info goes against some of the posts above one can generally conclude that it does indeed depend.....
 
"Best sailing down wind - mizzen sheeted in and the Genny 3/4 with a matching sail set on an inner forestay, both poled out."

So, what was the purpose of the mizzen in this arrangement?
Can't see how its doing anything downwind & sheeted in!
 
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