Is there a modern equivalant to the Nicholson 32

[BurnitBlue]

I will probably end up buying a Nicholson 32 because I cannot find a modern equivalent. I have avoided Halmatic moulded hulls for years because they all seem to have the osmosis thing. However as they have nearly all had epoxy treatment I may take a chance.

Before I do I would like to check with you that my short list of alternatives is complete.

Boxes to be ticked are 30 to 35 feet LOA, Medium to heavy displacement, encapsulated keel, solid lay-up (no foam). Keel stepped mast. Professional factory fit-out. Aft cockpit but not mandatory. Go-anywhere.

I have found the following makes tick most of my boxes. Contest 32, Rustler 31, Contessa 32, Rival 32. Nicholson 31,32,35. Trident Challenger.

Are there any I have missed?

Thanks

 

[andymcp]

http://www.cornishcrabbers.co.uk/index.cfm/boat/Mystery.Mystery35 ?

Reviewed in this month's Yachting Life.

 

[BurnitBlue]

http://www.cornishcrabbers.co.uk/index.cfm/boat/Mystery.Mystery35 ?

Reviewed in this month's Yachting Life.

Ooops. Sorry about that. My box to be ticked thing should also read a max of £40,000.

And by "modern" I meant something younger than 1967 year build.

OK. I now realise that it is a daft question.

 

[Kurrawong_Kid]

I will probably end up buying a Nicholson 32 because I cannot find a modern equivalent. I have avoided Halmatic moulded hulls for years because they all seem to have the osmosis thing. However as they have nearly all had epoxy treatment I may take a chance.

Before I do I would like to check with you that my short list of alternatives is complete.

Boxes to be ticked are 30 to 35 feet LOA, Medium to heavy displacement, encapsulated keel, solid lay-up (no foam). Keel stepped mast. Professional factory fit-out. Aft cockpit but not mandatory. Go-anywhere.

I have found the following makes tick most of my boxes. Contest 32, Rustler 31, Contessa 32, Rival 32. Nicholson 31,32,35. Trident Challenger.

Are there any I have missed?

Thanks

Does'nt fit your criteria because they have deckstepped masts and non encapsulated lead keels but the Centurion 32 is a fine well built vessel with slightly more room inside than a Nic 32 or Contessa 32.

 

[Salty John]

The budget excludes the Vancouver 32, but, even though it's below your length requirement, I'd consider the Vancouver 27. A very solid boat with accomodation close to that found on others on your list.

 

[Ubergeekian]

Boxes to be ticked are 30 to 35 feet LOA, Medium to heavy displacement, encapsulated keel, solid lay-up (no foam). Keel stepped mast. Professional factory fit-out. Aft cockpit but not mandatory. Go-anywhere.

Are there any I have missed?

Victoria 34?

Ooops. Sorry about that. My box to be ticked thing should also read a max of £40,000.

Hold that thought unless you are willing to go 100% over budget.

Victoria 30?

 

[Robin]

Change the criteria, there are plenty of much better boats in that price bracket that don't have one or more of the features listed like encapsulated keel or keel stepped mast.

Westerly 33 centre cockpit ketch or sloop or Discuss aft cockpit sloop.
Westerly Conway 36 ketch or sloop

To name just two.

 

[BurnitBlue]

The budget excludes the Vancouver 32, but, even though it's below your length requirement, I'd consider the Vancouver 27. A very solid boat with accomodation close to that found on others on your list.

There is a Vancouver 32 that sneaks under my budget in Turkey, but tax not paid. While there I was diverted to a Westerly Conway but the hoops to maintain VAT paid status were expensive. Basically I had to hire a skipper for a week pay the agent fees in Turkey and Greece plus the marina expenses. When I enquired if I could do this myself I was laughed at. "You want to sail my boat out of the country without buying her first?"

The Centurian is a good boat I agree and I am not totally hung up on encapsulated keel. Thanks for the suggestion. I will add her to my list.

 

[BurnitBlue]

Change the criteria, there are plenty of much better boats in that price bracket that don't have one or more of the features listed like encapsulated keel or keel stepped mast.

Westerly 33 centre cockpit ketch or sloop or Discuss aft cockpit sloop.
Westerly Conway 36 ketch or sloop

To name just two.

Yes. And here lies the dilemna for the bottom feeder like me. I have to choose just one boat and the box ticking is just an excercise to keep me "on track".

The argument between keel stepped verses deck stepped masts is really a subject in its own right and deserves its own thread. As does encapsulated verses bolt on keels.

I am not a naval architect but I pay attention to other folks problems. For instance there is a horror story in PBO about a yacht in the North Sea whose mast jumped out of its deck socket and virtually wrecked the boat. That would not happen with keel stepped. There are an number of problems with bolt-on keels but as I said that is a subject for a seperate thread. This may be the last boat I will buy so I want to stay close to my box ticking thing.

I do appreciate the suggestions though and I thank you all.

 

[doug748]

The Centurian is a good boat I agree and I am not totally hung up on encapsulated keel. Thanks for the suggestion.

Cor you've done it now.
Expect a lot of suggestions for Westerlies, French things and sailing surfboards.
On your original theme:
http://www.yachtsnet.co.uk/archives/albin-ballad/albin-ballad.htm
Probably a bit flighty and small for you though.
There is also the Marieholm 32, though there are not many about and I am not sure about the mast step.

 

[Robin]

Yes. And here lies the dilemna for the bottom feeder like me. I have to choose just one boat and the box ticking is just an excercise to keep me "on track".

The argument between keel stepped verses deck stepped masts is really a subject in its own right and deserves its own thread. As does encapsulated verses bolt on keels.

I am not a naval architect but I pay attention to other folks problems. For instance there is a horror story in PBO about a yacht in the North Sea whose mast jumped out of its deck socket and virtually wrecked the boat. That would not happen with keel stepped. There are an number of problems with bolt-on keels but as I said that is a subject for a seperate thread. This may be the last boat I will buy so I want to stay close to my box ticking thing.

I do appreciate the suggestions though and I thank you all.

I have owned boats with both keel stepped and deck stepped masts and my preference would be deck stepped. I haven't read the PBO article but the scenario quoted is one I cannot imagine nor have ever heard of.

I would also chose a bolt on keel over an encapsulated one. For one thing an encapsulated keel limits the hull (and keel) shape to the practicalities of grp moulding and for another chunking rocky bits with grp is not good. The only slight advantage is no iron or lead to require different paint treatments.

The boats being suggested or mentioned by you vary considerably in both living space and performance. The Contessa 32 for example is much smaller than a Nich 32 and by comparison to a W33 or Conway is positively tiny. I would happily live on a W33 or Conway but not on a Co32, R32 or even a Nich 32.

Personally I would be looking at other important aspects first, like where was I intending to go, ocean cruising or more local, live aboard or weekender.

 

[doris]

Why no mention of a Nic 35 or a Rival 34. Both achievable within the budget

 

[BurnitBlue]

Cor you've done it now.
Expect a lot of suggestions for Westerlies, French things and sailing surfboards.
On your original theme:
http://www.yachtsnet.co.uk/archives/albin-ballad/albin-ballad.htm
Probably a bit flighty and small for you though.
There is also the Marieholm 32, though there are not many about and I am not sure about the mast step.

The Albin Ballad has keel stepped mast and encapsulated lead. But it is a light displacement at 3,000 kg. A Swedish sailor "Pappa" almost circumnavigated but bottled out in South Africa and put his Ballad as deck cargo home to Gothenberg. She is for sale for £15,000 right now. But 3000 kg is a bit too flimsy for me. Compare with over 6000 kg on a Nic 32 for just a bit more wonga.

I dont trust the Marieholm because she is sold (was sold) in two versions Swedish and Export on the same hull but different displacement and LWL. There is one for sale in Gothenberg for less than £10,000 on Blocket.se the Swedish ebay. The Nic 32 wins on all criteria.

 

[BurnitBlue]

Why no mention of a Nic 35 or a Rival 34. Both achievable within the budget

I do mention the nic 35 and I have my eye on one in Brighton. There are others but they have a teak deck and this forum gives teak decks on older boats a distinct thumbs down.

The Rival 34 is a chewing gum boat. Ie she is a stretched Rival 32. The additional length is in the overhangs which pleases the Marina immensely.

Still with the Nick 32 but paying attention to Robin and his arguments for the Westerly 33 and Conway 36. Good arguments and very seductive.

Robin if you read this, can you expand on why you prefer deck stepped to keel stepped masts.

 

[Flapjack]

Have a look at a Bruce Roberts 34, encapsulated keel and deck stepped mast and comes in around 6,500 kg, you should be able to find a good one within your budget, I may be slightly biased on this

 

[Twister_Ken]

Not quite to spec, but a Hustler 35?

Or, if you can find one, a Northney 34

Or a Rival 34?

 

[BurnitBlue]

Have a look at a Bruce Roberts 34, encapsulated keel and deck stepped mast and comes in around 6,500 kg, you should be able to find a good one within your budget, I may be slightly biased on this

Agreed. This is Les Powles choice also. I have been looking for one for some time but they are as rare as hens teeth. There is one in Northern Cyprus and a steel one in UK. Don't fancy the steel one while the Northern Cyprus one would be difficult to get at plus it is non-EU. Sailing round to Southern Cyprus for VAT reasons would make for an interesting article in PBO (written from a prison).

 

[BurnitBlue]

Just googled Twister Ken's suggestions for Northney 34 and came up with this site

http://shortlist.50webs.com/index.html

Fascinating and has all the suggestions made on this thread (except the Nicholson 32) are on this chaps shortlist. A soul brother perhaps?

Hours of interesting research here.

 

[Robin]

I do mention the nic 35 and I have my eye on one in Brighton. There are others but they have a teak deck and this forum gives teak decks on older boats a distinct thumbs down.

The Rival 34 is a chewing gum boat. Ie she is a stretched Rival 32. The additional length is in the overhangs which pleases the Marina immensely.

Still with the Nick 32 but paying attention to Robin and his arguments for the Westerly 33 and Conway 36. Good arguments and very seductive.

Robin if you read this, can you expand on why you prefer deck stepped to keel stepped masts.

The keel stepped ones only real advantage IMO is that they transfer the rig loads directly to the keel and that frees the designer from the need to place either internal bulkheads or support struts in the cabin where they might not be convenient to the layout otherwise, this is rarely a real problem as most boats will need a main bulkhead in about the right place anyway. Tuning keel stepped rigs is more difficult as there is a secondary contact point where the mast passes through the deck and where wedges (rubber spacers) are needed. Then any water entering the mast via halyard entries and exits or even the mainsail track inevitably finds it's way below into the bilges and that assumes a perfect seal at the mast coat on the deck opening which will need replacing periodically. Mast removal and re-stepping is more complicated and the mast is heavier, there is no possibility of doing it without a crane lift. There is also a tendency for the base of a keel stepped mast to corrode where it sits in a pool of salty bilge water. Finally, mast storage is more of a problem ashore because of the extra length and carrying it on deck as in perhaps going through the canals to the Med would be harder.

The Westerly 33 was a heavy (in modern terms) built boat, around twice the displacement of a Co32 for example and much more than the equivalent Moody or similar. I'm not saying weight is everything but you seem to favour heavier rather than lighter. We owned a W33 Ketch for 14 years and would happily take it anywhere. We sailed ours across Channel several times upwind in gale force conditions on the weekend booze runs, but we were more masochistic back then! There is a well known curate from Weymouth that used to sail his Discus (same hull aft cockpit) with young disadvantaged kids as crew, not on Channel jollies but to Newfoundland or Greenland and finally round the world even round Cape Horn I think.

The Westerly Conway (same designer Laurent Giles as the W33/Discus) was an earlier design than the W33 but a very good long distance cruiser which had a walk through to the aft cabin and a 2nd loo over the W33, otherwise the same below.

Thinking more outside the box than I suspect you will want, but look at the Jeanneau Sunfizz 40 which will just be in your budget. This was designed by Philipe Briande specifically for the OSTAR transatlantic race which takes the upwind masochist's route but around 1000 were subsequently built as a production cruiser racer in the early 1980s. We have friends with a really lovely one that was the catalyst to our going Jeanneau and buying the Sun Fizz replacement, the 1988 Sun Legende 41 we owned for 10 years until December. The later Sun Fizz 40s are better with a nice teak interior, early ones had some formica that was a Marmite (like it or hate it) finish. There are plenty about but many were chartered and the better ones will like our friend's have been fitted with extra stowage lockers below to replace the pilot berths. We just missed one when we were looking that had done the Atlantic circuit and had all the gear, as did our Sun Legende but that would be out of your price range.

I agree too about the teak decks, cockpit yes if glued not screwed down, decks oh no no no!

 

[Robin]

Just googled Twister Ken's suggestions for Northney 34 and came up with this site

http://shortlist.50webs.com/index.html

Fascinating and has all the suggestions made on this thread (except the Nicholson 32) are on this chaps shortlist. A soul brother perhaps?

Hours of interesting research here.

Just saw this post. Northney 34s are very pretty but the one we knew locally required a lot of effort tugging on the tiller, plus they are smaller than the length suggests.

The Hustler 35s were on our shortlist when we bought our W33 and are superbly pretty, there is a delightful one in our club which might even be the one in the picture below. Most were built in race layout form with pilot berths, only a few had cruisy U-shaped dinette layouts. The W33 was much bigger below the the Hustler, with a (W33) LWL of 28'10".