Introducing myself with a question.

[Nauti-lass John]

Hi guys (and gals), I have been perusing this forum for a while now and have been soaking up the valuable opinions. (be gentle with me, )
I have been looking for a boat suitable for living in the med for 6 months of the year, during the winter I will be working back in the UK and saving up for the summers. My boating experience is limited to a very small day boat back in the '80s. I plan on doing the required courses this winter in the UK.

I have found a President Edership 395 which may be suitable I feel. It has the Cummins engines.


My question is, has anyone got any advice pertaining to this model and my proposed new life style?

Thanks, John

 

[Prhperio]

Firstly, best of luck with your plans... They sound idyllic ��. I can't help in any great way but in case you haven't come across Latestarter in your browsing, he's the cummins expert so I would guess it's worth posting the exact details of the engines and hopefully he'll give you chapter and verse on them.

Best of luck with your plans and boat search and do keep us all posted. I'm sure you know that pictures are pretty much mandatory here when you discuss a boat you've seen ��

 

[PlanB]

A few random comments.
How much are you planning on using the boat. That size would suggest you need a fair bit of practice before using it in seagoing conditions.
Why not do your day skipper in the western (tidal) Med, that way you'll get a feel for things.
Aft cabins are good in the Med as they stay relatively cool. But they can slightly complicate stern to mooring.
How are you going to get your boat to the Med? Either fuel costs or transport are going to cost up to 10 grand. Buying in the Med is a good option.
Don't know the boat myself, but from pics looks a good liveaboard.

 

[Nauti-lass John]

As requested, here she is.




I did consider training in the med (which is where the boat is already) but the boat is in the Eastern side. I'm not sure how that works over there. More research needed I guess.

As far as how much I intend to use her it will depend on how thirsty/deep my fuel ration is . I'm guessing about 40-60 l/Hr at cruise with her twin Cummins 300Hp. I plan on just dropping anchor most of the time except when I need to take on fuel, water and supplies when marina/s or ports would be used.

She does have an aft cabin plus bow and stern thrusters so stern to mooring should be easier for the likes of a newbie like me.

My big concern at the moment is her too low engine hours. One engine was rebuilt in April 2008 after less than 600 hours use! (16,000 Euros! Ouch). I will need to get oil samples taken to have analysed. I also think the Radar may be not working.
Due to work commitments I cannot get out to do a sea trial for at least another 4 weeks. I don't want to give too many details until I see the contract ( how common is gazumping in the boaty world?).

Thanks for your input guys.:encouragement:

 

[Divemaster1]

Welcome to the forum !!

Lovely plans and if this is the one in Croatia, she looks like she'll have Cummins QSB's at 300 Hp .. Very good engines with few issues. Some issues with the raw water pump, but believe this is relatively easy to fix.

If in Croatia and you want to get her to Italy/France/Spain, taking her on own keel or by sea freight is the only option, so you need to consider that into the price as well.

I also believe your fuel consumption figures are very optimistic. That hull will not be an easy push so will take some HP to get her going .. if you take out approx. 200 HP from each engine at Cruise, you will burn approx. 70 LPh .. and if running harder, the figures will grow scary and you will exceed 100 Lph at full throttle... I am not sure of what kind of speeds you believe she'll travel at, but fast she will not be ... For fuel economy, you'll be better off pootling around 7 knots and enjoy the fact that the engines are merely sipping lightly at the Go-go juice...

 

[Nauti-lass John]

Welcome to the forum !!

Lovely plans and if this is the one in Croatia, she looks like she'll have Cummins QSB's at 300 Hp .. Very good engines with few issues. Some issues with the raw water pump, but believe this is relatively easy to fix.

If in Croatia and you want to get her to Italy/France/Spain, taking her on own keel or by sea freight is the only option, so you need to consider that into the price as well.

I also believe your fuel consumption figures are very optimistic. That hull will not be an easy push so will take some HP to get her going .. if you take out approx. 200 HP from each engine at Cruise, you will burn approx. 70 LPh .. and if running harder, the figures will grow scary and you will exceed 100 Lph at full throttle... I am not sure of what kind of speeds you believe she'll travel at, but fast she will not be ... For fuel economy, you'll be better off pootling around 7 knots and enjoy the fact that the engines are merely sipping lightly at the Go-go juice...

Thank you.

My plan was to spend at least one or two seasons around Croatia, Albania and Montenegro and I wouldn't mind 'pootling' in order to 'sip lightly' . I'm old enough now not to 'feel the need for speed' to quote from one of my favourite films. I wasn't aware that WOT would be 100ltrs/Hr or more! (mental note not to inform swimbo of these figures )
I was looking originally at trawler style boats which would be cheaper on fuel but I do like the thought that, when needed, I could hit 20Kn to get me out of trouble or to be in the bar first .

I was also kind of hoping that the German influence on the Taiwan builder would be of better quality as per BMW or maybe Merc. I have seen similar Ederships with twin 140Hp and twin 250Hppp right up to twin 440Hp. I assumed that 300Hp would be a better compromise between consumption and speed. Maybe I'm wrong?

 

[PlanB]

I agree with Divemaster´s comments on fuel consumption.

Another thing to consider is that motor boats, as opposed to yachts with keels, can be very uncomfortable at anchor for any length of time in anything other than flat calm, and the Med is rarely flat calm. You will also be affected by wind in a flybridge boat. You may find yourself in marinas more than you think.

You will presumably be factoring marina costs overwinter into your budget.

 

[Nauti-lass John]

I agree with Divemaster´s comments on fuel consumption.

Another thing to consider is that motor boats, as opposed to yachts with keels, can be very uncomfortable at anchor for any length of time in anything other than flat calm, and the Med is rarely flat calm. You will also be affected by wind in a flybridge boat. You may find yourself in marinas more than you think.

You will presumably be factoring marina costs overwinter into your budget.

Thanks for the input. I'm grateful for your shared experience.
I have budgeted around €2000 for overwintering if this is about right. I accept that these types of boat will rock a lot with the swell but we kinda like that (quite soporific if you're into that type of thing). I have spent week on a 17' cabin cruiser for a in a force 8 a few years ago down in Falmouth.
Having said all that I may well spend more time in a marina than I planned. My biggest fear is that the engines on this boat have been very underused and may have an expensive consequence

Do you think I should be looking at a trawler style boat instead?

 

[Divemaster1]

Having been quoted more than €4,000 for a quarter in Italy for a 45 Ft many years ago, I think you are very optimistic on overwintering budget as well..

You will have lift-out, anti-fouling, maintenance, electricity etc., on top of that ...

 

[Nauti-lass John]

Having been quoted more than €4,000 for a quarter in Italy for a 45 Ft many years ago, I think you are very optimistic on overwintering budget as well..

You will have lift-out, anti-fouling, maintenance, electricity etc., on top of that ...

€4000 is a bit eye watering! :blue: The marina where the boat is at the moment is only £929.02 for a < 13Mtr boat (2014 prices) for a full year including 1 lift! Water and electric are extra of course.
I was expecting maintenance + anti fouling etc to be on top of my €2000 budget.

My overall budget is about £50k per annum for living (as frugally as possible ) on the water for 6 months and 12months running/maintenance. Does this seem about right?

 

[Divemaster1]

Think you will find Croatia, Montenegro etc., very reasonable compared with the West coast of Italy, SOF and Spain... and the price you're quoting must be about the lowest I've heard of ... I pay more than twice that in NE Scotland for 14.3M ... and that is excluding lift-out & EL...

 

[vas]

I doubt you'll find annual mooring for less than a grand anywhere in the Med. I'm on the cheap end and still pay 1200euro pa for a 13X4 berth in Volos in an non supervised, open marina (well not quite that the city port) but which is 400mtrs from home.
Unless you decide to stick around eastern Adriatica you'll have to budget close to 10 times that amount (imho)

btw, welcome to the forum

cheers

V.

 

[Cashbuyer]

"My biggest fear is that the engines on this boat have been very underused and may have an expensive consequence"

You mention this twice. It's praying on your mind and you are talking yourself into the boat because it has some benefits, ie price and space. Go with your first thought and look elsewhere. Those low hours are an issue and you know it.

Whatever you decide, good luck.