Interesting report from the Marine Casualty Investigation Board - Ireland
- Thread starter Irish Rover
- Start date
Tranona
Well-known member
That is interesting. They have classified the boat (a Bavaria 40) as Category B in their Code of Practice whereas it is firmly in Category A of the RCD.
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JumbleDuck
Well-known member
I'm intrigued to learn that a Bavaria 40 is only RCD Class B. That aside, it seems he had one day's notice of a storm coming in when he had almost crossed Biscay. Can't really see what option he had but to try to ride it out.
doug748
Well-known member
Thanks for that Irish Rover.
Blimey. Well under 24hours of setting off, the shipping forecast was giving:
4th June. Shipping Forecast
Gale Warnings:
Biscay Storm 10 expected later
Fitzroy SW 8 imminent Storm 10 later
That would have given them time to divert if they were aware of it - that's the lesson for me.
The report does not seem to have made enough of this.
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Blimey. Well under 24hours of setting off, the shipping forecast was giving:
4th June. Shipping Forecast
Gale Warnings:
Biscay Storm 10 expected later
Fitzroy SW 8 imminent Storm 10 later
That would have given them time to divert if they were aware of it - that's the lesson for me.
The report does not seem to have made enough of this.
.
RJJ
Well-known member
Interesting indeed.
that's not what's quoted in the report, though? where do you get this from? My read of this is they were incredibly unlucky - and what worries me is it's not clear how any of us would have fared much better.
- The report says 4th June, Fitzroy/Sole - NW 5 to 7, no gale warnings. They were still a day or two from Biscay
- 6th June gives Biscay 10 perhaps 11. And that's what smacked them. It says by that point there was no avoiding it; that forecast was issued 1130 on the 6th and the really rotten weather was on them shortly after.
I don't see that a logged passage plan would have helped them much?
To me it seems the only advantage they didn't take was to check the Navtex,...assuming it would have received that far offshore?? or otherwise obtain a couple of hours warning. They could then have set storm sails and removed the sprayhood in good time, and might have been able to weather it in a sustainable way. But still probably not.
doug748
Well-known member
"Interesting indeed.
that's not what's quoted in the report, though? where do you get this from? "
Appendix, Page 32:
"Fig. 4 . UK Met Office Shipping Forecast 4th June."
In fact someone has doctored what looks like a fax from that date, with some information from a later forecast. Looks like some sort of clerical cock up.
.
that's not what's quoted in the report, though? where do you get this from? "
Appendix, Page 32:
"Fig. 4 . UK Met Office Shipping Forecast 4th June."
In fact someone has doctored what looks like a fax from that date, with some information from a later forecast. Looks like some sort of clerical cock up.
.
Tranona
Well-known member
It is Cat A under the RCD. The Cat B refers to the Irish COP, which I assume (although not read it) is similar to the MCA Codes which do not follow the RCD but are more granular.
matt1
Well-known member
Quite an advert for Bavaria 
I’ve only skim read it on my phone but seems shortsighted not to have referred to the Navtex.
I’ve only skim read it on my phone but seems shortsighted not to have referred to the Navtex.glynd
Active member
Absolutely no mention of a barometer on board - wonder if they had one / were taking note of any changes.
Stemar
Well-known member
I've never sailed there, but I've looked at the chart and there aren't many places I'd want to go into in a 10-11. I've seen vids of Cap Breton in decent sailing weather; can you imagine trying to get in there in F10-11? ?
JumbleDuck
Well-known member
Merci beaucoup.
SimonKNZ
Active member
I'm surprised the keel didn't fall off!
Actually as the owner of an identical yacht (Bavaria 39 Cruiser) the fact they reboarded several days later, pumped out the bilge, started the engine and made passage home is very nice reading
Actually as the owner of an identical yacht (Bavaria 39 Cruiser) the fact they reboarded several days later, pumped out the bilge, started the engine and made passage home is very nice reading
Fascadale
Well-known member
There is brief mention in the report about the deployment of a sea anchor, but with warps to short IIRC
After the recent threads on the subject I wonder if they would have fared better with a JSD?
I do think they were exceptionally unlucky. Who would expect a storm so severe in June?
Jumping off the boat into those sea conditions must have been terrifying: hope I never have to
After the recent threads on the subject I wonder if they would have fared better with a JSD?
I do think they were exceptionally unlucky. Who would expect a storm so severe in June?
Jumping off the boat into those sea conditions must have been terrifying: hope I never have to
matt1
Well-known member
Did the 39 become the 40 (eg same hull?) looks very similar to Patrick Laine’s vessel.
Impressive that they were simply able to jump back on board and get going. Perhaps an example of how yacht design / stds / RCD have changed things for the better? Despite being abandoned, in atrocious conditions, the boat clearly wasn’t rolled unlike “Ocean Madam” a Beneteau of similar size in the 90’s and of course the many Fastnet casualties.
westernman
Well-known member
I agree - and this is the most worrying aspect of this report.
Indeed. Also the idea that if they had not been quite so far into their voyage, they could have simply turned around and gone back seems unreasonable. How much progress could they make against a gale force and increasing wind?
Not at all. But if they had sunk without trace, then a few days later, a search might have been initiated. Which would of course have been far too late.
The only question I have, is that may be it is better to deploy a sea anchor from the stern? I understand that the boat was being blown backwards too fast and so ending up broadside to the waves which was the real problem they had. If the drogue had been deployed from the stern would things have been better?
Achosenman
Active member
I think the time to answer that question was long gone. I’ve never experienced survival condition first hand, but I’d be very reticent to gamble in those circumstances.
shaunksb
Well-known member
I can’t see a mention of the crew filling in a log but a look back at the barometer readings would have given them the clue they needed to get the storm sails set before they were hit. There was some relatively calm weather before the storm hit.
Once the sails were blown out they were helpless.
Interesting that they refer to the boat category the same way as the RCD. F8, 4m waves as design limitations of the boat.
Take a Cat A next time.
___________________________
Once the sails were blown out they were helpless.
Interesting that they refer to the boat category the same way as the RCD. F8, 4m waves as design limitations of the boat.
Take a Cat A next time.
___________________________
Tranona
Well-known member
Its not the boat but the "mens within um" Not a criticism of the crew, just an observation that boats can withstand more than people. Glad I was not in their position.Quite an advert for Bavaria
PhillM
Well-known member
As you say, interesting reading. The report appears to suggest that if they had heard the forecast earlier, then they could have turned West and kept off the continental shelf.
I was also interested to hear that the boat could not make headway into the storm. Easy to write this from my armchair, but I wonder if turning around and running downwind might have helped?
I was also interested to hear that the boat could not make headway into the storm. Easy to write this from my armchair, but I wonder if turning around and running downwind might have helped?
Tranona
Well-known member
Confusing because that seems to be the Irish COP category, not the RCD where the boat is in A but of course RCD does not include safety gear etc that is in the COP. actually the weather and sea conditions exceeded even the RCD A requirement and the boat survived.