Hunter Medina vs Swift 18 et al

Interesting comments so far but search not going that well. The budget, plus length restrictions plus lifting keel soon reduces what is out there.

He's decided against the Swift 18

Looks like the Hunter Medina and Copland Harrier are good possibilities

Would like to be able to afford either Parker 21 or Beneteau First 210, they are getting cheaper but not cheap enough yet.

Seems that the Benetau would fall over a bit when drying out. How far? Does anyone have experience of this? Not that they are affordable...
 
I think the mods will have to delete this thread due to numerous breaches of the forum rules.

In an effort to save it, I suggest you really want either a Hunter Impala or a Westerly Centaur.

In other news, and talking of mini-transats, the E-boat might be worth a look. If you don't overdo the sail plan (as I used to) then they can be good quick boats, dry out flat fun to sail. Being beamy as they are there is surprising amounts of room below.
 
The E-boat is actually a good shout.

Regarding the Beneteau 210 falling over, I have the swing keel 235 (slightly too long, over budget) and it dries out upright in soft mud. It would need legs if it was a harder bottom and that would really only be okay if supervised. I definitely wouldn't want it siting on a drying mooring where it was leaning over every low tide. I keep mine afloat with the keel down.
 
I am indeed Mr Ed.

Little Grebe said:
The intended berth is a locked marina so presumably the requirement for an ability to dry out relates to cruising destinations rather than being left unattended on a drying mooring
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Indeed it is. Being Chichester based, destinations include East Head, Bembridge, Newtown Creek, Priory Bay etc etc. The ability to float in a puddle and sit flat gets one nearer to hostelries and other facilities.

Just added the Jaguar 21 to the list.
 
Taking account of all sage advice offered, I bought the nearest and cheapest I could find that fits the bill. Jaguar 21. Life is so much easier when the thing is only a few miles away!
 
I'm reopening this thread in hope of there being readers' knowledge of how the Hunter's drop-keel may be used.

I've noticed a Medina parked on a pontoon berth near me, whose keel is clearly lowered when the boat is afloat...

...and when I go back at low tide, the boat is on the mud and the keel is raised in its case, standing up in the cabin.

Is the casing in danger of being damaged by the plate shifting up and down, relying on the boat pushing down to raise the keel?

I can't see why the owner has left it down on a sheltered pontoon - I doubt she'd be dangerously unstable, floating with it raised.
 
I had a Hunter Medina for about 12 years- lovely boat to sail. I always sailed her with the keel locked down, as per the original recommendations. I was on a non-drying mooring, and used to leave it with the keel half way up, in case it grounded in a very low spring tide. . There is quite a weight in the keel, and I think leaving it in the fully raised position would raise the centre of gravity a bit high, and so would be rather rolly in bad weather - on a swinging mooring.

My concern about leaving the keel down when drying out would be that the end of the plate might penetrate the mud a little. Then any turning moment on the boat (ie change of tide, or just wind swift) would try and twist the plate in the keel box. I don't think it is designed to do that.
 
Thanks Keith.

In the case I've watched, I don't think there's much chance of the floating hull ranging around over the keel dug in the mud, although that's sure to be a concern on a swinging mooring. Nor is her berth a 'rolly' place.

I'm mostly concerned that enduring many months berthed with the keel sliding freely up and down with the tide, may make the boat a less good potential purchase than might be preferred.

To my knowledge the mud is very soft and deep, so the keel-case may not have suffered strain if she did move this way and that.

Very tempting boat!
 
Dan,

the things to check in this case are possible / probable wear on the pivot bolt and mountings, hole in the plate, likewise on the lift wire and attachment hole on the plate.

It was daft for the owner to leave it down all that time, as the pivot points will wear by wave joggling and sideways forces by winds.
 
So the Medina has a daggerboard type keel, not a centreboard style - all the better and my mistake.

I must say I've never fancied internal ballast though, very little effect for a shallow bilged modern yot - compared to HMS Victory..

A bulb on the end of the keel has far more leverage and if correctly shaped acts the same as a wing fence on swept wing aircraft, keeping flow over the keel and ' lift ' to windward.
 
oldhunter said:
The medina has built in ballast as well as the keel so no problem leaving the keel up when moored.
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You might wish to review your opinion!

We have just had the major storm (Callum) rip through North Wales.

There were a number of casualties at their moorings. Nearly all were lift keel boats.

Two Medinas, a Jaguar 21, and a trimaran were knocked over and sunk at their moorings. All were in the same locality. A Swift and a Bene 211 stayed upright. I am told that all had their keels left to drop when afloat. I personally suspect the main reason for sinking was not related to stability with a raised keel which is very very poor. It was more likely due to the lack of a full keel enclosure allowing the boat to flood as it was knocked over repeatedly in the F11 gusts. It could also be that the free moving "unlocked" dagger board keels retracted in the worst knockdowns causing two of the boats to turn turtle and destroy their masts. I very much doubt that any of the designs would have stayed upright with their keels left in the raised position. I used to sail a Trapper lift keel design. The prototype foundered during initial sea trials in this way. It was then modified and fitted with a bulb at the bottom and a keel to cabin top watertight keel enclosure.....

Steve
 
A Jaguar 21 was found laying on her side after severe squalls at her mooring next to mine and prodded back upright by the crew of a rowing skiff :)

The Anderson 22 is apparently self righting with the keel raised - I've been on the mooring on occasions I've thought ' Christ ! ' as we were blown to about 40 degrees by squalls - Bob Salmon sailed ' Anderson Affair ' most of the way to Antigua with the keel up, but he was a braver man than me.
 
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Storm Callum managed to sink three bilge keelers in Aberaeron, including an Achilles 24 and 6 power boats.
To be fair however the major cause of sinkings was logs of up to 30 long coming down the river and landing on mooring risers.
 
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