How viable is it to liveaboard and explore on a 40ft motor boat?

[vertford]

As Head of Our Future Plans, SWMBO has asked me to look at our prospects for retiring early on a 40ft motor boat vs a 40ft yacht. I can work my way around the 40ft WAFI options, but am stumped on the MOBY option. We went to Dusseldof this year and crawled all over an Elling, Linsen and Broom for starters. The volume, comfort factor on a MOBY are appealing as we are looking to spend most of time onboard. Our income will limited and mostly rental from our house. No pension.
We would like to explore N Europe and down to the Med, but does the fuel cost make the exploring option much less viable in a MOBY? Do we have accept to a certain degree that we will have a very nice floating home and then maybe use the boat as a base to explore from rather than huge passages to exotic places frequently? I think fuel is 90p a litre and that a reasonable cruising speed is 9knts but could be wrong.
And yes, we will look to charter a MOBY before we dive in.
Many thanks for any tips, other brands or advice.
Richard

 

[vandy]

Richard, if you are only used to spend time on the boat "leisurely" rather than as liveaboard, I'd suggest you try and spend a couple of months on your boat before making bid decisions! It is a totally different experience when you have a floating home...

The maintenance cost on a motorboat + fuel will be marginally higher compared to a sailboat no matter how much people argue on cost of sails etc.

 

[Whitelighter]

Get one with a if single engine - the Dutch make excellent long term cruising boats as you know.

The Elling is excellent, as are the linssens and other similar craft.
Anything smdesigned for planning speed is going to cost a lot more to run and since you have time why get there fast.

 

[vertford]

Thanks Vandy. We are about 5 years away from motor/yacht purchase, so the leisure/liveaboard balance will kick in then. I suspect fuel costs will one of the major tipping points.

 

[superheat6k]

It is cheaper for me to run a Mobo based on the Hamble than a sail yacht because the marina fees are so ridiculous. I can navigate under the bridges and to cheaper freedom beyond.

For two I would find 40' just fine, but strongly recommend an aft cabin with an island bed.

If you want to explore Europe via the canals you will also want a shallow draft and protected props. So a deep keel that sits below the props and also a set of beaching legs.

At 8-9 knots reckon a twin engine will provide around 4-5 MPG, more on a single shaft so don't rule out Nimbus.

I am obviously biased to a Corvette, but at 32' with its blunt bow the interior is the equivalent of most pointy bow boats at 36'. My longer term plan is longer distance cruising in this boat when the kids have flown, and for me this is just great, but I know SWMBO will have a time limit of around 7-10 days per leg. Not sure that a bigger boat would do much to extend this range limitation though !!!

The Dutch barge style boats such as the Linsen are well worth looking at. Plenty of short production models available along similar lines.

 

[vertford]

Thanks Wlighter. The Dutch do seem to produce a huge range of craft. Point noted about semi displacement vs planning.

 

[vertford]

I can navigate under the bridges and to cheaper freedom beyond.

Another plus I realised at Dusseldorf

For two I would find 40' just fine, but strongly recommend an aft cabin with an island bed.

Noted. We are tired of squeezing into aft quarterberths/cabins



I am obviously biased to a Corvette, but at 32' with its blunt bow the interior is the equivalent of most pointy bow boats at 36'. My longer term plan is longer distance cruising in this boat when the kids have flown, and for me this is just great, but I know SWMBO will have a time limit of around 7-10 days per leg. Not sure that a bigger boat would do much to extend this range limitation though !!!

Interesting point about leg range, so to speak.

Thanks

 

[oldgit]

If value for money does figure anywhere in the proposal ,may I suggest looking at a Fairline Turbo 36.Some of the very last ones will probably compare very well with your already viewed boats regards condition and modernity.They are a lesson in how to maximise internal space on a boat without comprising seakeeping or finish quality.
You will also not have to lay out to buy or lose a shed load of money due to depreciation when you come to sell.
Although the desirable versions have the biggest engines,handy to get you across stretches of water in hurry,they will only sip fuel on tickover.The radar arch can be hinged to get you under the low bridges on inland waterways.One of our club members is about to go down to the Med with his Turbo 36 through the canals.

 

[longjohnsilver]

It is cheaper for me to run a Mobo based on the Hamble than a sail yacht because the marina fees are so ridiculous. I can navigate under the bridges and to cheaper freedom beyond.

For two I would find 40' just fine, but strongly recommend an aft cabin with an island bed.

If you want to explore Europe via the canals you will also want a shallow draft and protected props. So a deep keel that sits below the props and also a set of beaching legs.

At 8-9 knots reckon a twin engine will provide around 4-5 MPG, more on a single shaft so don't rule out Nimbus.

I am obviously biased to a Corvette, but at 32' with its blunt bow the interior is the equivalent of most pointy bow boats at 36'. My longer term plan is longer distance cruising in this boat when the kids have flown, and for me this is just great, but I know SWMBO will have a time limit of around 7-10 days per leg. Not sure that a bigger boat would do much to extend this range limitation though !!!

The Dutch barge style boats such as the Linsen are well worth looking at. Plenty of short production models available along similar lines.

Max hull speed on a 40' hull will be around 7ish knots so pushing up to 8-9 it's will be very inefficient. At just below hull speed on our 48' trawler yacht we manage about 3mpg.

 

[Tranona]

As suggested a displacement boat is better than a planing boat, but the choice is very limited if you want to do the whole coast of N Europe into the Med. Better if you are prepared to use the canals to get there. However if you want to do the whole Med (that is go east as well as Spain and France) you will find constraints of range and coping with long passages at low speed.

As you have probably observed, most cruising liveaboards choose a sailing boat for the versatility and lower operating costs. A modern 40' will achieve similar passage times under either sail or motor (or more commonly a combination) to a displacement motor boat. accommodation volume is similar boat arranged in a different way, although some of the newer boats like the Beneteau Sense range are more like motor boats in layout.

Given your limited income costs will be important and you will find many threads on the liveaboard forum on cruising budgets. Of course much depends on your lifestyle, but keeping away from marinas as much as you can, it is quite possible to cruise on a budget as low as £12-15k pa.

 

[Momac]

Why not consider buying a smaller boat now so as to develop some boat handling skills? On the Thames perhaps?
You will inevitably see a variety of boats and also develop a better feel for the future 40 footer that you wish for.

'

 

[gjgm]

I do not know anything about them- and the canals woudl be out-but anyone know how motor-cats/sailing cats would stack up ?

 

[Trundlebug]

Another thing to consider with mobo vs sailing yacht is power and hot water requirements.

Living aboard a mobo which is moving fairly regularly, power, heating and hot water are no problem.
On yachts, the accommodation is more limted, and so are the "luxuries" that can be pretty much taken for granted on a well equipped mobo.

Yes you can kit both out with solar panels, webasto hot water heating, generator etc but generally there is more comfort, space and suitability on a mobo IMHO. The many people living aboard yachts out there will disagree and prove by their own existence in numbers that it's quite possible, but in my view yachts are built for longer open water passages, mobos are better for exploring and living aboard.

It all boils down to where you intend to go.

Another thought re: displacement vs planing boats.
With planing boats weight is an important factor in their construction, speed and fuel consumption.
Yes you have the option to go faster but with all the extra weight of liveaboard "stuff" the fuel cosnumption will be even higher than normal, with lower top speed than you might hope. They're also a bit more lightly built for the bump and grind of inland canals, locks etc.

Displacement boats tend to be more heavily built, Dutch steel boats obviously more so. A bit of extra liveaboard kit isn't going to make much difference so you can take what you can carry without worry about its effect on performance.

FWIW I have a 33 ft displacement boat, twin engined. We get about 4mpg, (over 5mpg has been seen) a single engine would easily get 7mpg at 6-7 knots. A 40 footer would be heavier so figures would not be much different, cruising speed could be up to 10 knots.

 

[Nigelpickin]

You've looked around an Elling, I guess it comes down to whether or not you could see yourselves full timing on that size of boat.

The E3 is TARDIS like, had loads of storage, plenty of domestic luxuries, dish/clothes washer - wet heating - under floor heating, is economical to run and will get you anywhere you want to go. You will stuggle, imho, to find a more suitable boat for a couple to run away in.

There are some good, (a lot of Elling owners are proudly fastidious with there boats), examples out there and prices are very reasonable for a 10 year old boat.

fwiw, we are full timing on an albeit different kind of boat, do it and do it as soon as you are able, the only caveat being that you both need to be in love with the life, make sure it's the thing for you....

Good luck!

 

[IDAMAY]

An exciting prospect! We have been living aboard a motor boat for the last 10+ years. We sold our house and moved aboard right at the beginning. We moved too much stuff into storage thinking we might last three years or so and still have about a 20 foot containers worth waiting for the day when we give up the nautical life.

We have lived on three boats during that time - a Sealine T47 (planing), a Trader 42 (semi displacement) and now a Trader 54 (also semi displacement). On the semi displacement boats we spend most time at displacement speeds to optimise fuel consumption. We have had most home comforts on all three boats - washer/driers and dishwashers on two of them and now a washer and separate dryer. Importantly all three boats have freezers as well as a fridge. We also have a very extensive inventory and I think SWMBO would not have been happy with the storage capacity of anything less than about 45 feet. There is IMHO a very direct correlation between size and comfort! Clearly the downside of that equation is cost.

We have cruised quite extensively over that time, including twice to Scandinavia and also to West France and the west coast of the UK as far as the Isle of Skye. We have so far over wintered each year in south coast marinas. Our annual costs have probably averaged between £20K to £25 including mooring, insurance, fuel and routine servicing but excluding any re-fitting we have done, eg: re-upholstery or new covers.

For the first couple of years we spent winters on board but the UK winter climate and boats don't go very well together. It's too damp and cold. For the last seven years or so we have left the boat in UK and spent the winter in rented property on the Algarve. We spend up to four months there to avoid the worst of the winter here. In fact the Spring doesn't seem so good either so we are planning to take the boat down there this year to see how living on board would be in a warmer/drier climate.

We have absolutely no regrets at our decision and have enjoyed the freedom to explore some beautiful and relatively inaccessible places. Of course, it's not all fun and occasionally the weather/sea puts you in situations you would prefer to avoid. Having no fixed itinerary helps minimise them though.

All in all a great life style. Good luck and happy cruising.

Richard.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

It is perfectly viable to live on a 40ft mobo but if you're planning also to do extended cruising around Europe and the Med as well you're going to need something seaworthy and that means a boat designed for bluewater displacement cruising. If it were me I wouldn't be looking much further than one of these

http://www.nordhavn.com/models/40/
http://www.selenetrawlers.com/yachts/selene-42/
http://www.defevereurope.eu/#!blank/l3nah

This kind of boat will give you a combination of living space, seaworthiness and low fuel consumption

 

[Spi D]

You have plenty of options to rent a boat for canal-'training' in eg. Holland.

We did it last year and have to admit that these purpose built vessels are spot on. Speed limit is 6 km (interesting - kilometers on the water) so fairly small engines hence acceptable mpg.
We had a 10.50m x 3.85m steel boat, new(ish) planned for two. High quality, central heating, double glazing, insulated etc. etc. Island bed, separate wc and shower. Plenty of space.

Probly not the right boat for Med cruising, though.

Not connected etc.
Link: http://www.yachtcharterheegstra.nl/schepen-overzicht/freule.html

 

[EU_Cruiser]

The requirements for sea/ocean cruising and inland waterway cruising are very different. As an example, fuel consumption is more likely to be measured in liters (gallons) per hour. And with a maximum speed of 20kph on the very large waterways (going down to 5kph on some of the very small ones) 100hp-ish engine is the max you will need.

Were it me I would decide which I wished to do first, sea or waterways, and then buy the boat suited to that environment and when tiring of that environment I would sell and buy the other boat. My guess is that inland waterway living in the EU is much cheaper than sea port based living and with many thousands of kilometers of waterway to explore you might be of quite an age before you pack it up.

 

[TQA]

I am a full time liveaboard on a raggie. The liveaboards on mobos who anchor out rather than use marinas nearly all have large outriggers with flopper stoppers to deal with the roll.

If you plan to anchor out this should be high on your checklist.

If it is inside your budget look at the powercats that are becoming popular.

 

[oldgit]

H,mm .....so are we talking 70K or 700K ?.