How much does it cost to run a boat?

[Mavisto]

Hello Everyone.

I need some help and advice from all you Sail Boat owners out there. So I better start at the beginning.

I've had the cars and the motorbikes (still got them infact) but I've never owned a sail boat. I've owned a couple of RIB's when I was younger and used to do a lot of diving but even though I love the ocean and have spent some time beneath it, I've never actually been sailing.

Whilst on holiday in France, my partner and I started looking at the yachts in the harbour and thinking how nice it would be, when we decide to give up work, to be able to sail around the UK or over to France. We therefore started to think about buying one.

This isn't a short term idea, I'm not planning to go and buy a boat next week, but maybe in five years time. Our plan at the moment is to take a bit of time off work and undertake some training. Then perhaps spend a few of our summer's on Flotilla Holidays and then, if the finances allow it (and if we both enjoy it) buying something then. I really like the look of a Dufour 34.

Our idea for a sea going future had also interested some of our friends, particularly another couple who have suggested at the moment that they might consider a boat share.

If this plan is to go ahead, we are thinking of taking some equity out of our house and were thinking of about £20K each to buy the boat. This of course may all change if the cost of running the boat are excessive.

So, how much does it cost to run a boat?

How often do sails have to be replaced and engines serviced? Is it better to keep the boat in the water all year round or take it out during the winter? As you can tell, I really am new to this!!!

I've searched the internet for some ideas, but most replies seem to be from America. I really need to find out some info that applies to the UK and Europe.

I'm sorry if this is in the wrong forum, but as I said above I'm really new to this.

 

[prv]

I'm afraid that really is a piece-of-string question. Some people pay five or six thousand per annum for a Hamble marina berth, pay for tradesmen to do all their routine maintenance, and buy new sails every couple of years. Others keep old boats on self-laid moorings costing nothing, or club moorings costing a couple of hundred a year, buy most of their kit from Aldi and eBay, and enjoy doing everything themselves.

How much do you want to spend?

EDIT: To be a little more specific, cruising sails will easily do ten years, and some people keep them for many decades. They don't (usually!) suddenly stop working, they just get less and less efficient and if you can live with that (or don't know any better!) you can keep using them.

Sailing is safer than driving, so insurance costs are less. Couple of hundred fully comp?

Engines are usually serviced / winterised each year, but most are far simpler than car engines and easy to do yourself. (Some would argue that if you have to pay someone else because you don't know how, your lack of knowledge is a liability at sea in case of breakdown (paying because you don't have time or inclination is different)).

Traditionally boats are brought ashore for the winter, but not everyone does this any more. You do really need to lift out every year or two, if only briefly, to clean and repaint the bottom due to the marine creatures that like to grow on it and slow you down.

Pete

 

[Seajet]

Mavisto,

welcome to the forums.

Pete is right, you'll need to be much more specific to get an idea of costs, and you can't do that without some experience to judge what sort of sailing and boat will suit you both.

I'd strongly recommend a sailing course, ideally with a school recommended by people here ( the people I would have recommended have stopped now ) - I'd avoid large corporate type outfits and go for somewhere with a more personal approach.

Have Fun !

 

[Stemar]

Hi Mavisto & welcome to the lunatic asylum.

The flip answer to your question is, "if you need to ask, you can't afford it!"

A more sensible rule of thumb that's often quoted is that maintenance will be around 10% of the boat value. That would keep the boat in decent fettle and cover bigger items spread across a few years, though maybe not a new engine. If you're good at DIY, you can save on that, but not as much as you might hope.

You then have to think about mooring costs, which are a movable feast. An expensive marina on the S coast could set you back £5000 or more a year, a DIY club mooring, change from £100 plus £150 or so for maintenance every couple of years, but such cheapies are pretty rare and tend to come with waiting lists that will have you thinking about your likely lifespan. A sensible budget for a deep water swinging mooring would be £800-£1200, depending on area and boat size, expect to pay less, but not necessarily much less for tidal ones.

An expert will be along in a minute to tell you something different, if they haven't already 'cos I got busy with some work before I finished typing!

 

[bromleybysea]

Fixed costs are relatively easy to predict. Where keep the boat determines the cost of mooring, plus insurance. In my case that's about 2.8k for a elderly 32' sailing boat. Running costs I average at about 1.5k including diesel, lift in and out, antifouling, engine consumables etc. Big ticket items such as sails, new rigging, instruments and a new engine on top. About 20k over 25 years of ownership. So say 5k per year. That does not include costs of getting to and from the boat and incidental costs when cruising, and I'm pretty generous when spending on the boat so in reality it's probably more, and I wish I'd never started this bloody reply.....

 

[sailorman]

Hello Everyone.

I need some help and advice from all you Sail Boat owners out there. So I better start at the beginning.

I've had the cars and the motorbikes (still got them infact) but I've never owned a sail boat. I've owned a couple of RIB's when I was younger and used to do a lot of diving but even though I love the ocean and have spent some time beneath it, I've never actually been sailing.

Whilst on holiday in France, my partner and I started looking at the yachts in the harbour and thinking how nice it would be, when we decide to give up work, to be able to sail around the UK or over to France. We therefore started to think about buying one.

This isn't a short term idea, I'm not planning to go and buy a boat next week, but maybe in five years time. Our plan at the moment is to take a bit of time off work and undertake some training. Then perhaps spend a few of our summer's on Flotilla Holidays and then, if the finances allow it (and if we both enjoy it) buying something then. I really like the look of a Dufour 34.

Our idea for a sea going future had also interested some of our friends, particularly another couple who have suggested at the moment that they might consider a boat share.

If this plan is to go ahead, we are thinking of taking some equity out of our house and were thinking of about £20K each to buy the boat. This of course may all change if the cost of running the boat are excessive.

So, how much does it cost to run a boat?

How often do sails have to be replaced and engines serviced? Is it better to keep the boat in the water all year round or take it out during the winter? As you can tell, I really am new to this!!!

I've searched the internet for some ideas, but most replies seem to be from America. I really need to find out some info that applies to the UK and Europe.

I'm sorry if this is in the wrong forum, but as I said above I'm really new to this.

I spend less than many non boaters who have fancy holidays.
i have had 40 yrs of holidays & weekends aboard my boats & still have the value equivalent ( or more ) to 40 family holidays within my present boat.
i did start with a Mirror dinghy that i built my self

 

[Tranona]

£40k will buy you quite a substantial boat, although not a Dufour 34. Few people buy a boat that size to start off with.

As already suggested get some experience first then you will have a clearer idea of what you want and the cost and commitment involved. Common these days to get some experience on flotilla or chartering, although many people follow the "traditional" route of buying a small boat and working up through the sizes.

When you do get to a 30' plus cruiser, once you have bought it in workable condition you can expect to spend between 5 and 10% of its value on regular maintenance and replacements. Insurance around £400 a year, and the biggest variable is mooring that can range from less than £1k a year for a swinging mooring in one of the less popular areas to as much as £8k in some places on the south coast.

As Pete says, you can spend as much as you want, or once you have paid the moorings and insurance as little as you need.

 

[prv]

The flip answer to your question is, "if you need to ask, you can't afford it!"

I don't think that's true. Sadly, a lot of people think that sailing is inherently massively expensive. For some reason the media like to perpetrate this myth, plus the places that people keep cheaper boats tend to be less visible; my own berth is opposite a scrapyard and a wholesaler to Chinese takeaways, while all the posh boats are in Ocean Village where everyone can see them. So people do assume "they can't afford it", when if they were to ask, they might be surprised at what is possible.

a DIY club mooring, change from £100 plus £150 or so for maintenance every couple of years, but such cheapies are pretty rare and tend to come with waiting lists that will have you thinking about your likely lifespan.

I sail past a trot of club moorings all the time; they're currently about half occupied or less. I believe the club charges £300 or £400 for them depending on boat size. If my parents and I hadn't just agreed to renew our boat-sharing arrangement, I'd be joining the club now to get my hands on one

Pete

 

[Oscarpop]

There is little I need to add to this as my emeritus forumites have encapsulated the costs perfectly.

However as I sit here musing over where to go this weekend , it reminds me of a story a friend of mine ( a dentist ) told me about one of his patients bemoaning the cost of a dental extraction. He replied that yes the extraction would cost £50 quid at the time which the patient said was extortionate. My friend remarked to me later that the patient would have paid a huge amount more if he had the patients tooth in his hand and the patient was paying for him to put it back in.

I guess the long winded moral to all this, is that we moan about the cost of sailing.However those of us for which sailing is a way of life, would pay a lot more to get back to sailing if it were taken away from us.

Here endeth the sermon. Back to pulling teeth.

 

[lustyd]

For a boat share make sure you are VERY good friends or complete strangers. Nothing causes arguments quite as well as money, and with a yacht there will be plenty of that being used up.

I had my boat out in the winter when I first bought it. Cleaning, painting, varnishing etc is absolute hell in the winter and let's face it, doesn't take 4-6 months to complete. This year, I took my boat out for the weekend and did the antifouling etc. which was cheaper than being ashore for an extended period (look for lift and hold for the weekend on marina price lists).

For berthing costs, look at some marina websites near you, or harbour sites for a mooring. As has been said, this will be hundreds to many thousands depending on facilities and access from the water. Consider in your choice that moorings are harder to get to and harder to do maintenance on the boat and therefore may mean you use it less depending on your attitude.

For maintenance, look at your car. If you have a shiny new car, serviced annually and have any minor defect fixed immediately then you'll need to budget thousands per year for your boat.
If your car is a bit older, maybe has a dent here or there and you service it yourself, then your budget (money) will be less but your budget (time) will be more. This will be materials only, and maybe the occasional help from professionals.

When sizing the boat, remember that length goes up in a linear fashion but sails, painted area, carpets and varnish all go up by the square of that because it's an area. The budget for these is therefore not linear either!
Things like standing and running rigging (ropes and wires) get both thicker and longer the larger the boat, so the cost of these is pretty well exponential!

Toys such as sat nav (plotter), VHF, radar will depend on attitude. Most will never use them but because they are relatively cheap and have an instant gratification they tend to be replaced once a decade or so if not more often. Many sailors (especially of this forum) won't even have these fitted.
Cheers
Dave

 

[stevebrassett]

To give an example.

I have a 28 year old 23 foot long yacht on the East Coast. She lives on a commercial swinging mooring, which costs me about £1000 per year, including winter storage, but not craning out and in, which is about another £250. I only take her out of the water evey other year. Insurance is about £200. Antifouling is about £100. Sails last about 10 years (although the genoa that came with it did not have a UV strip and lasted about 5 years. Other maintanance costs are around £3-400 a year, excluding major outlays, like a new engine. I do all work myself, including engine servicing (it's an outboard so I can take it home). Overall, excluding costs going to and from the boat, and additional costs of trips, she costs me less than a packet of fags a day, which I think is a bargain. Costs of other boats will vary a lot, but you can start to build up a picture with a few examples.

 

[wotayottie]

over the last 10 years and on that size of boat I have spent £29548. Bit embarrassed about being able to answer the question but there it is.

I do most of my maintenance myself and that has cost £970 pa. I sail the Bristol channel and use a club marina which now costs me £1500 pa. Insurance averages £297 pa . The figures do not include cruising costs ie costs of marinas etc away from base.

 

[pvb]

So, how much does it cost to run a boat?

How often do sails have to be replaced and engines serviced? Is it better to keep the boat in the water all year round or take it out during the winter?

The replies so far have given you an idea of the basic costs. By far the biggest variable is the cost of mooring the boat somewhere.

Sail life depends on quality, as well as how much use they get. You might get 10 years or so out of a reasonable set of sails. Most people would think it sensible to replace the standing rigging every 10 years too.

Engine servicing is an easy DIY job, and doing it helps you understand which bits do what, which can stand you in good stead if something goes wrong when you're away from help. Routine maintenance on a small yacht engine is basically oil and filter changes, so the parts costs involved aren't great.

Many people take their boats out of the water every winter and antifoul them. This isn't necessarily required. If you keep your boat in a reasonably sheltered marina, it can stay in the water all year round without harm. Then you can lift it out in the summer (when liftout costs are about half as much) and antifoul it in nice warm weather. What's more, if you put several good coats of antifoul on, it'll last 2 years, reducing your spend even further.

If you buy a boat, be sure to retain a contingency fund of about 10% of the boat's value. Just one unexpected repair (say an engine problem) can easily cost several thousand pounds.

 

[srm]

For the last 35 years or more I have owned and run boats that at first sight are in excess of my income - part depends where you can keep the boat. For the first 20 years or so I laid and maintained my own mooring (before Crown Estate decide moorings were a nice little earner for them). I was so far away from yacht yards and other specialists that I had to learn to fix, repair and maintain everything, from sail repair to welding . . . . The fishing boat yards were just too busy to be interested in my needs, other than selling galvanised shackles etc.

So, the more you can do yourself, the cheaper it becomes. So much so that I epoxied the hull and replaced all the standing rigging myself when I bought my current boat despite being in a yard in Plymouth - but then their storage fees alone were eye watering. As I said to another owner in that yard when he asked when the riggers were coming to change my rig: "why pay someone to do a job that I can do myself".

 

[V1701]

When you're choosing your boat, make sure all the big ticket items are at least working/serviceable, preferably new or nearly new. This includes sails, engine, upholstery/cushions, standing rigging, electronic instruments, tender/outboard (if required). Factor in the costs of replacing any of these so you don't have any nasty surprises...

 

[johnalison]

One way to keep costs down is to join a sailing club (apologies if I've overlooked this suggestion above). Some clubs have their own moorings/pontoon berths at a reasonable rate but, more importantly, can provide an endless source of advice and support, especially about maintenance and sourcing goods. An average club might cost £80/year, say.

The carrying capacity of a boat is proportional to the cube of its length and in my opinion the same aplies to costs, so the easiest way to keep costs down is to stay small, at least until you have acquired more knowledge.

Depending on where you live, the cost of driving to and fro can mount up too.

 

[Jabamusic]

Some great comments you have already. I know that keeping a 32 footer has been cheaper than smoking fags and a lot more healthy.

Jaba

 

[Searush]

40k is an awful lot of money to put into a dream if it turns into a nightmare.

You will find lots of broken dreams for sale in the Azores, Carribean & Med ports where people have sunk their life's equity into a boat to live the dream & then discovered they hate it & can't recoup the capital. Not saying it will happen to you, but it is a significant risk IF you don't try the lifestyle first. A motorhome could be better for what you want to do.

Get some sailing experience, go crewing, get a cheap dinghy to learn how to sail, do courses for the navigation, safety, etc, read cruising books to gain some understanding of the issues. Then charter in a few different locations.

A few grand spent over a few years in this way will pay back in the choice of boat, cruising plans etc. It may even help you chose your ideal motorhome!

 

[rob2]

I sail past a trot of club moorings all the time; they're currently about half occupied or less. I believe the club charges £300 or £400 for them depending on boat size.

That sounds like you're sailing past SSC. The moorings are mostly half-tide and best suited to bilge keelers, although some of the deeper ones are OK for a fin. They are professionally laid and maintained as they are a little exposed to the fetch across Southampton Water. Access is from the beach alongside the clubhouse, so a dinghy is essential and rough conditions can make it a wet experience (my outboard learnt to swim there). All told they are good moorings but limited to 9m LOA. The club has a yard and tractor and lifter for winter storeage.

Details here: http://www.southamptonsailingclub.com/

In reality there are high maintenance costs every ten years or so, sails, standing rigging, engine rebuild(?), but costs escalate whenever you're away from your home mooring. Staying in marinas is pricey and best if you can split it between the crew.

Rob.

 

[Robert Wilson]

Hi Mavisto & welcome to the lunatic asylum.

The flip answer to your question is, "if you need to ask, you can't afford it!"

Another "flip answer", but sadly true is :-
ALWAYS more than you budget.
In reality, boats have a great many things that need replacing, servicing, can-go-wrong-, get lost etc etc. BUT, if you're as lucky as I was/am to get a boat for £8k (Javlin30) and get as much fun out of as I do then sometimes one has to accept the knocks 'n' shocks.
Go for it, but keep your eyes open and leave the credi card at home.

Good luck