Help Free communication ?????

[Boatman]

Advice needed………

All the weather, emails and the chat……….. etc for FREE

I use my comms for general listening to stations I can’t get on other bands (ie not HF) want to get weather (Grb files) downloaded as well as emails, plus a bit of chat (want to expand this area) and don’t want to invest 2 or more times. I know the antenna and ATU are critical but will work with those over time.

Am looking at 4 (5) very different rigs for base station use on a boat and or land (maybe both), am considering Yaesu ft450, ft950, ft2000 or Electra k3 (don’t generally like Icom kit except the 756pro ) already have a IC Marine 702x (I think) and a Yaesu FT100 (opened to cover marine bands) the FT is much better for a lot less (I know the specs are not the same but the end result of the FT is) I (think I) want to include a new Pactor modem in the new setup (maybe see below) Cost of a modem seems very high.

Currently running on an insulated backstay and an IC ATU (can’t remember model as not on boat at the moment) in conjunction with a MJF antenna/ground matcher (don’t ask but it works) but want a bit more, so am looking at different ground plane issues etc.

Am setting up a temp local on land and will be back on the boat within the year or so, but want something good to last a few years that can be used in both situations.

Budget is limited but movable within a small range (I do understand that you pay for what you get unless you get very lucky) unless I work harder (but I want to be sailing)

So the Ni..er in the woodpile is what about this?

Number 5 in the list Kenwood TS 2000x seems to put the cat amongst the pigeons as it appears to have basic packet capability ????? will this work with a marine ISPS for email and Grb (weather) files ? So do I need the Pactor?

Any comments about CAT progs to interface with any of the above would also be greatly appreciated

All comments welcomed and any questions about what works and doesn’t

Peter

PS Haven’t used my Ham licence much in many years but not hopefully completely stupid either

 

[jeremyshaw]

Can't help you on the radios, but I can say the Pactor is a very reliable bit of kit. My IIe (firmware upgraded to III) has been rock solid the last 7 years.

AFAIK you have three choices with shortwave radio: Kiel, Sailmail and Winlink. I started with Kiel but found it useless in the Caribbean so switched to Sailmail which is great and has excellent support. But you do have to pay USD250pa, no attachments and limited to 75 minutes use.

Winlink is only available to hams, so that's a possibility for you, and I think has attachment capability - though other Winlink users will be able to advise more.

You'll also want to look at the station locations and see if they give you the coverage you want for your intended cruising areas.

The saildocs server is a great source of free weather (inc. grbs) and available to all, not just sailmail users. Airmail, the software used by Sailmail, is free.

Bear in mind that most stations only have one channel (some have a few) that can be in use at any one time - so you have to wait for a clear channel. Combined with having to wait for the right time of day this can be frustrating unless you are a patient type.

Below is an extract from my Sailmail log which gives you an idea of the throughput I have been able to achieve. A smarter operator would do better (and a dumber on worse!).

Sessions 573
Failed Attempts 1092
Avg Failed Attempts per session 2.184
Abortive sessions 168 (i.e. connected but useless)
Sent Emails No 696
Sent Bytes Vol 1223416
Received Emails No 1273
Received Bytes Vol 2924827
Total Emails No 1969
Total Bytes Vol 4148243
Total Minutes 1878.1
Avg bytes per minute 2208
Avg emails per minute 1.05

Failed Connection Attempts Analysis
Attempts Occasions % Occasions
First try 226 35
1 failure 127 19
2 100 15
3 68 10
4 33 5
5 30 5
>5 69 11
653 100

Avg Session Time: 3 minutes
Max session time 19 minutes

I am a big fan of SSB email for offshore use. But if you only intend to use your radio for this kind of work then Iridium or Globalstar are of course other options. Personally, though in practice I use my SSB almost exclusively for email and weatherfax, I would still go this route because of the value of SSB in emergency situations.

 

[davidbains]

This a highly technical radio question for liveaboard.
Personally I would KISS. Many skippers including me use an Icom 706. Available secondhand
although I think they're a bit power hungry on receive. In theory any mobile HF set will do, no point in having the higher frequencies. If you had room a larger set like a secondhand Kenwood TS570 would do well. Ask captainslarty.

 

[Boatman]

Thanks for the stats very in teresting.

Have an Iridium and it works really well at a cost, but there you go.

I have only heard good things about the pactor. I just have to save the pennies.

 

[Boatman]

I was hoping that Joe (captainslarty) would reply, but he seems to have gone a bit quite after he got battered over certain issues elsewhere.

I do hope he isn't put off his input should always be valued and is often straight on the nail

 

[BrendanS]

He was banned for a week.

 

[whipper_snapper]

[ QUOTE ]
Number 5 in the list Kenwood TS 2000x seems to put the cat amongst the pigeons as it appears to have basic packet capability ????? will this work with a marine ISPS for email and Grb (weather) files ? So do I need the Pactor?

[/ QUOTE ]

No. As far as I know, for Pactor 2 and 3 there is no substitute for the expensive pactor modems. And you need 2 or 3 for for file downloads. For the much slower pactor 1 you can use a number of different TNCs which you can pick up from ebay for <$100. I don't know if the Kenwood TS 2000x can do pactor 1 withut a TNC - I would doubt it.

The new Icom marine SSB (M802) claims to be the 1st with 'one-touch e-mail access', but that is a meaningess sales gimmick as far as I can see.

(caveat. Trouville will be along in a minute to say that he has a high speed modem-less datalink. But it may or may not be legal and the details are top secret! )


[ QUOTE ]
Any comments about CAT progs to interface with any of the above would also be greatly appreciated

[/ QUOTE ]

I use Ham Radio Deluxe for CAT with my FT897 (home) and FT857 (/mm). For email, gribs etc, Airmail is your only option, it is used for either Winlink or Sailmail. Both allow attachments if the protocol is Pactor 2 or 3.

 

[mdrifter]

I think Pactor 1 is becoming moribund and less available through wl2k and SailMail pmbo(s). As mentioned alswhere AirMail is really the only software to use for ssb email & wx; with its GetFax/ViewFax modules it covers just about all that is required. There was some talk of "SCAMP" being developed using only pc soundcard but although some tests have been done I haven't seen anything recently, so SCS modems are still the best despite their cost for ssb work. Another useful bit of software for datamodes is MixW2 - relatively inexpensive to register. As for choice of rig - Icoms can run at 100% duty cycle which could rapidly drain your batteries - 20/30 watts should be effective most of the time for P2/3 use - and allows for wider range of rigs...best effective ground needs a bit of work - tie in all below deck metal tanks, engine, etc with copper tape and tie to keel bolt otherwise ground plates unless you can increase area of copper lining the hull...imho SGC make the best ATUs.
The FT100 is a superb piece of kit but ageing eyeballs prefer larger displays.

 

[trouville]

Just a couple of points.
There are groups that provide pactor internet.Even set ups with now, 4 706s pactor & 4 internet connections running automaticaly in a remote hut with good take off for the anntenas, limit the time allowed.

Ive been banned from one site for too often going over my 15 minuets maximum connection time,though i got a note to say i can apply again since the maximum times been increased to half an hour!

Another site also has time recomendations but so far hasent said anything when ive gone over my limit.

Ask hams in whatever contry you are for pactor stations,i had to write asking permision giveing the reason why i wanted to join in the "experimental" station giveing my call

Pactor is slow but when your aboard its great to have internet!You soon get used to the speed.

Power can be a problem?Though i havent had a problem so far.

Haveing read through the posts above and been reminded we are part of an "experiment" ill agree that the pactor 3 modum is still quite expensive,ive been told the company has patented pactor??Their modums do a very good job even with very weak signals

There are other ADSL speed systems being tried on the UHF bands for now.As soon as ive finnished this "job" i have for another week, im going along to see if theres anyway to use it on the HF bands (if its permited)

Im really suffering.Im forced to eat, drinking only water!And haveing tea for breakfast!!!Goes with the job,but im doing my best to educate my friend to drink wine!!So far he wont beleive that drinking red wine is very good for the system.

If you can use a base rig aboard im told the Yaesu 990 is very very good!And being an old model is not "so expensive" Ten tec are also said to be very good??

Im only repeating what ive heard said.

Im going to drink a glass of water then sleep!I just hope i can get my freind off the daft idea that being a tea totalers good for him!

As soon as i find out more about the very fast data system ill post,it is illegal on HF just now but that might have changed??Ima bit out of touch.With tea or water only i feel dreadful

 

[captainslarty]

Hi Boatman Sir.
Nice choice of radios.. as you can tellby my sig, I DO like the Kensoowd ts50.. lovely set. the pactor modems offer a 'tuning' facility to certain cat enabled rigs, but is is not needed really.. so your choice is open. most hf sets are very similar in performance terms. Size is an important factor (for me and many others) so a small rig is usually better. If you can, my advice would be to go for a dedicated HF set, not a jack of all traded rig with 2 mtrs, 70 cms etc built in.

Back stay antennas are ok, personally again, I prefer a 23 foot whip, but you obviosly need room to fit it.. as for an atu, go for an SGC, sg230.. bullet proof, works with anything.

Grounding is always a bone of contention. I use a single isolated bronze through hull with no worries. You can also, if you wish, bond heavy metal items ion the boat together for an RF ground. this can help. use .1 microfarad disc ceramic 1000v caps to link the items to exclude a dc path and electrolysis issues.

If you can get hold of an old rdf set, grab it lol.. makes a superb rf interference detector !!!.

Hope that helps, any specific questions just ask or pm.. I wish you success.

Joe

 

[Boatman]

Joe

Thanks for the comments I will need to do some more investigation.

Nice to see you back. I have enjoyed reading and learning from your many and other posts. Hope La caruna is still ok have spent may a day/week there.

Will PM you anyway

Peter

 

[rogerdog]

One point I would like to add that has only been touched on is that the antenna / RF earthing(not same as DC) is by far the most critical factor for performance with HF.

Is it for use when moored up or in transit ?

If I can help please pm me (I'm a assessor for ham licensing at all levels)