HALLBERG RASSY - why good?

[Tim Good]

As the OP my interests are actually high latitudes amongst general global cruising also. I know some have said steel or alimiunum is a must for Greenland and then others have said good GRP is perfectly adequate. Does anyone know anyone that has take a HR ooop north? By the looks of this google image they clearly have but just curious on feedback?

 

[Twister_Ken]

It appears that this has turned into a HR versus Jeanneau. Fine by me. I don't have either, but I am soon to be in the market.

I would love a spacious 44-46 footer to potter around our shores then probably the Med for a hand full of years.
Two up with the good lady who is, of course, a fair weather sailor.
For my budget of circa 150k I could either opt for an early 1990's HR ( if I'm lucky ) or a mid 2000 Jeanneau.

Can you see my dilemma ?

If you want to go the HR route, check whether your choice has adequate ventilation for the Med. HR is very aware of this now, but some of the earlier models get sweaty when there's a bit of centigrade about.

 

[Bosun Higgs]

My point is back in the 80's /90's when I supplied Westerly, going on board boats in build, the big Westerly finish and material were about the same as the HR , when looked over at the boat show. Yet we always grouped Westerly with the Jan/Bav/Ben range, not the HR build standard, the result was Westerly failed to sell against one group as to dear, the other as they were the wrong product group. We have this thing as a Nation of build status, like German cars we will pay 50% for a car because of the image, not that it's 50% better than a British built one, which we no longer have.

In this thread it's HR, Bav, Jan, Ben, no British boats.

Brian

you are absolutely right there. we talk of ''german engineering''. it's used asan advertising slogan. and it works because we believe in national stereotypes. german engineering, french food, italian style etc. and our image of british products is bad as you will frequently see on the forum. brits knock british goods.

had a pal who rana car respray business. he doubled his business overnight by advertising a new germanpaint spray system. in fact the only new thing was a german air compressor but joe public saw the magic word.

out of interest,whatdo you think we have a good reputation for? anything?

 

[Sailfree]

out of interest,whatdo you think we have a good reputation for? anything?

Fighting Wars

 

[BrianH]

If you want to go the HR route, check whether your choice has adequate ventilation for the Med. HR is very aware of this now, but some of the earlier models get sweaty when there's a bit of centigrade about.

+1. Re. "earlier models", mine's 1981.

Just this moment moored up after a bit of a sailabout in the northern Adriatic; put a tie round the furled genoa then the boom cover on (some serious storm clouds building up over the mountains); connected up the leccy and went below. Whew, what a sauna ... out with the fan and off to the pool to cool down while hoping that the cabin will also.

I put it down to that cursed teak deck, makes the lockers under the side-decks into pizza ovens.

 

[Bosun Higgs]

as for hr i looked at them carefully when i was last in the boat market. i'm lucky - i can afford one no problem. i also looked at malo and ovni and souherly and benny and bav. but bought none of them and instead went for a second hand starlight. i could not persuade myself that the swedes and southerly were worth the money and I didnt like the more basic interior of the bennies and bavs.

as for qualityi have no doubt that southerly are /were a match for the swedes with maybe better woodwork. the ovni was greatand clearly built by someone who sails. every halyard and sheet lead was perfect but paint on aluminium? no thanks. For sheer value there was no arguing with new bennies or bavs but neither were built with the more trad hull shape and keel that i wanted. hence my choice of a boat that i regard as a more modern contessa - more limited accommodation than a benny and less classy woodwork than the swedes or southerly.


so are hr good? of course the are. but every model of boat has its plusses and minusses including hr. in the end you pay your money and make your choice.

maybe next time the ovni? a sort of floating citroen ds - french quirky.

ps - the starlight is one h*ll of a sailing boat with serious long distance capability.

 

[Tranona]

As the OP my interests are actually high latitudes amongst general global cruising also. I know some have said steel or alimiunum is a must for Greenland and then others have said good GRP is perfectly adequate. Does anyone know anyone that has take a HR ooop north? By the looks of this google image they clearly have but just curious on feedback?

Steel or aluminium are common choices for purpose built expedition boats. However, very few people can afford to build new, so the choice is limited by what is available on the secondhand market. Your choice is very limited if you insist on either of those materials - and well used or poorly maintained examples can be a nightmare.

So you need to look for production type boats that meet your performance criteria in space, seaworthiness, carrying capacity and equipment. Many of the larger HR type boats would provide the basis for what you want, as would many others. There is plenty written in mags, books, blogs etc on what you plan to do, so you can pick up hints from there. However, you will discover that people use all kinds of boats, from home built steel boats, to old wood working boats, to standard everyday production yachts, to purpose built expedition boats - and even recently a Dragonfly trimaran! Few builders make boats specifically for what you want to do - the market is small, but it is clear that some types are more easily adapted to your particular needs.

If you don't have direct experience yourself, maybe its a good idea to try and get some crewing on the sort of boats you think you might like. At the end of the day only you can make the choice by looking at your budget, drawing up your list of decision criteria and testing what you see against those.

 

[Elessar]

Well put

They are a high quality product and those that can afford them appreciate the refinement

they have high quality bits for sure. Bavarias have better gelcoat.

I'd still love to own one though.

 

[kyleview]

Try a Malo - even better than the HR!!

HR along with Najad (now gone) have tried to match the French / Germans and have ended up with pretty modern and very high freeboard yachts. The Malo has all that HR has below, and more in my view, but also a very seaworthy and low freeboard yacht which looks nice and sails well.

 

[laika]

Next boat show you're at, compare the plumbing on manual toilets in a Rassy with that in a Bavaria/Jeanneau/Beneteau. The cheaper boats won't have a vented loop between the pump and the flush. A swedish boat (incl. Nauticat and (formerly) Najad) will have it done "properly". Not that I'm saying that's worth the price difference: You could buy a fair few vented loops and bits of hose for that money...

And to return to a couple of earlier points, you actually get far superior cocktails on a big early 90s westerly than any Rassy. Obviously though that's rather dependant on the particular westerly....

 

[Daydream believer]

It's a big heavy beast that will sit comfortably in the trades.

I spoke to an HR owner who said that the later ones are being built with a much lighter design so as to compete with other cheaper designs. I do admit i have not looked at specs though
What i do know is that my Hanse 31 can see an HR35 off with ease in conditions up to 25 knts
However, i was running down wind with full main up & blasting past a 35. A sudden gust well over 35 kts hit us both & my bow started to nose dive. Worried about an accidental chinese gybe i deliberately rounded up hard to windward & head to wind . I looked at the HR & i don't think he even noticed the gust.

I have an experienced sailing friend who was crewing an HR 38 hove too in a force 12 for a couple of days travelling north from St Lucia somewhere. Of four other nearby yachts 2 disappeared without trace & loss of all crew. He felt relatively safe in the Halberg. Just luck or something to do with the boat.

 

[macd]

to address Vyv's point, I'm sure if you asked HR to fit DZR for you, they would.

Had a Rassy owner on board for a couple of weeks recently, a man very knowledgeable about the boat industry. I forget his exact words but he described the sainted Magnus as the very opposite of flexible in such matters. And even if he fell over himself to accommodate customers, what you wrote does not "address Vyv's point", which is that leaded brass has no place in skin fittings in salt water craft. Ask the MAIB.

 

[macd]

Plastic is available but I wonder if it will become still and brittle, I hope that plastic will actually be the best option, but I am waiting to hear the results of longer term use. I plan to replace my DZR with bronze but I would like to use plastic...

"Plastic" is about as meaningful as "metal". I wouldn't hesitate to use Marelon although, as Salty John notes, it's bulkier than an equivalent metallic fitting of whatever composition.
Nothing wrong with DZR: Blakes has used it for years.

 

[macd]

DZR is the most commonly used material in UK and is freely available. Unfortunately it looks like brass .

There is one very obvious clue. Vyv' tells us on his web site that he has never encountered a plated DZR valve, whereas plating is commonplace on brass valves. This certainly tallies with my far less extensive experience. DZR, as you no doubt know, should be marked "CR" for corrosion resistant.

 

[EuanMcKenzie]

I own and old HR Rasmus 35 from 1972.

Definately not part of the HR old boys club at my level of the market but what really impresses me is how well it is built and how well it has lasted. It is almost as old as I am but still has original gel coat and the mahogany and teak still impresses.

It isn't that fast but it is reassuring in heavier stuff. I guess that's why its such a popular liveaboard even now

 

[Ludd]

I own and old HR Rasmus 35 from 1972.

Definately not part of the HR old boys club at my level of the market but what really impresses me is how well it is built and how well it has lasted. It is almost as old as I am but still has original gel coat and the mahogany and teak still impresses.

It isn't that fast but it is reassuring in heavier stuff. I guess that's why its such a popular liveaboard even now

Surprisingly,a lot of owners of modern HRs wax lyrical about the Rasmus/NAB ,and the ventilation problem can be solved with wind scoops. The fact that I don't have a teak deck is a source of relief to me.
Heavier weather is taken in her stride with no slamming,and lying hove -to in Biscay in a F9,forereaching at about 1/2 to 1 knot,triple reefed main and storm staysail was a revelation! My previous crossing in a Bene 40 CC was distictly different,even though the weather was benign.

 

[Twister_Ken]

Try a Malo - even better than the HR!!

HR along with Najad (now gone) have tried to match the French / Germans and have ended up with pretty modern and very high freeboard yachts. The Malo has all that HR has below, and more in my view, but also a very seaworthy and low freeboard yacht which looks nice and sails well.

Only Malo I ever sailed went to windward like a dumper truck. Beautiful, but it wouldn't get you there in a hurry.

 

[snooks]

Had a Rassy owner on board for a couple of weeks recently, a man very knowledgeable about the boat industry. I forget his exact words but he described the sainted Magnus as the very opposite of flexible in such matters. And even if he fell over himself to accommodate customers, what you wrote does not "address Vyv's point", which is that leaded brass has no place in skin fittings in salt water craft. Ask the MAIB.

Vyv's remark was that they were fitted from new with brass. The times I've sailed with Magnus I've always found him accommodating, and I have no reason to believe he would not accommodate a potential owners request, or loose a sale over a few DZR skin fittings.

I might be wholly wrong of course.

 

[jonic]

It's all about quality. Not only the build quality but in the quality of materials used, and to address Vyv's point, I'm sure if you asked HR to fit DZR for you, they would.

Where on some boats you'll find a laminate wood finish, on an HR you'll find teak faced ply, on another boat where you might find teak faced ply, on an HR the teak bit will usually be thicker with a tighter grain and consistent colour.

The hulls are designed to be comfortable at sea with rounded forward sections, designed for sea keeping rather than accommodation. Impeccable handling. Only spun out on one once when we were hit by 40+ knots, with too much sail up.

The deck is insulated, so condensation doesn't form inside deck fittings are top quality.

They are solid, few if any creeks or groans from the boat as she sails

Years of experience goes into designing and building them.

The company is owned by a yachtsman, who sails, and he usually takes his family off on a long cruise in every new model. Any problems he finds are addressed. Magnus Rassy is a tall man, so they don't lack headroom. He's been sailing for years and will generally only fit the stuff to them from manufacturers he knows will support his owners.

One of the few brands that I could see us selling our boat to buy....after a lottery win

Agree entirely.

And they are no slouch either - scroll to about 1 minute in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=C1QyHP1L2v8#at=63

 

[Lucky Duck]

Vyv's remark was that they were fitted from new with brass. The times I've sailed with Magnus I've always found him accommodating, and I have no reason to believe he would not accommodate a potential owners request, or loose a sale over a few DZR skin fittings.

I might be wholly wrong of course.

It doesn't solve the issue that brass fitting should have never been specified in the first place.