Genoa position

I had an Europa for a few years which I sailed on Loch Ness, it was great fun and a boat I really enjoyed, it was the triple keel version.
A previous owner added a short strop, perhaps about a foot long, at the bottom of the genoa which helped when tacking. I was happy to continue with this arrangement, but then I didn't race.
You could easily make up a short strop and experiment and then decide what suits you best. I won't be for moving the pulpit, seems a bit OTT.
 
That 12 degree heel sounds about right from experience.

You could fit a Plastimo Contest porthole bubble type compass, they have a clinometer scale on the bottom and the compass is always a good thing to have even on a lake, course to next mark ( especially as you won't be able to see where you're going with the hot shot deck level jib :) ) and it can always get foggy, heavy rain or dark...

Bainbridge marine are selling Plastimo stuff now, I don't know their product range but if they've got any brains it will include the Contest, I'd guess their biggest selling item.
 
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Alan_B said:
I can use a snap shackle to attach the foot straight to the eye on the deck which looks better, but then will foul the bow rail when tacking, and means going forward each time to skirt it. There are no guard lines fitted at present.
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I think the tacking skirt problem will go away if you fit guard wires (use Dyneema rather than wire).
 
I tend to concur with others that the bow rail should be moved forward. This may not be as big a job as you might imagine. The bend in the rail at the front will need to be tightened up. In the meantime raise the jib ona strop.
Regarding no winches. I think once you get used to the boat you will find the need for jib sheet winches. Windward sailing can be enhanced by a really tight jib sheet. Single speed winches are not necessarily expensive. A small winch here in Oz can be about 50 squid each. If you find it is too small then get a bigger oen and use the small winch for halyards.
good luck olewill
 
Olewill,

I normally agree with you 100% but I'm afraid not this time.

The Europa is a very successful design, and the designer one of the true greats; the pulpit is there for a reason, also moving it would reduce the boats' appeal and value if Alan ever decided to sell her.

My 22' boat is a very similar shape by the same designer ( Oliver Lee ) although 7/8ths rig.

Even with the considerably larger headsails I hardly ever use my sheet winches, I go for whole seasons without touching them; I have turning cheek blocks on the coamings leading to large dinghy style cam cleats, this is all I need even with the 135 sq ft genoa; though I find a 100 sq ft blade jib much more efficient giving a very good slot.
 
Seajet said:
Olewill,

I normally agree with you 100% but I'm afraid not this time.

The Europa is a very successful design, and the designer one of the true greats; the pulpit is there for a reason, also moving it would reduce the boats' appeal and value if Alan ever decided to sell her.

My 22' boat is a very similar shape by the same designer ( Oliver Lee ) although 7/8ths rig.

Even with the considerably larger headsails I hardly ever use my sheet winches, I go for whole seasons without touching them; I have turning cheek blocks on the coamings leading to large dinghy style cam cleats, this is all I need even with the 135 sq ft genoa; though I find a 100 sq ft blade jib much more efficient giving a very good slot.
Click to expand...

I always keen to learn something new. Do you know the reason the pulpit is so far back? I can't thinkl of a single reason except perhaps that it is protected from collision damage.
Or are you just believing that the original designer was a clever fellow and had his reasons. Unlike say a car design I reckonm original designs of boats can always be improved on. regards olewill
 
Olewill,

well I certainly do believe Oliver Lee was a clever fellow !

The makers, Hunters ( UK no relation to the American things ) were a go-ahead performance oriented outfit and very successful at it in those days.

I am only guessing, but I think the pulpit is set aft so as to sheet the headsail close outside it and keep the sail clear when off the wind - the tack is forward of the rail - and it also keeps crew weight aft which is probably important when running in this fine lined 19' boat.
 
Hi Alan,

I haven't posted here much lately but Seajet sent me along in this direction.
I'm a Europa owner and although I don't race maybe I can help.


Firstly, the genoa on mine is set on a 6" wire strop at the foot. I'm sure you could set it without but this suits my sheet lead track best. When fully sheeted the clew comes right to the sheet fairlead. You do need to watch for chafe on the spreaders - I have a sacrificial patch on the sail plus I've taped up and sharp edges on the mast. With the sail full it's no problem but might chafe if heaving to or in a badly timed tack.

Here are a couple of images:
View attachment 35407
View attachment 35408


Secondly, please don't even consider moving the pulpit! The original H19s had a conventional pulpit outside of everything (including Willing Griffin) but the inside pulpit was a later development and improvement! It's also on the late 490's. It is a bit unusual but it creates a very secure foredeck for such a small boat - kneeling down between the 'zimmer frame' :cool: feels very safe and you can easily reach the headsail tack and anchor warp etc. I have no compunction going forward to change headsails in rough weather and singlehanded especially as I can reach the mast from the pulpit and vice versa. You can also step aboard forward very easily.

The pulpit does not in any way foul the headsail and is no issue at all when tacking. If you're going to get hang ups it will be the clew on either the babystay (I don't use mine) or the shrouds. But keeping the lazy sheet free of friction, sheeting in the new sheet a little late and good timing enables me to tack and sheet in hard with no winches with the full genny up to F4-5. Even though the genoa is sheeted outside the guard rail the boat is skinny enough for a decent angle.


You've got yourself a great little sailer - they're quick! Last weekend I was hitting 8 knots downwind/down swells :) (Get a big spinnaker ;))


I would keep the weight out of the stern though - they're narrow sterned and fuller in the bow - hence the beautiful balance.

The current link for the Yahoo group is
http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/Hunter19/info
but you'll need to join to access it (and create a Yahoo account maybe?)


Any questions feel free to PM me,

Jon
 
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I just looked up on Abe Books ( no connection except happy , they give very good value ) and copies of ' Very Willing Griffin ' by David Blagden are going for around £25.00 which is a quarter of the last prices I heard.

There is the Book Forum on here - just keep going left on the forums list headings here - and this book gets mentioned quite a lot.

There's also the hotel / restaurant forum which is highly informative and entertaining !

Both these forums are great resources, sadly under-used.
 
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Seajet said:
I just looked up on Abe Books ( no connection except happy , they give very good value ) and copies of ' Very Willing Griffin ' by David Blagden are going for around £25.00 which is a quarter of the last prices I heard.

There is the Book Forum on here - just keep going left on the forums list headings here - and this book gets mentioned quite a lot.

There's also the hotel / restaurant forum which is highly informative and entertaining !

Both these forums are great resources, sadly under-used.
Click to expand...

I'll be ordering my copy today!! Been out a few times now and very happy so far. Next up is a spinnaker. I've been off work for a week so have a lot of catching up to do lol, only place I get time to log on is in work!
 
mrming said:
Have you raced yet? Let us know how it goes!
Click to expand...

Second race today, came 5th out of 8 in our white sail class. Today was abit of a different race in that it was up and round an island (quite far away) rather than round our usual race marks. Some nice long beam reaches etc. Very pleased with our result as we know we have a few things to adjust and I'd say in no time at all we should be making a few people nervous. Even a minute quicker today and we would have been a few places up. I think total race time today was 3.25hrs. The sun was out, radio on and we just relaxed :)

Wind picked up a bit on the way back in, in fact one gust put us on our ear about 500m from the marina breakwater. Good to know that she can take it lol.
 
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