Frozen canal, what do you do?

[symondo]

Went to check out a location on the Caledonian canal today which was a potential option to apply for.

It was frozen over, not just a little bit of Ice I poked it with a stick and was fairly solid across the whole canal.

How does this affect a hull? There was a few hire boats in and also a sailing boat on its own with no shore power. I'm curious as to the ramifications of leaving a boat in icy frozen water through the winter months

 

[symondo]

Upon reading that back... I'd like to point out I've not walked across ice, I stood on a pontoon, I'd assume the ice was thinner further out

 

[NormanS]

The main danger from ice in the canal, is if other boats are underway in the ice. They then break the ice, and moving slabs can be damaging. However, having wintered in the canal for twenty years, with a wooden boat, I suffered absolutely no damage. Some parts are more susceptible than others. In practice, most winters, the canal is closed to through traffic, so there is less risk.

 

[Momac]

A few winters ago my last boat, a GRP sports cruiser, was suck in 4 inches of ice together with about 300 others in the marina . Not one was damaged.
Trying to move the boat or as said the action of passing boats pushing sheets of ice, is the main risk of damage.

Steel narrowboats are much more resistant to ice and their skippers may well decide to move with no consideration for GRP boats.

 

[agurney]

In my youth, for a couple of winters in the Crinan canaI I hung lengths of rubber conveyer belt over the side .. I wasn't aware of any traffic while it was frozen over but I slept better. I haven't bothered since.

 

[alant]

Went to check out a location on the Caledonian canal today which was a potential option to apply for.

It was frozen over, not just a little bit of Ice I poked it with a stick and was fairly solid across the whole canal.

How does this affect a hull? There was a few hire boats in and also a sailing boat on its own with no shore power. I'm curious as to the ramifications of leaving a boat in icy frozen water through the winter months

On the US East Coast, they have some sort of circulating pump, for boats in marina's, agitating the water to stop ice starting to form.

 

[Alpha22]

Iv'e been iced in a few times.... doesn't seem to affect the hull at all.

 

[Halo]

Look at your hull profile. If the ice squeezes it will only serve to push her upwards a little. I over wintered on ice no probs. If the ice flows or your move through it then it is abrasive. Doubt you will have a problem in the Cally

 

[sarabande]

the pumping referred to in #6 is usually in the form of air pumps, which bring up the wamer water from the bottom of the canal.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55_szQZ1AxM

 

[symondo]

I don't know why I'm surprised by this. I just had it in my head you would want your pride and joy out of the water in the hard with some form of heating. But I follow the logic in not moving anything to avoid big ice sheet movement

 

[NormanS]

I don't know why I'm surprised by this. I just had it in my head you would want your pride and joy out of the water in the hard with some form of heating. But I follow the logic in not moving anything to avoid big ice sheet movement

Where about in the canal, were you thinking of? There are hot springs at Gairlochy, and it never freezes there.

 

[[70521]]

The ice won't be very thick and won't be there very long.

 

[symondo]

Where about in the canal, were you thinking of? There are hot springs at Gairlochy, and it never freezes there.

I'd love to get into gairlochy - im down there regular with the kids/dog, but been told the waiting list is quite a slow turnover - and 5 minutes from home with parking and facilities it'd be ideal.

It was suggested to get up by laggan avenue - so took a bike ride over the weekend to check it out. no shore power there but the dimensions of boat im looking at should fit under the bridge without is swinging so i could at least go play in Loch oich opposed to the lochy.

Norman - if you are in the large boat in Gairlochy - i have spoken to you in passing at some point

 

[sarabande]

NormanS - that's geologically intriguing about the hot springs. Unless it's a local secret you want, understandably, to keep, can you provide a few details please ?

 

[NormanS]

To both sarabande and symondo. No, I used to have a large converted fishing boat, which I wintered on the Transit jetty at Gairlochy. I sold her 10 years ago, and have downsized to a much more sensible GRP sailing ketch, which winters ashore.
In all the 20 winters that we spent at Gairlochy, there was ice only once, and even that was very thin. The reach down to Banavie was often frozen, with really thick ice down at Banavie (6"?), but strangely, the ice never extended East of Moy Bridge. That's why I've always said that there are hot springs at Gairlochy. There may not be, but something stops the water there from freezing.

I'm amazed to hear that there's a waiting list for berths at Gairlochy. Some winters, we were the only boat, but that was before the pontoons, electricity, etc. We had our own private electric supply, which we inherited from the big steam yacht which used to lie there. Happy days.

 

[symondo]

To both sarabande and symondo. No, I used to have a large converted fishing boat, which I wintered on the Transit jetty at Gairlochy. I sold her 10 years ago, and have downsized to a much more sensible GRP sailing ketch, which winters ashore.
In all the 20 winters that we spent at Gairlochy, there was ice only once, and even that was very thin. The reach down to Banavie was often frozen, with really thick ice down at Banavie (6"?), but strangely, the ice never extended East of Moy Bridge. That's why I've always said that there are hot springs at Gairlochy. There may not be, but something stops the water there from freezing.

I'm amazed to hear that there's a waiting list for berths at Gairlochy. Some winters, we were the only boat, but that was before the pontoons, electricity, etc. We had our own private electric supply, which we inherited from the big steam yacht which used to lie there. Happy days.

I must admit everytime i take a wonder down there it looks like theres space, maybe it'd depend upon the draught and size of craft awaiting to get in.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

I don't know why I'm surprised by this. I just had it in my head you would want your pride and joy out of the water in the hard with some form of heating. But I follow the logic in not moving anything to avoid big ice sheet movement

No. You'll be warmer with the boat in the water, despite the ice! The reason is straightforward - the water under the ice cannot be colder than 0 degrees C. The air temperature can, of course, be much lower, but a boat in the water will generally not get much colder than freezing point. A boat on the hard can easily get much colder.

InverKip marina, where I was berthed for several years, often freezes over in the winter - no-one takes any particular precautions, and I've never heard of a boat being damaged. I spent several periods aboard frozen in - no problem staying warm, with the Eberspacher!

 

[NormanS]

No. You'll be warmer with the boat in the water, despite the ice! The reason is straightforward - the water under the ice cannot be colder than 0 degrees C. The air temperature can, of course, be much lower, but a boat in the water will generally not get much colder than freezing point. A boat on the hard can easily get much colder.

InverKip marina, where I was berthed for several years, often freezes over in the winter - no-one takes any particular precautions, and I've never heard of a boat being damaged. I spent several periods aboard frozen in - no problem staying warm, with the Eberspacher!

It's several years ago now, but one hard winter, at least two boats at Banavie in the Caley Canal, were sunk because of ice. Not the ice on the surface of the canal, but internal pipework, which froze and burst, and on thawing, sank the boats. IIRC two actually sank, and one was caught just in time.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

It's several years ago now, but one hard winter, at least two boats at Banavie in the Caley Canal, were sunk because of ice. Not the ice on the surface of the canal, but internal pipework, which froze and burst, and on thawing, sank the boats. IIRC two actually sank, and one was caught just in time.

Of course, it is a wise precaution to drain fresh water systems if frost is expected while the boat is unused. But a boat left in the water actually stands a better chance of avoiding such problems than one out of the water - if the pipes froze when the boat was afloat, they would certainly have frozen if the boat was ashore.

 

[NormanS]

Of course, it is a wise precaution to drain fresh water systems if frost is expected while the boat is unused. But a boat left in the water actually stands a better chance of avoiding such problems than one out of the water - if the pipes froze when the boat was afloat, they would certainly have frozen if the boat was ashore.

I imagine that the offending pipework was the seawater cooling inlets, which of course in the canal, would have fresh water in them. Fresh water system pipes wouldn't sink the boats. When I wintered afloat, I always shut the seacocks, but also disconnected the pipes. Somehow it didn't feel right doing so, because closed seacocks + pipework feels like belt and braces. Presumably the boats that sank hadn't even shut their seacocks.
IIRC with the boat that was caught just in time, the problem wasn't pipework, but a grease point on the sterntube, was forced out of tube by ice forming inside the tube. Sounds unlikely, but I'm pretty sure that was the story.