kashurst
Well-Known Member
Most of my flares have expired over the last month and I will be buying some fresh ones soon, however would it be worth investing in one of the new laser style devices as well or instead of?
Flares or lasers ?
- Thread starter kashurst
- Start date
Searush
Well-Known Member
Hundreds of threads on this already, they have very different characteristics. So Lasers may possibly supplement flares, but not really replace them. The key problem seems to be whether any bystander you are relying on to raise the alarm for you will know that they are declaring an emergency.
Most people will have a VHF (if only a handheld in the liferaft) to call for help & the laser MAY well help the rescuer to locate you quicker - just as a flare may be used now. But lasers are directional & flares are not.
Most people will have a VHF (if only a handheld in the liferaft) to call for help & the laser MAY well help the rescuer to locate you quicker - just as a flare may be used now. But lasers are directional & flares are not.
VicS
Well-Known Member
Hundreds of threads may be a bit of an exaggeration but there have certainly been discussions about them in the past
This is the most recent
others include
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=241818
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=250480
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=261082
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=207410
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=298828
This is the most recent
others include
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=241818
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=250480
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=261082
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=207410
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=298828
Searush
Well-Known Member
I did a search, just in the MoBo forum;
That does seem like HUNDREDS to me, 2 of 'em on this forum alone, now add the stuff on the other fora . . .
Sorry, Vic, but while I don't mind if I AM wrong, it is annoying when I am not.
jimg
Well-Known Member
I did a search, just in the MoBo forum;
That does seem like HUNDREDS to me, 2 of 'em on this forum alone, now add the stuff on the other fora . . .
Sorry, Vic, but while I don't mind if I AM wrong, it is annoying when I am not.
Afraid you are wrong!!
Searching for laser will produce 206 hits, BUT they are not all about flares.
oceanfroggie
Well-Known Member
I have got rid of the flares off our boat. I consider them more of a health hazard for crew untrained in their use. Effectively they are explosive devices. I've heard too many reports of injuries caused to leisure boaters and boat fires caused by misuse. Fine for professional sea farers, etc, but risk more harm than good for amateurs. In an era of inexpensive mass market electronics such as EPIRBs, PLBs, HH VHF and mobile phones, one wonders why an archaic and dangerous technology from two centuries ago is still advocated for the leisure sector.
DougH
Well-Known Member
The Odeo Laser Flare shown in MBM recently is a new model which is not directional and is great for guiding the rescue services to the vessel and lasts several hours which can be extended by replacing the batteries.
It gives a very good continuous flashing red light and will attract other boaters attention.
Conventional parachute flares can be seen from a greater distance but still may not be understood by Joe public.
I carry both types as I would prefer to restrict the use of pyrotechnics to a minimum due to their potential instability.
As has been said DSC on VHF is the best line of defence and I would consider discarding all pyrotechnics but my insurance has a clause that makes them a requirement.
It gives a very good continuous flashing red light and will attract other boaters attention.
Conventional parachute flares can be seen from a greater distance but still may not be understood by Joe public.
I carry both types as I would prefer to restrict the use of pyrotechnics to a minimum due to their potential instability.
As has been said DSC on VHF is the best line of defence and I would consider discarding all pyrotechnics but my insurance has a clause that makes them a requirement.
DougH
Well-Known Member
Yep, I agree
Searush
Well-Known Member
You mean it looks just like a Port Hand bouy?
And just remember how hard they can be to find against a sodium lit Promenade/ Harbour/ etc if the RNLI are looking for you.
You might be surprised how many 999 calls are instigated by non-boaty landlubbers when a parachute flare is seen. But a flashing red light? how would a landlubber know what that was?
Flares may not be perfect, but they sure do attract attention! The smoke they produce is lit up by the flame & produces a VERY distinctive effect. Every footy fan that has watched a Continental match will know what they are!
DougH
Well-Known Member
You mean it looks just like a Port Hand bouy?
And just remember how hard they can be to find against a sodium lit Promenade/ Harbour/ etc if the RNLI are looking for you.
You might be surprised how many 999 calls are instigated by non-boaty landlubbers when a parachute flare is seen. But a flashing red light? how would a landlubber know what that was?
Flares may not be perfect, but they sure do attract attention! The smoke they produce is lit up by the flame & produces a VERY distinctive effect. Every footy fan that has watched a Continental match will know what they are!
Not denying any of the above except a Port Hand Mark is Red light .any rhythm. (Red light with intervals of no light)
The Odeo Laser last time I checked was continuous Red light with intervals of intense Red flashing.
Just my opinion but I do not like Pyrotechnics, LPG bottles, Petrol or anyone smoking on a boat.
Searush
Well-Known Member
That's fine, continuous red with intervals of flashing would certainly have got me checking my charts VERY carefully & then assuming I had missed an Admiralty Notice somewhere. I certainly wouldn't think I must go over & see what danger is being marked, would I? And I wouldn't have associated that pattern with a person needing rescue or help.
And a landlubber? They'd just assume it was "something like a bouy" in the channel, even they even noticed it at all.
As a secondary aid to a VHF Mayday, where you could talk to the rescue party & explain "I'm the boat with the funny flashing red light" it might help them pick you out in a busy location. But smokes in daylight & pinpoints at night are just so blindingly obvious as distress signals that they are hard to beat.
In fact, I have even relegated my old tar barrel to the scrap heap since flares were invented.
And a landlubber? They'd just assume it was "something like a bouy" in the channel, even they even noticed it at all.
As a secondary aid to a VHF Mayday, where you could talk to the rescue party & explain "I'm the boat with the funny flashing red light" it might help them pick you out in a busy location. But smokes in daylight & pinpoints at night are just so blindingly obvious as distress signals that they are hard to beat.
In fact, I have even relegated my old tar barrel to the scrap heap since flares were invented.
DougH
Well-Known Member
In fact, I have even relegated my old tar barrel to the scrap heap since flares were invented.
You should have kept the barrel to tar and feather anyone who does not agree 100% with you.
PaulGooch
Well-Known Member
I'm inclined to agree with Searush here with regards to comparing flares and laser devices. But, with PLB's now costing little more than a coastal flare pack, perhaps that's a better direction to move ?
If all of the regular crew had PLB's, would there be a point in having an EPIRB onboard ?
If all of the regular crew had PLB's, would there be a point in having an EPIRB onboard ?
Searush
Well-Known Member
You looking for a fight then?
Or just trying to stifle debate?
I learn a lot from posts on here - I now know the characteristics of one particular laser flare. People can do as they wish, but I don't see the value of suppressing discussion or differing opinions & ideas.DougH
Well-Known Member
You looking for a fight then?
Or just trying to stifle debate?
I am a belt, braces & piece of string person (string incase the belt snaps) who carries the following items on the boat at all times:
1 x EPIRB Self launching
! x EPIRB Grab bag
1 x SART Grab bag
12 x PLB's
12 x Raymarine MOB watches
20 x Crewsaver Life jackets (All sizes from tots to adults)
1 x Icom fixed VHF DSc
1 x Icom identical VHF in a box c/w 20 ampere hour battery in a box and emergency aerial.
1 x Icom DSC GPS hand held VHF + spare batteries in grab bag
3 x Icom hand helds
1 x Raymarine plotter with inbuilt GPS to be used from 12 volt socket (or above battery box)
if main plotter fails.
1 x Garmin plotter that runs from it,s own battery source
1 x Offshore pack of Pyrotechnic flares
2 x Odeo Laser flares
1 x 8 man self launching life raft
1 x 4 man valise liferaft
1 x Grab bag with all normal items included
These are just the main items and would happily add any others if safety is improved.
Together with my wife (both pensioners) we travel long distances many times out of sight of land and we like to have as much of a safety umbrella as possible.
During when it is to hot in the Med for us oldies my Son and his family take over the boat and generally my little baby (my boat) has to contend with up to 12 people on board and many of them are my Grand-childrens friends.
Knowing that I have put all safety possible in place with all of them being serviced by the manufacturers on the correct time intervals gives me great piece of mind.
I have only received compliments from those people whose opinions I respect as to the standard of safety and boat preparedness i achieve.
l
YES some people will think I have gone right over the top and YES many people will make do with much less and never have any problems.
I am very very fortunate to be able to afford and indulge myself with my hobby and respect others who may be running their boat on a shoe string.
Those people who struggle to run a boat get my utmost respect because they too have a passion for boats.
I never take my good fortune for granted nor do I forget my roots but it all boils down to the fact that we all have different ideas and opinions on all subjects.
Without doubt I embrace new ideas and technology and accept that nothing new is the panacea to all problems but at least i look at progress with open eyes and do not poo poo everything new.
The World has moves on and not everything that occurs is an improvement but most things are.
DougH
Well-Known Member
You looking for a fight then?
Or just trying to stifle debate?
Nah, gave up fighting a long time ago. Now days I couldn't punch my way out of a paper bag.
Really do not understand your ' suppressing discussion etc ' statement, I thought that is what we were doing!
Searush
Well-Known Member
'ang on, 'ow many of you is there?
You said that I would want to tar & feather those who did not agree with me 100%. That would be stifling debate would it not?
I was in fact trying to illustrate that I have no problem with people thinking differently to me - in fact I would expect it on this forum. TBH I thought that my main entertainment value was to offer an independant perspective.
