Flares and alternatives

[MagicalArmchair]

So I have two young crew (2 and 5), a dog, and the first mate. My flare pack is out of date and we are going on our summer cruise where our first passage will be 8 or 9 hours across the Thames in calm conditions. I was just pricing the flares up, and started wondering if it was all worth the fuss and if the money would be better saved towards an EPIRB or PLB?

My old flare pack has 2 x parachute, 2 x red hand flares and 2 x smoke. Lets consider when we'd be letting these off, with two kids and trying to get them into a liferaft - it doesn't bear thinking about - I think I just wouldn't do it and risk setting fire to the liferaft/ships hound. We have a liferaft with flares in it too, that are in date as part of the liferafts service.

So, the question, we have a DSC radio and a hand held VHF also. In the middle of the Thames, where you feel pretty remote, no sight of land, is there still VHF coverage from the coastguard? There is an interesting FOI request below.

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/uk_vhf_radio_coverage

We don't have an EPIRB and frankly, right now, we don't have the funds for one. I am considering a PLB perhaps.

 

[Champagne Murphy]

We have a PLB. AFAIK the only difference to an EPIRB is battery life, important in the larger oceans but not much point in the Thames Estuary where a fast boat is less than an hour away. The PLB stays in the grab bag, it's had the battery replaced once.
We do have flares as well but I had always kept those in the (apparently) mistaken belief that the Continental authorities insist on it. I am reliably informed that the only requirement is for any flares to be in date.

 

[Tranona]

Flares are of limited use given all the alternative means of communication available now. The main argument is that they help pinpoint exactly where you are for rescuers, but in my view this is a weak reason for keeping them. You will always find examples when they have been used successfully, but without knowing what other means might have been just as effective.

I do not carry flares now, but do have an EPIRB. However, a DSC and a mobile phone for coastal waters are the first line. Chances of you having to bundle your kids into a liferaft are zero - it simply has not happened in our coastal waters. Would you really get yourself into a position where a liferaft was your only option? In fact, I would argue that a PLB/EPIRB are a priority over a liferaft. It is extremely difficult to sink a yacht - so the key thing is to call for assistance and have a signal to broadcast your exact position to the would be rescuer.

 

[PaulRainbow]

With fixed and handheld DSC i no longer carry flares. If/when i make North Sea crossings i will buy a PLB.

Edit : With a Thames crossing (or most other coastal cruising/day sailing) i'd also question the need for a liferaft. If you have a tender you could use that and the handheld.

 

[Yellow Ballad]

I'm in the same situation, I have a number of out of date flares and I'm loathed to replace them. Having a PLB, Fixed DSC and DSC GPS handheld. I've fired some flares (out of date) and although if the fhit hits the san I'm sure I would want them, I don't really like the idea of them on my boat or near the little people. I quite like the idea of these LED flares however I've been holding out for some offical recognition.

 

[Concerto]

Mark

I have no pyrotechnic flares on board, but do have an Odeo electronic flare.

Also have a DSC radio, mobile VHF and mobile phone.

Just awaiting a PLB to be delivered today. These have come down in price and ordered this one. http://www.marinesuperstore.com/safety-beacons/plb-ais/ocean-signal-rescueme-plb1-with-gps-plb
There is another slightly cheaper, but larger and shorter battery life.
http://www.marinesuperstore.com/safety-beacons/plb-ais/mcmurdo-fastfind-220-gps-plb
With a PLB on my lifejacket, I feel I have a better chance of survival if I slipped overboard.

 

[Tranona]

Mark

I have no pyrotechnic flares on board, but do have an Odeo electronic flare.

Also have a DSC radio, mobile VHF and mobile phone.

Just awaiting a PLB to be delivered today. These have come down in price and ordered this one. http://www.marinesuperstore.com/safety-beacons/plb-ais/ocean-signal-rescueme-plb1-with-gps-plb
There is another slightly cheaper, but larger and shorter battery life.
http://www.marinesuperstore.com/safety-beacons/plb-ais/mcmurdo-fastfind-220-gps-plb
With a PLB on my lifejacket, I feel I have a better chance of survival if I slipped overboard.

It is important to understand the risks involved. We tend to worry about the extremes - which by their very nature rarely occur. Falling overboard and foundering are both extremely rare. Better to look at the data on the causes of rescue callouts. The RNLI is of course a good source, although their data is not collected in a way that is particularly useful for those who want to improve their own preventative strategies. despite that there are some things that are pretty obvious such as gear failure, bad weather, loss of engine, medical emergencies etc. As most of us sail in areas with VHF (and mobile phone) coverage it is clear that effective communications are top of the list and you have this well covered. The PLB/EPIRB is mainly an extra refinement in giving a continuous broadcast position - as would an AIS transmission. The only barrier to effectiveness is the reluctance to actually use them!

Many of us still think in survival mode, perhaps because we are constantly fed a diet of fantastic derring do survival stories, which by their nature are rare events and of little relevance to modest cautious coastal sailors. Of course if you sail offshore and out of range of regular VHF communications and the associated quick rescue services, your priorities change and survival strategies become more important. So you gear up for them over and above a coastal strategy. Flares may, ironically be of more use then than for coastal sailors.

 

[TangaraToo]

In the middle of the Thames, where you feel pretty remote, no sight of land, is there still VHF coverage from the coastguard?

If it helps we hear, and hear contact to Dover CG from SYH. Very clear.

 

[maxi77]

The Thames is a big place, the wider crossings are just as much as a channel crossing. A decent fixed VHF and a handheld as back up will provide decent coverage though with there being enough passing shipping to act as relay if needed. In general I would expect flares or at least parachute flares to be seen either from shore or from shipping, but I would probably put the PLB as the priority over flares, but do not forget to register it or it may be of little use. I would not bother with the various unapproved laser 'flares' but a couple of the new high power LED torches would not go amiss

 

[MagicalArmchair]

If it helps we hear, and hear contact to Dover CG from SYH. Very clear.

The Crew do love SYH, we'll be visiting there next week to to check out your swanky new ablutions block! I suppose I am more interested to know how far out we can be and still be heard on VHF as oppose to hear the high powered transmission from the CG. Out in the middle of the estuary there is no mobile signal and no sight of land. Lots of other ships\boats around mind you, so if I needed to ask for help, they could always relay I suppose. High powered transmission of a DSC distress circa 20 NM from a marine transmitter? We won't be any further than 10 or 15 NM off the coast... so would the CG pick that up?

Like you rightly say, I've been sailing ALL my life, and we've never sunk (and I've sailed some stuff that probably deserved to sink). The liferaft is one of those great insurance policies we'll never use that is born from great imagination from what might go wrong!

 

[ex-Gladys]

Biggest aid to navigation crossing the Estuary is AIS... Spotting those big chaps helter skeltering at 18 knots is a God send, although at Sea Reach No1 (for the Mudway) the channel is quite narrow

 

[Plum]

If it helps we hear, and hear contact to Dover CG from SYH. Very clear.

Yes, the VHF range to the Coastguard is good but you were probably hearing Dover Coastguard via their aerial at Walton which is about 8 miles from you.

Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk