Favourite boats I haven't tried

[E39mad]

I would have loved to have tried a Firebird 26 micro multihull back in my youth

Been clocked at 32 knots.

I sailed the big cruising sister the Freebird 50 cat which easily did 15 knots around Osbourne Bay. Both made in very small numbers.

 

[Kukri]

I spent a little time in the Solent last summer, and went to the Southampton Boat Show.

First, a disclaimer: My interest in new boats is academic as I am now old, I run a manky auld boat on a shoestring budget, and I have no interest in going to Greece at all, having been there often enough on business.

Having said that:

1. Why is a boat optimised for flotilla charters in Greece more suited to being owned in the UK and used for weekends than either a boat optimised for trade wind passages, or an ex offshore racer?

2. The winches, furlers, windlasses etc on new boats all seem small.

3. Why the obsession with hiding furlers, windlasses and so on below deck,
where they can’t be got at easily for maintenance?

4. I can see that a narrow deep keel is good on a racer. But on other boats?

5. Why the his and hers wheels with his and hers chart plotters?

6. Why the obsession with looking like Darth Vader’s space ship?

7. I can see that it’s handy to have a garage for the RIB under the cockpit but I sense that getting it in and out of there isn’t so easy.

8. Why would anyone put thin strips of plantation grown teak on top of a boat that is obviously made of plastic?

9. Gadgets are nice when they work, but they are not all the same, even when they do the same job. High quality gear lasts much longer, particularly if it is on the big side for the loads on it.

 

[Wansworth]

Good thing about old style cabin tops,box shaped it affords a nice sting area out of the cockpit,whilst modern designs encourage lying down

 

[TSB240]

Dan I like your penchant for the LM but I am going top trumps I give you the LM 33 or 35 vitesse https://fotos.topbarcos.com/yachting/used-boats/lm-33-vitesse/foto1. I think the name gives my reason for its choice. . Anyone sailed one? Anyone thinking of selling one?

 

[dancrane]

I like the bigger LMs, although the amount of glazing looks vulnerable if it were hit by green water. Not that I've heard of any failures.

I suppose that is the sort of wild speculation that makes its way into discussions for no good reason, and was part of the basis for me starting this thread - specifically about boats of which I don't have experience. I also don't recall ever being aboard any of the Fishers, though they have a secure place in my dreams - almost every time it's wet, cold and windy.

It is so very helpful when owners are ready to concede frankly where their boats score badly, or the areas of maintenance that need close inspection and consideration ahead of the vessel's purchase. It's sadly inevitable that nobody who has a serious problem with a boat is likely to draw attention to it if they hope to sell!

Thinking outside the ordinary, I rather like the Telstar trimaran. It's unfortunate that almost none of the photos online actually show the boat under sail. Does that tell a story in itself?

 

[JumbleDuck]

The much reviled, on this forum, GT35 was the best 35 foot cruiser I have ever sailed thanks to Stephen Jones' ever developing skills.

I don't think anyone ever said it was a bad boat, and in fact the only sailing criticism I remember was a comment that the prototype had rather poor sails ... from yourself. The doubts expressed here were more about the astonishing price, the surprisingly plain interior, the dubious claim that one had been sold (to the owner of the company building them ...) and the hagiographic YM review which the reviewer justified on the grounds that he wanted to "big up" a UK company.

That said, I wholly trust your report of the sailing qualities and I think it's a great shame that it couldn't be (or wasn't) built at a competitive price.

 

[Concerto]

Two boats that can be bought new today would be:
Sirius 35 35 DS – Sirius-decksaloon yachts
Dragonfly 32 Dragonfly 32

Hugely different, but both have features that appeal to me.

 

[Kukri]

It is so very helpful when owners are ready to concede frankly where their boats score badly, or the areas of maintenance that need close inspection and consideration ahead of the vessel's purchase. It's sadly inevitable that nobody who has a serious problem with a boat is likely to draw attention to it if they hope to sell!

I’ll start: If you buy a boat equipped with Whitlock Mamba steering gear, plan to have it rebuilt, by an expert. Don’t ask me how I know this. It may look as if if will survive a nuclear explosion, but mine showed archaeological evidence of two earlier botched repairs.

 

[gregcope]

Would love a go in a larger Dragonfly with nice sails. I would imagine goes like stink off the wind. Not that we can afford one, but I have tried to suggest to my wide that that lack of any heel must appeal to her, as does storage for her paddle board.

Or Boreal 47. I like the functional style. Like a decent 4x4 - looks the part. Would probably sail through anything and I like the idea of lifting the keel and anchoring in 2cm of water next to a nice beach somewhere.

Or a mid sized Spirit - do they go as well as they look? Even if I could afford one, I would have to walk away as the thought of keeping up on all that varnishing would kill me ...

 

[LittleSister]

I’ll start: If you buy a boat equipped with Whitlock Mamba steering gear, plan to have it rebuilt, by an expert. Don’t ask me how I know this. It may look as if if will survive a nuclear explosion, but mine showed archaeological evidence of two earlier botched repairs.

Fred drift alert!

Reminds me of a friend's boat (same one as earlier post, maybe same trip), previously tiller steered, which had recently had Whitlock wheel steering installed (no idea what model). We were sailing along the South Coast at night, some hours from our next port of call, in not very calm conditions, and noticed that there was now play in the steering, steadily getting worse. I had never seen a wheel steering mechanism of any sort, but ended up lying on the floor, feeling queasy, arm contorted and outstretched, trying to deduce by feel what the mechanism consisted of, what was loose, and how it could be tightened. All the while we were sailing along, so I had to shout for the skipper to hold the steering still, plunge my fingers in and rummage about, by which time we'd be falling off course and he'd shout he'd got to steer again, I'd withdraw my hand and shout OK, and he'd get us back on course. Repeated ad nauseam (very nearly literally ), and eventually I got it sussed and sorted, at least well enough until we could get into harbour and do the job properly stationary and in daylight.

How I got away without getting my fingers crushed I don't know. In retrospect it was stupid.

We should have sent a Pan-Pan, put the motor on and sails down to reduce the amount of steering needed, kept further clear of any dangers, bearing in mind tide and wind, so that if the steering did fail we had plenty of room to drift while awaiting rescue. The steering would probably have lasted until we got into harbour anyway, but even if not it would just have been a tow with no great time pressure or drama, rather than perhaps a heli lift to hospital and permanent disability for me.

The things we do for fun!

 

[Kukri]

Boreal 47. I like the functional style. Like a decent 4x4 - looks the part. Would probably sail through anything and I like the idea of lifting the keel and anchoring in 2cm of water next to a nice beach somewhere.

There is a really excellent review of this boat and of the somewhat similar Garcia 45 on the Attainable Adventure Cruising website.I won’t post a link as I have already upset the Moderator once today.

 

[Bajansailor]

LittleSister, re your friend's boat with the new Whitlock steering - in view of how it was previously tiller steered, why was it not possible to go back to the tiller?
Or would it have been way too difficult to try to disconnect the Whitlock at sea?
If that is the case, I think I would prefer to just have a tiller.

Re the Attainable Adventure Cruising site, will I get told off if I post a link?
Most of it is only accessible if you have a subscription, but some bits are free.
Re the Garcia and Boreal, here is an article about aluminium boats - Why aluminum is the best building material for sailboats
They say there are many more, but your sub kicks in then - you do have to pay to read the full article comparing the Garcia and the Boreal.
The Garcia Exploration 45 Compared to the Boréal 47—Part 3, Hull and Build

 

[Kukri]

On my boat there is a specific link which has to be disconnected before the emergency tiller can be used. You need to get under the pedestal, with the right spanner, and a torch, in order to do this. Otherwise you are trying to drive the steering gear backwards.

 

[mjcoon]

3. Why the obsession with hiding furlers, windlasses and so on below deck,
where they can’t be got at easily for maintenance?

Not to mention hiding the running rigging. Even if urgent access is not needed, does it not get mouldy?

Mike.

 

[dancrane]

On my boat there is a specific link which has to be disconnected before the emergency tiller can be used. You need to get under the pedestal, with the right spanner, and a torch, in order to do this.

Doesn't that rather badly obstruct the purpose behind having an 'emergency' tiller - that it should be usable at short notice?

 

[westhinder]

A couple more suggestions:
Not brand new, but I’d still like to try an XC 45, go anywhere and not take too long.
And thinking higher latitudes, I’d like to compare the Boreal or Garcia 45 or the Bestevaer boats, having sailed on an aluminium Koopmans expedition yacht. And isn’t there an aluminium expedition catamaran too by Garcia?
And I’d like a spin in a Dragonfly, I absolutely see the appeal of cruising at high speeds.

 

[westhinder]

Not to mention hiding the running rigging. Even if urgent access is not needed, does it not get mouldy?

Mike.

Not if the lines are led under a cover that you can open so you can clean what’s underneath.

 

[Kukri]

Doesn't that rather badly obstruct the purpose behind having an 'emergency' tiller - that it should be usable at short notice?

Trust me; by the time you have hoisted the stainless steel emergency tiller out of the lazarette, bolted it in place and found and fitted the reserve compass because you can’t see the binnacle when using it, the time needed to find the right spanner and squirm into the Black Hole under the cockpit is as nothing...

 

[DownWest]

I always had a soft spot for the Francis 26, also from Chuck Pain. That he had the first one might be something to recomend it..
Over on the WBF, there was a very long thread from someone who lived on a Vancouver 27 for eleven years. On his own, but interesting.

 

[DownWest]

Trust me; by the time you have hoisted the stainless steel emergency tiller out of the lazarette, bolted it in place and found and fitted the reserve compass because you can’t see the binnacle when using it, the time needed to find the right spanner and squirm into the Black Hole under the cockpit is as nothing...

The company yacht, a bit bigger than yours, sprung a leak in the hydraulic steering ram. After using up all the spare oil, the deck and lower steering position progressivly quit. So they got the emergency tiller out of the lazerette.....and dropped it overboard.... They just made port before losing it all, with steering by the a/pilot remote control, as that was at the lowest point in the system next to the ram. Last resort was going to be using the twin engines.