Favourite boats I haven't tried

[Yellow Ballad]

I would love to have a go in a Figaro 1 and whilst we're at it the Figaro 2.

As we're talking "within affordable realms" Rustler 36 although outside mine at the moment I have time on my side.

If it's just having a go I would like a long weekend on a Challenger 72, fastnet or the like.

Outside affordable realms, an old Swan 48.

 

[Yellow Ballad]

Duplicate

 

[Kukri]

I am lucky to have owned and sailed both my dream ships. I’ve got the second one now.

So by the terms of the OP I cannot comment...

Oh, what the heck - we spent a few days in the Hamble next to a Swan 65 - maintenance somewhere in the Playboy Playmate of the Month league but - phoaarr!

 

[Kukri]

I agree with many of the other comments. I have always dreamed about “Stormy Weather”, I have had similar thoughts about the Rhodes 41 (well, nearly all Rhodes designs, but the big keel centreboarders and ‘Carina’ above all!) and the Twister and the Rustler 31 and the Northney 34 (Rustler 31 with counter) and the Vancouver 27.

I was actually looking for a Nic 43 when I fell across a 55 in good condition at a silly price.

 

[dancrane]

"Maldwin Drummond", eh? This country is weaker now, for the lack of chaps with names like that. Nice, versatile-looking boat, too.

Thanks Andy, I haven't yet ordered "The Proper Yacht", but it looks good.

I've got, and have sailed, an LM27, so I'm disbarred by the terms of the OP from singing her praises.

Actually I'd like to hear all that is good and less good, about the LM27. I reckon a boat which looks like this, won't disappoint if her sailing ability isn't thrilling; meanwhile the big cockpit cover and protected helm make her a very safe bet for pain-free fun afloat all year round, in the full range of British weather. May be why they sold 1,500?

 

[Gerry]

Have a Bowman 40- consider it Chuck Paine's best design ever... sails like a dream, safe, comfortable go anywhere do anything boat.

Rather fancy the Morris 42 but suspect it would be very similar to what I have, would love to try a Bristol channel pilot cutter but suspect it would be too much for an aging pair of unfit sailors.... Bristol Channel Pilot Cutter 51ft William Stoba 1904/2010

 

[LittleSister]

Actually I'd like to hear all that is good and less good, about the LM27. I reckon a boat which looks like this, won't disappoint if her sailing ability isn't thrilling; meanwhile the big cockpit cover and protected helm make her a very safe bet for pain-free fun afloat all year round, in the full range of British weather. May be why they sold 1,500?

She actually sails well - much better than most people expect - but is not close winded, due to shallow keel and wide foresail sheeting angle.

I'll have a look for the 'warts 'n all' summary I did for someone who asked about them by PM on here a while ago, and post that here if I can find it.

 

[LittleSister]

LM27 - The good, the bad and the ugly!

Probably more than you wanted to know, but this is an edited version of an even longer summary I did in response to a query from another forumite. (Still galls me they didn't even say 'thanks'!)

LMs are generally significantly better built than most British volume builder's boats of that era. LM were originally wooden furniture makers before they started boatbuilding. The skills and quality they developed working in GRP eventually led them to give up building yachts in the 1980s to concentrate on manufacturing wind turbine blades, and became the biggest wind turbine blade making company in the world.

The LM27 hull is loosely based on traditional Baltic fishing etc. boats, but the interior is pure LM - original thinking, cunning detail and very practical. The definitely Scandinavian interior styling isn’t for all, but I really like it

Shoal draft (0.95m) long keel, rudder separate from the keel (i.e. no prop cut out = more effective). Carries its beam most of the way to either end, so it’s a lot of boat for the length (actually just short of 28 foot). Low deck midships, due to pronounced sheer, together with handrails on the relatively high above deck cabin and wheelhouse make getting on and off pontoons etc. very easy.

In my humble opinion (and broadly consistent with other views I've heard from owners):

Upsides-

- Kettle is within arm’s length of the wheel!

- Sails nicely and surprisingly fast. More at the sailing end of motor-sailing than most of the competitors. They sail better than you would think, and various reviewers have been surprised at their speed and handiness under sail.

- Really practical interior, in my view, for a smallish boat.

- Nicer finishes inside than average boat of that, era - no foam backed vinyl, etc. (not that I had a problem with that before I got an LM!)

- Good creature comforts overall, including protective wheelhouse). Originally the wheelhouses were designed open to the rear, but probably most of those in UK have this enclosed.

- Cockpit canopy (part of the original design, not a half-baked, clumsy later add-on), makes the cockpit an extra room at anchor or alongside, and a huge difference to how the boat feels. (And potential ’spare’ berths in the cockpit.) Rear and sides roll up, so can adjust to suit the wind/rain/sun direction, or all rolled up gives you a bimini. Mostly you just roll it all away and clip it to the back of the wheelhouse roof.

- Absence of bridge deck gives a very open, spacious feel, and easy movement through the boat. A boon for the less sprightly: from the cockpit there's one shallow step down into wheelhouse, then two shallow steps down into saloon, then one shallow step up into fore cabin.

- Wheel steering is quickly and easily disconnected from/reconnected to the tiller/rudder to give better feel/less work to tiller (and autopilot) if required.

- Large foredeck for sunbathing etc.

- Lower side decks than most means effectively taller cabin roof handy for sitting on while sorting fenders or admiring the view.

- Olde-worlde traditional wooden ‘butterfly’ skylight hatch in saloon (not on later models) is handsome and gives great light and ventilation.

- Neat little cubby holes, bottle rack, etc., and generally plenty of accessible, usable storage

- Good sized cockpit lockers and very useful full length trough either side of cockpit for boathooks, oars, toffees, etc..

- great hand-holds going forward - high handrails, and 3 shrouds each side, either side of the side deck (e.g. left, right, left) in succession

- sails, canopies, masts, etc. and some other kit still available off the shelf from original suppliers.

- there is a friendly, helpful English language LM owners internet forum http://lmowners.proboards.com , a big owners club in Denmark, and another in the Netherlands

- there are enough LMs around the UK for them not to be rare, but few enough for owners to feel they have something in common when they come across another one.

- hatch above helm position in wheelhouse is a boon for ventilation, standing up, head and shoulders outside, to get all round view or to check the set of the sails etc.

- spacious engine compartment will probably give good, though top down, engine maintenance access, depending on model fitted (usually Bukh DV20).

- Built in cockpit table folds out in two stages from back of cockpit to form medium or huge table/worktop

Downsides -

- biggest downside, to me, is poor forward visibility from the cockpit, especially seated, and especially if you have an enclosed rear to the wheelhouse (and more so with small wheelhouse rear windows like mine). I’m gradually getting more used to it. Some use a small stool, or deep cushion, to place on aft deck, or fix wooden seats across corners of the pushpit

- the beamy, shallow hull means they tend to roll in certain sea conditions

- long keel means not very manoeuvrable at close quarters, especially in astern (but better than most trad long keelers due to rudder arrangement). Can be turned quite sharply by a hard blast of throttle in fwd with rudder over, but doing this can be nerve wracking in a tight marina! A bow-thruster is a popular mod.

- they are not very close winded (wide shroud angles and shallow keel), but it's certainly better than I was expecting from a motor-sailer. Others have said minimum 50 degrees to the wind or you get too much leeway, but I think you can do a little better than that. (There's a motor for going upwind against the tide!)

- Not much dedicated galley work top space. (Though sliding pull-out worktop opposite under helm seat, and cockpit table two steps away.)

- they are quite capable, but not a boat to be out in the ultimate storm in – there is no bridge deck between cockpit and wheelhouse; and early models (to c1979) did not have self-draining cockpits;

- a design weakness!! Inner shrouds are only anchored by the deck. Forward lowers tension can (after a few decades) result in creaking decks and/or cracks in gelcoat. Some owners have installed supports below to take the load down to the hull.

MR. PICKY SAYS:

- forecabin vee berth rather cramped for two adults. OK for one, or for a couple of kids, in my opinion.

- old fashioned wooden ‘butterfly’ skylight hatch on early models is not watertight, and needs canvas cover at sea or when raining. (Later versions had a conventional modern hatch, which would be a mixed blessing, in my view.)

- saloon seats (which both convert to a generous single, or tight double berth) have comfy sloping backs for normal sitting, but with the back in place the seat is a bit narrow for lengthways sprawling. I often remove the back in the evening for serious lounging.

- Shape of bow makes it difficult to keep anchor away from hull without some effort or modification.

 

[Seajet]

John_Silver,

I remember when the Mystery first came out, one reviewer was clearly having to restrain himself from exclaiming ' this is the best boat I've ever tried ! ' - of course she doesn't have a lard arse with twin wheels or rudders to accomodate double aft cabins - exactly why I admire her, definitely on The List

 

[Orion Jim]

Stone Horse 26 designed by Samuel Crocker.

 

[jant]

I like my Nantucket clipper, very traditional. All overhangs!

 

[mjcoon]

I like my Nantucket clipper, very traditional. All overhangs!

View attachment 83284

I got to sail in one of those on charter from Elba decades ago. I remember only a couple of trivial disasters. Ripping my shorts on the mizzen cleat. And the anchor falling off the little bow-plank (not visible in that photo), swinging back and hitting the hull just where the log paddle-wheel had been trying to do its thing...

We had actually booked a Halcyon 27 (IIRC) which was not available.

Mike.

 

[TLouth7]

I'd like to have a go on (or just a nose around) a Fairey Atalanta.

Also a blast on a Figaro 2.

And finally I should probably never set foot on a proper Sigma 33 as I have the cruising version and I don't want to know how much better they can go if set up for racing.

 

[Seajet]

A boat I've always fancied and would love a go on is the Aphrodite 101, the late 1970's pencil thin contender for Offshore One Design - she lost out to the lightly ballasted wide beam OOD34 which didn't work out too well in the '79 Fastnet.

SailboatData.com - APHRODITE 101 Sailboat

 

[Seajet]

A boat I've always fancied and would like a go on is the Aphrodite 101, the late 70's pencil thin contender for the Offshore One Design ( which lost out to the lightly ballasted, wide beam OOD34 and that didn't work out so well in the '79 Fastnet


History

 

[dancrane]

A boat I've always fancied and would like a go on is the Aphrodite 101

She certainly looks like the god's bollocks, if you'll pardon the phrase.

Little Sister, I don't know how any boat could have a better owner's summary than you have given the LM27, above. I've copied and pasted it into a long document I had created to remind myself what I like - as well as what I think I'd prefer to see done differently, in the design. Many thanks for showing it here - I believe it will be a very useful reference point for prospective owners, in future.

 

[Fr J Hackett]

I have a thing about American designers like Paine, Harris and Perry who all designed some fabulous boats and I have been fortunate enough to sail on some and own a couple.
However the dream boat that I have never sailed on would be one of the Hoek Truly Classic designs I would limit myself to the 56 or 65 series.

 

[flaming]

Fascinating thread....

With a few exceptions it seems that the bulk of respondents want to try boats that have been out of production for 20+ years.

Genuine question to those posters. Is there nothing from any yard's current offering that interests you?

Personally I would love to sail

JPK 45 - looks like an awesome long distance boat
Cape 31 - One just arrived at HYS, and boy that thing looks fun....
TP52 - just because
J99 - out of curiosity mainly.
A foiled Open 60.

 

[JumbleDuck]

I remember when the Mystery first came out, one reviewer was clearly having to restrain himself from exclaiming ' this is the best boat I've ever tried ! ' - of course she doesn't have a lard arse with twin wheels or rudders to accomodate double aft cabins - exactly why I admire her, definitely on The List

I had a crawl round a Mystery 35 at an London Boat Show (remember them?) when they came out. The impression I got was of a very pretty boat, built to Cornish Crabbers' reasonable standards but perhaps intended more as a day sailor than a long-term cruiser. Not much room below. That's not to damn the design or the idea - Morris Yachts in the US aim lots of their designs at the day sailing market and marinas are full of boats whose owners only want occasional nights on board.

 

[dancrane]

Glad you've found it interesting Flaming, even if the tastes displayed, largely reflect retrospective preferences.

It is surely equally noticeable that your own preferences are exclusively for racing, or strongly race-influenced, designs, whose primary purpose is necessarily increased performance, whatever that may cost in other characteristics? Actually the TP52 had crossed my mind, although I can't imagine wanting to possess such a vessel unless it had a maximum of four berths in two gigantic staterooms, one forward, one astern.

Late last night I found a Moody advert which showed one of their fairly recent, aesthetically bold deckhouse designs, above a contemporary, conventional aft-cockpit example (photos of each, below). The deckhouse example is undoubtedly the smarter choice for comfortable all-season use at 50 degrees north...but while I am fond of wheelhouses, the other design is subtler and infinitely prettier and (I suspect) likely to appeal much more to the kind of folk who can afford her. I'm glad the company offers both, but I'd only want to own the one which looks (in its essentials) like the same size of yacht from at least a third of a century ago.