Fatality in the Itchen today.

MrB said:
Is Alerter still going? I did have it on my phone but didn't think it took off? I thought it was more USA based in the end too? I downloaded it after Magnum died as it was mentioned on a thread just after and seemed like a bloody good idea. Nice job Elessar, it's a great idea. (y)
Click to expand...
You make a good point that it’s only useful if it has a critical mass of users.
But if the tech is there so it’s easy to implement and the RNLI promote it for boaters that could be a possibility.
And thanks for the nice comment.
 
  • Like
Reactions: MrB
Elessar, I think your note to the RNLI was tremendous and the concept excellent in the real world we all live in. Every boat owner has a mobile phone, 98% of them are smart phones where an app like this car be downloaded.

(...and if you are one of the tiny minority of people who proudly don't have a smart phone don't respond to this with some smart are remark! Elessar is on to something here that could genuinely end up saving a life... so wise cracks & trolling are definitely inappropriate)
 
Firefly625 said:
Elessar, I think your note to the RNLI was tremendous and the concept excellent in the real world we all live in. Every boat owner has a mobile phone, 98% of them are smart phones where an app like this car be downloaded.

(...and if you are one of the tiny minority of people who proudly don't have a smart phone don't respond to this with some smart are remark! Elessar is on to something here that could genuinely end up saving a life... so wise cracks & trolling are definitely inappropriate)
Click to expand...
Forum team effort. I didn’t find the app. But thanks for the nice comments.
 
How about extending the app to general use. Help can’t always get there in time. Say someone has a heart attack, is with a frail companion and needs CPR or a defibrillator, they could get instant help if needed. Or granny is being burgled and has locked herself in a room, the neighbours could come in and deal with it.
 
Zing said:
How about extending the app to general use. Help can’t always get there in time. Say someone has a heart attack, is with a frail companion and needs CPR or a defibrillator, they could get instant help if needed. Or granny is being burgled and has locked herself in a room, the neighbours could come in and deal with it.
Click to expand...
Less is more.
 
Firefly625 said:
Elessar, I think your note to the RNLI was tremendous and the concept excellent in the real world we all live in. Every boat owner has a mobile phone, 98% of them are smart phones where an app like this car be downloaded.

(...and if you are one of the tiny minority of people who proudly don't have a smart phone don't respond to this with some smart are remark! Elessar is on to something here that could genuinely end up saving a life... so wise cracks & trolling are definitely inappropriate)
Click to expand...

Nobody is trolling the idea so get off your high horse. Anything extra that can help save a life is worth looking in to. However my personal thoughts are that it is a shame that a device that we are all expected to have and all recommended to keep watch on is not being used. VHF ch16.
I also think it is dangerous without a lot of judicious thought to have an app that reaches the masses to alert of a tragedy. I honestly believe it has the capacity to be a hindrance rather than a boon when an unco-ordinated mass takes to a search party. People have the propensity to rubberneck rather than render aid and I can see a scenario like this causing problems. It is in my opinion much easier to immediately spot one person on a field of view of the water when there is nothing else hindering a view. 30 boats and a crowd does not make it easier nor speed up recovery.
In addition you have the problem of give it a go heroes that may not be suitably qualified to render aid. Have you ever tried to rescue somebody in the water from a cruiser mobo? Have you actually live practised a MOB drill? Be honest. It's bloody difficult in reality. I have commercially in training and it didnt end well when we rode over the fella accidentally.
I view it as a case of assistance rather than first response. If I can be supervised and co-ordinated I would be happy to take part but a free for all is likely not to be viable imo.

In saying all of this, should a means be achieved thanks to Esselar's promotion whereby co-ordinated assistance can be achieved then great. All credit to the man for adding to the tools available, but at the moment the proposed app was specific to first aid responders who have to prove their capabilities before enrolment. Not sure this is achievable in this scenario as S&R
 
BruceK said:
Nobody is trolling the idea so get off your high horse. Anything extra that can help save a life is worth looking in to. However my personal thoughts are that it is a shame that a device that we are all expected to have and all recommended to keep watch on is not being used. VHF ch16.
I also think it is dangerous without a lot of judicious thought to have an app that reaches the masses to alert of a tragedy. I honestly believe it has the capacity to be a hindrance rather than a boon when an unco-ordinated mass takes to a search party. People have the propensity to rubberneck rather than render aid and I can see a scenario like this causing problems. It is in my opinion much easier to immediately spot one person on a field of view of the water when there is nothing else hindering a view. 30 boats and a crowd does not make it easier nor speed up recovery.
In addition you have the problem of give it a go heroes that may not be suitably qualified to render aid. Have you ever tried to rescue somebody in the water from a cruiser mobo? Have you actually live practised a MOB drill? Be honest. It's bloody difficult in reality. I have commercially in training and it didnt end well when we rode over the fella accidentally.
I view it as a case of assistance rather than first response. If I can be supervised and co-ordinated I would be happy to take part but a free for all is likely not to be viable imo.

In saying all of this, should a means be achieved thanks to Esselar's promotion whereby co-ordinated assistance can be achieved then great. All credit to the man for adding to the tools available, but at the moment the proposed app was specific to first aid responders who have to prove their capabilities before enrolment. Not sure this is achievable in this scenario as S&R
Click to expand...
?
 
BruceK said:
Nobody is trolling the idea so get off your high horse. Anything extra that can help save a life is worth looking in to. However my personal thoughts are that it is a shame that a device that we are all expected to have and all recommended to keep watch on is not being used. VHF ch16.
I also think it is dangerous without a lot of judicious thought to have an app that reaches the masses to alert of a tragedy. I honestly believe it has the capacity to be a hindrance rather than a boon when an unco-ordinated mass takes to a search party. People have the propensity to rubberneck rather than render aid and I can see a scenario like this causing problems. It is in my opinion much easier to immediately spot one person on a field of view of the water when there is nothing else hindering a view. 30 boats and a crowd does not make it easier nor speed up recovery.
In addition you have the problem of give it a go heroes that may not be suitably qualified to render aid. Have you ever tried to rescue somebody in the water from a cruiser mobo? Have you actually live practised a MOB drill? Be honest. It's bloody difficult in reality. I have commercially in training and it didnt end well when we rode over the fella accidentally.
I view it as a case of assistance rather than first response. If I can be supervised and co-ordinated I would be happy to take part but a free for all is likely not to be viable imo.

In saying all of this, should a means be achieved thanks to Esselar's promotion whereby co-ordinated assistance can be achieved then great. All credit to the man for adding to the tools available, but at the moment the proposed app was specific to first aid responders who have to prove their capabilities before enrolment. Not sure this is achievable in this scenario as S&R
Click to expand...
You are echoing what I was saying ^^^^ in post #4 .
Since that mark has since informed us a police boat as well as the copter were doing there duty .
So for a jumper that’s all you need imho .
Its then been widened to child falling in ( marina ? ) ....won’t or shouldn’t the parent / guardian be watching etc and in the blink of an eye when kid enters the water be able to raise the alarm locally .Assuming the child has been brought to water
1- unable to swim .
2- as above but without a life vest .

Then the 3 rd MOB ....which leads us back to training and inevitably VHF .
In my view ( until made redundant bt alternative tech ) , the promotion or re promotion more like of basic VHF usage is a better route to go down .

That way all the players be it CC , police , S+R .....+ the folks doodling on the “ river “ are sync ed in .

VHF is still alive and kicking in the Med .
I often ear wig into semi disparate conversations , engine failures et al .

Its the ONE grounding common denominator that connects all river / sea users

If it where to happen version x or App Y or lift off alarm Z was initiated.......folks might think the VHF is not much use for emergencies ( despite just passing a RYA exam ) and by the very nature of a muddle / plethora of pseudo alternatives, which might fizzle out = net result @ official board of enquire is the confusion created by those not using VHF May have contributed , further to loss of life .

A campaign promoting VHF would imho be more worthy.
 
Elessar said:
Yep I guess you’re right. And I’ll take as much support as I can get.
Click to expand...

Well, support comes from an exchange of ideas and discussion on how to overcome problems and refine solutions. You had my support and counter arguments but you were not interested. What you actually want is not support but yes men. Unfortunately, I'm not a yes man.
 
HART is complex with many areas of risk management, training and kit required. Rivers/shoreline being some of the highest risk areas.

I’ve seen firsthand best intentions turn 1 casualty into 2 or 3. No matter how calm you think you are.....adrenaline takes hold and you will scurry down a cliff face or riverbank without a second thought.

Elessar......this is a highly commendable endeavour and I completely understand the motivation.

I would suggest a better option is for those interested to become a community first responder. You will receive training and become part of the team. Lives are saved with a team. It is a hard fact of life that not all can be saved or accidents prevented.
 
Farsco, a CFR would not be sent to a MOB incident or anything that could compromise their safety so not really an alternative option for this.

I can see this from both sides. GoodSam works so well as qualified operatives can be activated and in built up areas, there is often someone nearby. I too am concerned about half a dozen large pleasure boats being mobilised, possibly with a large dollop of adrenaline, to a moving target in the water. I would suggest a mail to the RNLI might be the best course in the first instance and seeing if they can help with the formation of an idea.
 
paradave said:
Farsco, a CFR would not be sent to a MOB incident or anything that could compromise their safety so not really an alternative option for this.

I can see this from both sides. GoodSam works so well as qualified operatives can be activated and in built up areas, there is often someone nearby. I too am concerned about half a dozen large pleasure boats being mobilised, possibly with a large dollop of adrenaline, to a moving target in the water. I would suggest a mail to the RNLI might be the best course in the first instance and seeing if they can help with the formation of an idea.
Click to expand...
I think the point is eyes rather than actions.
My expectation would be that you contact the RNLI to say you've found the casualty etc and they would instruct you if you should do anything.
It should really be no different to you spotting something amiss, except with this you know to keep a look out.
 
Eyes rather than action is a good way to look at it.....but not too many eyes!

its a very difficult balance.

@paradave are you Ambulance Service too? Quite right on CFR deployment but wasn’t looking at it as a direct alternative option?
 
Elessar said:
Was working from the boat today.
Saw the helicopter at about 10am doing a thorough search.
That usually means some poor soul has jumped off the Itchen bridge.
Apparently a body was found upstream. This bit is secondhand information.
Assuming it’s true, then a person, alive or dead, floated past my boat.
There must be a way of sending alerts in these situations. Don’t judge the jumper. It could have been a child fallen off a marina and I would try and save either.
Surely there must be a way of getting all hands on deck when someone’s in peril. Don’t say VHF. That is not monitored enough at sea leave alone when tied up.
Click to expand...
Just an observation , but did you do anything about the body floating past your boat .
 
FARSCO said:
Eyes rather than action is a good way to look at it.....but not too many eyes!

its a very difficult balance.

@paradave are you Ambulance Service too? Quite right on CFR deployment but wasn’t looking at it as a direct alternative option?
Click to expand...
Yes I am Farsco! Secamb para. You HART?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Share this page

Top