Fatality in the Itchen today.

[Elessar]

Was working from the boat today.
Saw the helicopter at about 10am doing a thorough search.
That usually means some poor soul has jumped off the Itchen bridge.
Apparently a body was found upstream. This bit is secondhand information.
Assuming it’s true, then a person, alive or dead, floated past my boat.
There must be a way of sending alerts in these situations. Don’t judge the jumper. It could have been a child fallen off a marina and I would try and save either.
Surely there must be a way of getting all hands on deck when someone’s in peril. Don’t say VHF. That is not monitored enough at sea leave alone when tied up.

 

[burgundyben]

Sad.

When I worked in Ocean Quay the bridge closing was sadly too often.

One day cycling home in the rain I had to leap off my bike and grab a lady as she tried to climb over. Sad troubled soul.

As you say. A way of helping folk is needed.

 

[superheat6k]

These sad events are deliberately not publiscised locally to avoid encouraging others to do likewise. Very very sad.

 

[Portofino]

Won’t it become pretty chaotic pretty quick if “ Joe public “ and all and sundry wanna hero’s and do gooders rock up in a willy nilly fashion ?
Net result hindering not helping the search and creating further difficulties amongst them selves ?

Sometimes , Infact most of the time theses things are best left to the professionals.
Unless they ask for volunteers.

The rescue services locally around high bridges over water tend to know the tides etc and where to look .....unfortunately from experience.

They have professional “ talker down folk “ for those stud holding the fence .

 

[Elessar]

Won’t it become pretty chaotic pretty quick if “ Joe public “ and all and sundry wanna hero’s and do gooders rock up in a willy nilly fashion ?
Net result hindering not helping the search and creating further difficulties amongst them selves ?

Sometimes , Infact most of the time theses things are best left to the professionals.
Unless they ask for volunteers.

The rescue services locally around high bridges over water tend to know the tides etc and where to look .....unfortunately from experience.

They have professional “ talker down folk “ for those stud holding the fence .

You are completely missing the point.
Someone was in the river. How they got there is irrelevant.
I was floating on the river. I may have been able to help.
But there is no way of asking me to.

Take a sunny weekend. A child falls in. 100s of people are on boats. But none of them know to even look out. There must be a way.

 

[Catalina36]

You are completely missing the point.
Someone was in the river. How they got there is irrelevant.
I was floating on the river. I may have been able to help.
But there is no way of asking me to.

Take a sunny weekend. A child falls in. 100s of people are on boats. But none of them know to even look out. There must be a way.

"Take a sunny weekend. A child falls in. 100s of people are on boats. But none of them know to even look out. There must be a way."

I pondered this a year or two ago in regard to dogs missing in the woods on walks. We've lost ours for up to an hour and also found other people's. If the dog has a phone number on the collar and if there's a phone signal in the woods. no problem in meeting up, but not otherwise.

I came up with CB radio and notices in the woods advising all dog walkers to get one and which channel to be on. Totally impractical of course so I didn't pursue it, but it's the sort of thing you'd need.

 

[BruceK]

Surely there must be a way of getting all hands on deck when someone’s in peril. Don’t say VHF. That is not monitored enough at sea leave alone when tied up.

That is the way but it's been elected not to monitor it. I dare say the same would happen for any other means. I am purely guessing here but I imagine that the reason your neck of the woods isn't monitoring CH16 is the weight of needless traffic on it. Where I am, 16 is largely silent and quite the reverse to your experience rescues and searches are actively monitored as if it was a live telly show #rubbernecking. Our CG will call on all vessels when a person is in the water. We get it regularly especially with tourist punters hiring kayaks and the like from beach stalls and setting off into the blue yonder in gleeful ignorance

 

[Elessar]

There is no point being king Canute. People monitoring VHF in marinas is not going to happen.

When I lived by the Thames the EA allowed you to register on a site and then you got text alerts for flooding.

Any system that is going to work has to be mobile phone based as virtually everyone monitors mobiles at all times. You’d forgotten that Bruce!

It has to be opt in only and it has to be for genuine emergency comms only and never used for advertising.

But given those parameters I would opt in.

 

[mlines]

How about Zello, a walkie talkie group app for mobile phones.

Set up a group (say "Itchen Zello" or "Manor Farm Country Park" - see Channels - Zello) then people get a "walkie talkie" on their mobile phone for these areas. You can then put out a call "Missing brown dog in Country park".

 

[markc]

There is a 'first responder' app called Alerter which is designed to alert any members within a certain radius who may be able to assist in a medical emergency before the Emergency Services arrive. To have something similar for boat owners could be useful, providing there is sufficient uptake to provide coverage.

 

[BruceK]

There is no point being king Canute. People monitoring VHF in marinas is not going to happen.

When I lived by the Thames the EA allowed you to register on a site and then you got text alerts for flooding.

Any system that is going to work has to be mobile phone based as virtually everyone monitors mobiles at all times. You’d forgotten that Bruce!

It has to be opt in only and it has to be for genuine emergency comms only and never used for advertising.

But given those parameters I would opt in.

I forgot you have people on boats in marina's. I find that concept a little disturbing tbh, a bit like people going for a Sunday drive to park for the day in Tesco's. I thought Roy was the aberration. Mea Culpa

 

[Elessar]

There is a 'first responder' app called Alerter which is designed to alert any members within a certain radius who may be able to assist in a medical emergency before the Emergency Services arrive. To have something similar for boat owners could be useful, providing there is sufficient uptake to provide coverage.

This looks good.
I'm going to write to the RNLI and suggest they fund and promote a marine version of this. It looks like it could be used right out of the box. Would work in rivers or at sea within cell coverage.

 

[Elessar]

This looks good.
I'm going to write to the RNLI and suggest they fund and promote a marine version of this. It looks like it could be used right out of the box. Would work in rivers or at sea within cell coverage.

I sent this. I will post any reply.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear RNLI

Yesterday I was in the river Itchen on my boat. I saw a rescue helicopter and a police boat. I later found out there had been a fatality.

If I had been alerted to the presence of someone in the water I would have kept a lookout. It may have made a difference.

On a sunny weekend there would be hundreds of people on boats. If someone was in the water and in peril, alerting all those boaters to keep a lookout would significantly increase the chance of a good outcome.

VHF is not the answer. It is increasingly not monitored at sea, and is not generally monitored at all when moored. In a busy river there are potentially 000s of willing eyes sat on boats.

Any effective, rapid general alert system has to be by the only comms that people monitor almost all the time - text messages or push notifications to a mobile phone.

The Environment Agency has an opt system that allows people to register on a site and get text alerts for flooding. Whilst this may have potential, it would force people to register for one geographic area or receive all texts. Thus it does not properly cater for a cruising boat.

There is a 'first responder' app called Alerter which is designed to alert any members within a certain radius who may be able to assist in a medical emergency before the Emergency Services arrive.

To have something similar for boat owners could be useful, providing there is sufficient uptake to provide coverage.

I have no affiliation to the company whatsoever, my only motivation is that someone floated past my boat yesterday and they may still have been alive. The link is here. GoodSAM

It looks like this could work pretty much out of the box.

If it were RNLI branded and promoted it would ensure good take up as long as it was truly reserved for emergency comms and not advertising.

It only alerts people in the locality and would work in coastal waters as well as rivers.

I think this would be a very cost effective way of increasing the number of people taking part in a search for people in the water, increasing the chance of rescue.

It could result in people taking risks to search, but with the RNLI or the coastguard controlling the alerts, they could be risk assessed before sending.

I would like the RNLI to consider such an alert system with this system or something like it.

Please let me know what you think of the proposal.

 

[James L]

Great idea.
We were rowing through Dublin many years ago when we saw a crowd of people on the bank in the distance waving at us and pointing at some people swimming. At first we thought they were warning us not to hit them, took a minute before we realised they were trying to say they were in trouble.
We rowed down flat out and grabbed one guy just as his hand went underwater, seconds later and he'd have been gone but we never found the other guy.
Had someone managed to alert us when we were further up river and out of sight, I'm sure we would have made it there in time to save both of them.

When someone around here goes missing there is always a huge search party on land and sea looking for the bodies. Would be nice to have that happen when there's still a chance to find them alive and I wouldn't think there would be any more risk.

 

[Plum]

I sent this. I will post any reply.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear RNLI

Yesterday I was in the river Itchen on my boat. I saw a rescue helicopter and a police boat. I later found out there had been a fatality.

If I had been alerted to the presence of someone in the water I would have kept a lookout. It may have made a difference.

On a sunny weekend there would be hundreds of people on boats. If someone was in the water and in peril, alerting all those boaters to keep a lookout would significantly increase the chance of a good outcome.

VHF is not the answer. It is increasingly not monitored at sea, and is not generally monitored at all when moored. In a busy river there are potentially 000s of willing eyes sat on boats.

Any effective, rapid general alert system has to be by the only comms that people monitor almost all the time - text messages or push notifications to a mobile phone.

The Environment Agency has an opt system that allows people to register on a site and get text alerts for flooding. Whilst this may have potential, it would force people to register for one geographic area or receive all texts. Thus it does not properly cater for a cruising boat.

There is a 'first responder' app called Alerter which is designed to alert any members within a certain radius who may be able to assist in a medical emergency before the Emergency Services arrive.

To have something similar for boat owners could be useful, providing there is sufficient uptake to provide coverage.

I have no affiliation to the company whatsoever, my only motivation is that someone floated past my boat yesterday and they may still have been alive. The link is here. GoodSAM

It looks like this could work pretty much out of the box.

If it were RNLI branded and promoted it would ensure good take up as long as it was truly reserved for emergency comms and not advertising.

It only alerts people in the locality and would work in coastal waters as well as rivers.

I think this would be a very cost effective way of increasing the number of people taking part in a search for people in the water, increasing the chance of rescue.

It could result in people taking risks to search, but with the RNLI or the coastguard controlling the alerts, they could be risk assessed before sending.

I would like the RNLI to consider such an alert system with this system or something like it.

Please let me know what you think of the proposal.

A good initiative. Well done. If I may add: if such a system existed then there needs to be a system for those that have been alerted to an incident and see something, to be able to contact the coordinator/incident commander. In UK tidal waters/coastal search and rescue, the coordinator is the UK Coastguard. In some SAR incidents the RNLI may not get tasked so will not be able to initiate an alert using your proposed system.

Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk

 

[Elessar]

A good initiative. Well done. If I may add: if such a system existed then there needs to be a system for those that have been alerted to an incident and see something, to be able to contact the coordinator. In UK tidal waters/coastal search and rescue, the coordinator is the Coastguard. In some SAR incidents the RNLI may not get tasked so will not be able to initiate an alert using your proposed system.

Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk

Thank you.
Contacting the coordinator - that could be the VHF.
I agree the coordinator should be the coastguard.

 

[Elessar]

duplicate in error

 

[prv]

Even though I agree that a minority of people will have the VHF on in the marina, I suspect those who do will still outnumber those who happen to have some parochial app installed on their phone.

Pete

 

[Elessar]

Even though I agree that a minority of people will have the VHF on in the marina, I suspect those who do will still outnumber those who happen to have some parochial app installed on their phone.

Pete

As you’ve poo pood my idea I presume you have a better one?
Let’s hear it.

 

[MrB]

There is a 'first responder' app called Alerter which is designed to alert any members within a certain radius who may be able to assist in a medical emergency before the Emergency Services arrive. To have something similar for boat owners could be useful, providing there is sufficient uptake to provide coverage.

Is Alerter still going? I did have it on my phone but didn't think it took off? I thought it was more USA based in the end too? I downloaded it after Magnum died as it was mentioned on a thread just after and seemed like a bloody good idea. Nice job Elessar, it's a great idea.