Engine keeps cutting out! Advice wanted!

[luckypaul]

Happily weatherbound in Sainte Marie sur la Mer at the moment, Rhubarb is just one days sailing away from her destination at Port St Louis but the engine's behaviour is becoming a concern.

I have a new (200 hours) 40hp Lister Petter (fitted last November in Cadiz - many thanks again to whoever suggested buying the engine in England and driving down to Spain with it, certainly was the cheapest option).

Anyway, all went well engine wise until the evening we arrived in Mallorca after crossing from Ibiza. Slowing down as we aproached the Cala where we were going to anchor the engine just cut out. Opening the throttle wide she started fairly promptly and (typically for me) I just ignored it.

A few weeks in Mallorca and then a thirty hour crossing to Barcelona. Flat calm, motoring all the way. Entering Barcelona harbour and reducing the revs the engine died again. Again started after a few seconds.

Two days later entering Palamos the same thing and I finally decided I'd better investigate. Water and sediment in the primary fuel filter. New filter obtained and fitted and I was feeling pleased with myself when the engine started up.

Not so pleased two days later.

Two days of rough weather from Palamos to Port Bou (entering at night in 40 knots of wind was interesting) and then big winds got up as we crossed the Golfe du Lion to Agde. The engine cut out when the revs were reduced a few miles off Agde. Cleaned out primary filter bowl again, engine started and on we went.

Agde to Sete fine. (Even spent two hours towing a broken down Frenchman into Agde and earned fifty euros of diesel)

Sete to St Marie on Saturday and the engine cut out three times. Ran three hours, cut out, started after ten minutes, ran for an hour, cut out, started after ten minutes, ran for an hour and a half, cut out, ran for an hour until arrival here.

So I look and I wonder.

Starts on the button, roars into life full of vigour and enthusiasm but I have twenty five miles to go to the next port and I don't have much confidence.

Any advice welcome.

paul erne

Rhubarb 2

 

[bendyone]

I have the same engine in my new to me boat. First time I used it ran for 2 hours then cut out roughly and again every 2 hours when using it at around 15 -1800 revs. Air getting it to the fuel filter, bleed it and off we go again. The engine self bleeds at higher revs but at lower revs air will gather in the secondary fuel filter. Hard one to find the leak as air going in cannot be seen.

 

[30boat]

I doesn't sound like contaminated fuel to me although that tank is probably dirty and should be investigated.Have you checked your tickover stop at the injection pump?Or maybe the idling speed has been set by the throttle cable play and that has slipped. Are you reaching full speed/power in gear?If not the latter might be the case.Also if the engine needs a lot of throttle to start it could be the low speed stop that is backed too far.

 

[sarabande]

perhaps a clue in "rough weather". It's likely to have stirred up sediment which clogs your in-line filters. Not necessarily diesel bug, but just particulate crud.

Can you stir the tank, then drain a bit out from the lowest point to see if you have mucky/watery fuel ?

The repeated blocking of filters means quite a bit of detective work first. Some diesel treatments will 'dissolve' water, but it may be best to drain, then clean the tank to be sure for future confidence in the mill.

 

[Bilgediver]

Two days later entering Palamos the same thing and I finally decided I'd better investigate. Water and sediment in the primary fuel filter. New filter obtained and fitted and I was feeling pleased with myself when the engine started up.



Cleaned out primary filter bowl again, engine started and on we went.


Rhubarb 2

You seem to answer your own question???????? You infer that you are removing water and crud from your filters. Diesel engines do not run too well on watered diesel especially at slow speed. At high power there is probably insufficient water to give a problem but as soon as you slow down the water in the fuel system floods to the injectors and you have a problem.

The obvious thing seem to be to get the water out of your fuel tank so there IS NO WATER in the filters or anywhere else. Do not rely on magic devices to remove water as the only thing that works is a centrifugal De Laval separator which is too big for your boat. This is how ships keep the fuel clean.

Having removed the water find where it is coming from and stop it. It sounds like you need to fit a water drain on the fuel tank as you are creating a wonderful haven of rest for all the bugs in the Meddy by giving them such a cosy well fed environment

It is no good just bunging all the different snake oils into the tank to kill bugs. Remove them first then add the snake oil to stop them returning

It is also possible you have an air leak at one of the filters and I would suggest you look at your spill line to ensure it is working correctly as your symptoms are also the same as those on older Volvos which had a recirculating spill line which fed back to a fuel pump or filter banjo and although the engine could run with smaller air leaks even if missing from time to time it would more or less give up when throttled back. Usually the air leaks are at the added primary filter which is in the suction line to the lift pump .

The air is not obvious as the filter will appear full.

 

[Malish]

some fuel tanks do have a coarse gauze filter fitted internally at the point of exit, this can also block if you have crud in the tank - another reason to clean out the tank.

 

[luckypaul]

Addendum -'new' filter full of ****!

Just removed the 'new' primary filter and it's full of crud!

I think that's it, getting completely blocked, engine stopped, some fuel seeps through and it restarts. . .

Tank sump was drained of water and **** last week but only two days after new filter went on so there was plenty of time for the new filter to start clogging up.

Now the fuel coming out of the tank sump is clean I've got a new primary filter and I'm feeling confident enought to go out - and the wind has shifted so I'll no longer be going along a lee shore which also helps.

Marina shop doesn't have a secondary filter and I can't remove the existing one with my belt. Nigel Calder's advice is to stick a screwdriver in but without a new one that's not on!

So my next question is. How likely is the problem to be just with the primary filter? Is it reasonable to think that replacing this one again will make the difference?

paul erne

Rhubarb 2

 

[michael_w]

Have a good look at the pipework upstream of the primary filter. Clean out with either a probe or compressed air. I've had problems on several different boats with crud collecting here.

You could have a problem with rubbbish floating around in the tank, and getting sucked up the intake tube. Engine stops, vaccum breaks and the crud falls back. Had this with my old Landrover, despite extensive searching couldn't find the culprit, so fitted a wire balloon on the pick up pipe.

 

[30boat]

Just removed the 'new' primary filter and it's full of crud!

I think that's it, getting completely blocked, engine stopped, some fuel seeps through and it restarts. . .

Tank sump was drained of water and **** last week but only two days after new filter went on so there was plenty of time for the new filter to start clogging up.

Now the fuel coming out of the tank sump is clean I've got a new primary filter and I'm feeling confident enought to go out - and the wind has shifted so I'll no longer be going along a lee shore which also helps.

Marina shop doesn't have a secondary filter and I can't remove the existing one with my belt. Nigel Calder's advice is to stick a screwdriver in but without a new one that's not on!

So my next question is. How likely is the problem to be just with the primary filter? Is it reasonable to think that replacing this one again will make the difference?

paul erne

Rhubarb 2

I stand corrected here.You do have a contamination problem.