Engine Inspections on Canal/River based Motor Cruisers

[gnomus]

Good morning all. I'm thinking of buying a used motor cruiser and have started looking at adverts, You Tube videos and such-like. I know very little, so please excuse my ignorance.

My question relates to the pre-purchase survey/inspection. Some of the cruisers I see offered for sale are currently berthed on rivers or canals. And it would seem that a fair proportion of these boats never get run anywhere other than the river or canal. As such, the engines never get run up to 'cruising' revs or maximum revs. If I get a survey that includes a 'sea/river/canal' trial, then, given the speed restriction, there seems no way for the surveyor to inspect the engines at anything approaching full power. How then can he tell if the engines will manage under full load? There could be an engine issue that only manifests at higher RPM. I spoke to a (canal-based) boat broker this morning in relation to a boat I was interetsted in. He acknowledged that any 'sea trial' would be limited by speed restrictions (4kts rising to 6kts if we took it much further afield). He did not have any real answer to my testing at full-speed question, other than to say 'we've never had any problems'.

As a complete beginner, I have no idea if my concerns about this are legitimate or not. Should I restrict my searches to coastal brokers only - if so that would seem a pity since I am sure that there are a lot of perfectly good river-based cruisers on the market.

Any advice would be much appreciated.

I am looking for something in the 34-40' length, probably with twin-engines. Eventually, I would want to find a suitable coastal marina from which to operate, although there may be some merit in slow-speed operations for a while until I build up some confidence with handling the thing.

 

[Hornet_UK]

I have exactly the same question and would like to hear the consensus of the forum on this subject.

 

[kashurst]

On a canal you have no chance of a speed test. On a river based marina there is usually a short stretch of river where a bit of testing can be done. The broker/owner will know. However not a lot or very long. So it will potentially reveal the boat can accelerate, hopefully get to high revs, check oil pressure, but not long enough to look for any cooling related issues. Unfortunately that is a risk buying from an inland a river based seller. On the good side cooling issues that subsequently become apparent are usually straightforward to fix. Take the cooling system all to bits and clean it really well. Tired turbos may show up as well as poor acceleration or one engine slower to respond etc. If you can take an engine surveyor for any testing and or someone more experienced

 

[Sticky Fingers]

On a canal you have no chance of a speed test. On a river based marina there is usually a short stretch of river where a bit of testing can be done. The broker/owner will know. However not a lot or very long. So it will potentially reveal the boat can accelerate, hopefully get to high revs, check oil pressure, but not long enough to look for any cooling related issues. Unfortunately that is a risk buying from an inland a river based seller.
...
If you can take an engine surveyor for any testing and or someone more experienced.

I had this problem on the Orwell, seller refused to take the boat out to sea so we were stuck with the waterski area... almost no chance for full power running (but it still threw a load of faults). It's definitely a factor to consider, and maybe to make an offer accordingly.

 

[rafiki_]

Depends where you are based, but I would recommend getting a good technician to inspect the mechanicals. Alan Stafford on the Severn, Tom Parker, Volvo Paul (he can cover Midlands and Thames I think).

 

[gnomus]

Thanks all. I will certainly get an engineer to inspect the engines. Thanks too for the specific recommendations. I think I’ve found Tom Parker (Tompamarine) and maybe Alan Stafford (SOS Boats?) The first boat I am going to see is on the Thames - struggling to find a website for ‘Volvo Paul’. Can someone give me a steer?

 

[Sticky Fingers]

"Volvo Paul" is Paul Street, he's a well known Forum member @volvopaul - You'll need a few more posts before you can PM him.

If you're on Facebook you can join this group then message him on there:
Facebook Groups

 

[Bran]

I know some purchasers at Penton Hook on the Thames have arranged a survey at speed by getting the boat taken out past London. Six or seven hours each way so it may be possible. Could be arranged if all other surveys etc pass ok.

 

[Momac]

My boat was on a canal (Burton Waters Lincoln). I think they got up to 24kts during the survey but not for long. It did reveal a significant fault that led to a deduction from the price.
One year later I had to have a turbo reconditioned . I put that down to lack of use by the first owner and my use of it at speed revealed the fault.

I am river based but we do try to go beyond speed restriction a couple of times a year plus and our annual holiday by sea. But must admit some boats based locally go hardly anywhere.

So yes there are some risks .
But it would not deter me for the right boat .

 

[Megs20Burt!]

My boat was on a canal (Burton Waters Lincoln). I think they got up to 24kts during the survey but not for long. It did reveal a significant fault that led to a deduction from the price.
One year later I had to have a turbo reconditioned . I put that down to lack of use by the first owner and my use of it at speed revealed the fault.

I am river based but we do try to go beyond speed restriction a couple of times a year plus and our annual holiday by sea. But must admit some boats based locally go hardly anywhere.

So yes there are some risks .
But it would not deter me for the right boat .

‘Burton Waters Marina’ , which is currently enjoying a significant algae bloom along the fossdyke

 

[Momac]

‘Burton Waters Marina’ , which is currently enjoying a significant algae bloom along the fossdyke

Can't say I have been tempted to travel along the Fossditch for a few years.
But hope for a September tidal Trent trip .

 

[kashurst]

River testing is limiting. However sea testing can hide problems for the unwary and opportunity for the less scrupulous.
If you find yourself doing an open water test - drive it like you stole it. Big figure of 8s in both directions, tight turns, on and off full power.
If it still works and hasn't overheated/gone bang/sunk it's a good'un.

 

[rafiki_]

Thanks all. I will certainly get an engineer to inspect the engines. Thanks too for the specific recommendations. I think I’ve found Tom Parker (Tompamarine) and maybe Alan Stafford (SOS Boats?) The first boat I am going to see is on the Thames - struggling to find a website for ‘Volvo Paul’. Can someone give me a steer?

Alan has his boat at Windsor. Give him a call. He is a super guy and knows his stuff.

 

[penfold]

Depending on how much power there is it may be possible to do power testing while moored(sound bollards, cleats and mooring lines permitting). Plenty of fenders required.

 

[gnomus]

Alan has his boat at Windsor. Give him a call. He is a super guy and knows his stuff.

Am I right that Alan is SOS Boats? Mobile Marine Engineers - SOS Boat Services, Tewkesbury

 

[oldgit]

Testing.
Common problem on the Thames try ................Thames forum for some solutions.
Not unknown for some cash to held back pending a successful sea trial on return journey.
Due to the sheer numbers of boats for sale on the non tidal Thames and our proximity to the river, skippers in our club frequently buy boats up there.
It is not unknown for boats, after a long tenure on the Thames, to develop overheating problems after moving back down here or more worryingly during the initial journey back.
A Broom 44 suffered this fate a week or two ago , boat managed to complete the journey at displacement speed.
Might be just a blocked raw water filter or something more serious and require a complete descaling of heat exchangers and intercoolers... ie. serious stuff and if the boat is old both ,getting at and dismantling the things can be an absolute pig, corroded bolts, stripped threads, previous owners bodge ups to contend with
Trying pricing up a heat exchanger matrix from VP , you may just find out why the previous owner put the boat on the market and was so keen to accept your offer.

 

[rafiki_]

Am I right that Alan is SOS Boats? Mobile Marine Engineers - SOS Boat Services, Tewkesbury

Yes. He is an absolute top bloke.

 

[gnomus]

Yes. He is an absolute top bloke.

Thank you. His mobile message tells me he is on holiday at present. There is also a number for a Peter Stott?

 

[rafiki_]

Thank you. His mobile message tells me he is on holiday at present. There is also a number for a Peter Stott?

I think Peter does the electrical/electronics plus BSS inspections.

 

[Sneds]

Recently had a failed turbo on our f36. KAD44s
Had the boat been on the river the problem would never have manifested itself as at 1200 rpm I would never have known and carried our blissfully unaware
I would be wary buying a boat on the river unless I could get it out to sea and run it at curing speed.
Unless, of course you intend to keep it on the river
Good luck and don’t let your heart rule your head!