Dehler 35/37 CWS.... modern equivalent??

[ds797]

The Dehler CWS's of the mid 90s, particularly the 35,37 and to some extent the 36 and 39, were designed to be dead easy to sail short handed - Self tacking furling jib, Main drop with lazy jacks, electric winches, all lines led aft.

Just wondering if there is a modern equivalent of these boats - something that offers a good turn of speed, but is easy to handle with only one or two people on board.

Cheers!

 

[PaulR]

you mean mid 90's isn't modern!



in all seriousness do find that looking at newer boats than the early to mid 90's tends to reinforce my prejudices that it was that era (and earlier) that made the best looking boats -and no doubt explains why apart from our dehler - I always particularly like the sadler starlights/bowman 40 etc etc - having said that with modern sail handling gear suspect that most very modern boats upto 40ft can or are easy to handle for small crews provided they have decent sail handling gear /self steering and lazyjacks

 

[photodog]

Look at the new DEhlers....

Or probably the Hanse's are more appropriate...

Really though... most modernish boats circa 35 feet can be set up to be very easy to operate single handed or at worse two handed...

 

[Twister_Ken]

Just wondering if there is a modern equivalent of these boats - something that offers a good turn of speed, but is easy to handle with only one or two people on board.

Cheers!

Yes. I have it.

 

[Bosun Higgs]

you mean mid 90's isn't modern!



in all seriousness do find that looking at newer boats than the early to mid 90's tends to reinforce my prejudices that it was that era (and earlier) that made the best looking boats -and no doubt explains why apart from our dehler - I always particularly like the sadler starlights/bowman 40 etc etc - having said that with modern sail handling gear suspect that most very modern boats upto 40ft can or are easy to handle for small crews provided they have decent sail handling gear /self steering and lazyjacks

I like my Starlight but I would not say its as easy to single hand as modern boats with nice small fractional gibs. And as far as I know there isnt an equivalent to the Dehler CWS system - which, cynic that I am, makes me wonder if it was as good as it looked to be

So if I were in the market for a new boat I would probably go for something like an Arcona with electric winches , a self tacker and a proper bow roller

 

[dt4134]

I'd say the Starlight is the equivalent to the CWS range in terms of sea kindliness, but they don't have the same speed.

The earlier CWS models with a single winch were pretty cumbersome to use I believe, it took me a bit of practice to learn to use the duo-CWS winches efficiently. You have to be fanatical about keeping the lines tidy, as if I wasn't that already from racing.

I'd say Twister_Ken has got it right in terms of boats still being build. Certainly in my dreams I'd move to an Arcona or Finngulf if I was buying a brand new boat.

 

[Twister_Ken]

I'd say Twister_Ken has got it right in terms of boats still being build. Certainly in my dreams I'd move to an Arcona or Finngulf if I was buying a brand new boat.

Finngulf either no longer in business or barely surviving, sadly.

 

[rudolph_hart]

I'm also having the same thoughts as the O.P.

I've owned a Dehler 35CWS with 2x electric winches for the last 7 years, and she's good looking, well built, fast and a dream to singlehand. I can ( and have) sail her singlehanded in pretty much any wind strengths. She also has a wing keel/reduced draft for our E. coast & Holland crusing grounds.

As I'm in my mid-60's, I had sort of decided that she would 'see us out'.

However...... modern designs do offer more accommodation, and SWBO has now given me permission to look to spend some of the 'retirement funds' on something with a larger fornicatorium, as our aft cabin is a bit low on headroom in places.

I will want all the attributes of the D35 (looks, speed, build quality, shallow draft) and the 'CWS' (all oft-used lines led to clutches & electric winches at the helm).

Dehler 41DS: identical CWS arrangement (tick), J&V design & last built in 2004/5, so modern (tick), roomy (tick), draft 2 meters .

Hanse 385: J&V design 2011 (tick), fast (tick), 1.6m draft available (tick) 'similar'CWS winch/clutch layout to D35 (tick), needs twin wheels, as stern is as wide as oil rig support vessel .

I've even considered getting a modern design and converting it to the CWS systems. Installing bigish (Harken 44's currently) electric winches aft and installing quad clutch banks would be expensive, but not too difficult. But what about all the under-deck galleries through which the lines pass?

 

[jonic]

Yes. I have it.

Very nice

 

[flaming]

Yes. I have it.

I think there's more than one "it".

To my mind the whole "performance cruiser" segment has become more and more user friendly, largely because they have all dropped the single daftest thing ever to be put onto a shorthanded boat - the Genoa.

When you have boats from Arcona, X, Elan, Beneteau (first), Dehler, J, Grand Soliel etc that can be tacked without ever really requiring more than a casual flick of a winch handle to sheet the jib home, you really do have to wonder why the boats marketed for "family cruising" persist with big overlapping genoas.

In my eyes the most interesting shorthanded boats out there at the moment are the new Elans, the 310 and the 350. Neither are great upwind, but fly off the wind. The Elan 350 was absolutely smoking down the back of the island in the RTI last year - with 4 on board making it look very easy. Made me think about it as a shorthanded cruiser.

 

[dt4134]

However...... modern designs do offer more accommodation, and SWBO has now given me permission to look to spend some of the 'retirement funds' on something with a larger fornicatorium, as our aft cabin is a bit low on headroom in places.

You could look at a bigger CWS. Most difficult thing to keep would be the shallow draught.

 

[jonic]

At 47ft it's too big for what you are looking for but this larger mid 2000 Dehler is very easy to sail short handed.

Its a big rig, but has the maindrop system, four power winches and a drop down bowthruster.

You could even sail it single handed.

 

[rudolph_hart]

At 47ft it's too big for what you are looking for but this larger mid 2000 Dehler is very easy to sail short handed.

Its a big rig, but has the maindrop system, four power winches and a drop down bowthruster.

You could even sail it single handed.

V-e-r-y nice! But, as you say, too big. Also I believe all of the J&V-designed Dehlers have only one keel option -deep-draft.

BTW: what are the coaming winches that are mounted on plinths used for?

 

[Twister_Ken]

BTW: what are the coaming winches that are mounted on plinths used for?

Forward ones, genoa usually, and spinnaker guy.

Aft, mainsheet usually (so-called German mainsheet system) and spinnaker sheets.

 

[Ex-SolentBoy]

I am somewhat puzzled by the concept that certain boats are perceived as being easy to sail.

Surely this is just a matter of equipment specification?

To make almost any modern boat easy to sail you just fit it with in-mast furling, a self tacking headsail, a bow thruster, remore control electric windlass, electric winches, and an autopilot!

 

[jonic]

V-e-r-y nice! But, as you say, too big. Also I believe all of the J&V-designed Dehlers have only one keel option -deep-draft.
for?

Yes it is deep draft and I am not sure there was a shallow option.

Highly underrated boat.

 

[flaming]

I am somewhat puzzled by the concept that certain boats are perceived as being easy to sail.

Surely this is just a matter of equipment specification?

To make almost any modern boat easy to sail you just fit it with in-mast furling, a self tacking headsail, a bow thruster, remore control electric windlass, electric winches, and an autopilot!

That makes it reliant on the systems though, rather than just being intrinsically easy to sail.

 

[doris]

I am somewhat puzzled by the concept that certain boats are perceived as being easy to sail.

Surely this is just a matter of equipment specification?

To make almost any modern boat easy to sail you just fit it with in-mast furling, a self tacking headsail, a bow thruster, remore control electric windlass, electric winches, and an autopilot!

Some boats, even cruisey ones, are twitchy, not hugely directionally stable, have bad ergonomics etc. No matter what kit you put on them they will never be easy to sail. They may be very quick, but not easy. For short handing, a boat that is forgiving and easy to keep in the groove makes life a lot easier. This may not necessarily be the quickest or the most comfy.

 

[BobPrell]

To my mind the whole "performance cruiser" segment has become more and more user friendly, largely because they have all dropped the single daftest thing ever to be put onto a shorthanded boat - the Genoa.

That goes for any boat not used for racing, as far as I am concerned.

 

[rudolph_hart]

Forward ones, genoa usually, and spinnaker guy.

Aft, mainsheet usually (so-called German mainsheet system) and spinnaker sheets.

That's what I suspected, and it's where the Dehler CWS system on mine differs, because she was never designed to be raced.

I have only 2 coaming winches, one either side (not in front) of the wheel, and they handle the following control lines. Starboard side: Main halyard, mainsheet, jibsheet, furling line. Port: Reefs 1 & 2 (single line), jibsheet.

This means I stay behind the wheel for almost sail management. The 100% jib is virtually self tacking, sheeting inside the shrouds on track cars on the coachroof.

The winches on the coachroof handle all other lines and are maybe used 3 or 4 times in a season when the cruising chute is deployed (I dump the main in gusts with the sheet, not the rod boomvang).

I can see why the new boats have the additional coaming winches, as they are all fast and may be raced, which requires genoas and kites etc. and the builders fit them to address that market.

One or two D35CWS' have been raced, but they're not designed as such and need modification (no genoa tracks, no genoa winches).

As I said in my ealier post, some of the larger sisters (37, 41DS, 43) have the same layout because they are designed for cruising.

So I'm still stuck for something on which to splash the kid's inheritance.