Definition of a "Classic"

Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

I am at the end of my yachting life now but had I known what I know now I would certainly have looked at 'concrete' boats. The ones I have seen are really very good indeed and, I am assured, easily repairable.

Submarines and freighters were built of concrete at various times - I wonder if they had a plasterer on their engine room strength!
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

Dunno, but from what I do know of Eng. Tiffy's, they were plastered a lot of the time! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

I think a classic is a boat that has stood the test of time, this means new boats can't be classics unless they are identical to ones that have been about for years.
How can you tell if it has stood the test of time? Well, there may be many different reasons from boat to boat to justify their particular claim and all valid. BUT a good rule of thumb is if it sells for more than other boats of its age and condition
then other simular boats it probably is one.
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

People are keen to own a classic and the age definition becomes the criteria.
However did Maurice Griffiths (for instance) always design classic boats. I doubt it. I bet some of his boats were average and some perhaps dogs.
That's why a classic is special. It's one that rises above the average.

In cars the definition has moved to up to 1973 because the Road tax-free status has distorted the market as a result of some Whitehall bod plumping for a particular year.

I must look around for a "classic" Reliant Robin.

(Except that the Revenue and Customs define a classic car for company taxation purposes as being over 15 years old and having a value in excess of £15,000.)
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

Smiffy said: "As we are really talking about boats, here is what I consider a classic. It would be built or designed pre WW2, and built in wood."

Well, I have seen one or two horrible old wooden boats, whilst one of the big yachts that raced Britannia (can't remember which) was riveted iron. No one would deny that she was a classic. Just shows how hard setting out a definition is.

Personally I do not believe that a date cut-off as applied by the car enthusiasts is appropriate for boats, and I do think that Folkboats are "classic". Similarly some GRP boats may survive to become classics, as may some modern out and out racing machines. Just as the appearance of the J class racing machines is now defining what we consider to be classic.
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

Smiffy has said a lot of things, but I never said that I was setting out a definition for anybody else! I said that to me that was my criteria /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Hey, and just because a boat is horrible, don't mean it aint a classic!

Just to make it plain for ya,

Classic = pre WW2 design and or build, and built in wood.

Vintage = pre WW1 design and or build, and built in wood.

Just my not very humble opinion, and yes Lakey, I think some classics are diabolical! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Edit.....hey Phil, let me know how your hunt for a "classic Reliant Robin" goes? /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

Smiffy's just being a wood snob. Loadsa stuff built in wood years ago would be downright dangerous now just because the racing rules were inappropriately followed even for cruisers.

Plastic boats can be classics too, but they must do what they were designed to do well, and still look good enough to find new owners easily.

I don't think it's about age, or materials, it's more about "fit for purpose" & consistent demand for the class.
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

Always concidered the J class as a classic, just shows how wrong you can be.

Shamrock V was then sold to aviation friend Sir Richard Fairey (Fairey Aviation) who again was a keen yachtsman who campaigned it in company of two new steel J's built during 1933 - 1934 - Velsheda and Endeavour

Shamrock is the only remaing J that was built in wood, that's just taken most of the J class out of being a classic.


Live and learn

Brian
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

I think a classic design is one that remains desirable despite the passage of time.
Just being made from a particular material, or being from a particular era or from a particular designer doesn't necessarily make it a classic. In my personal view, it has to remain as desirable today as it was when it was born to be defined as a classic.
That lets the Reliant Robin out in my book!
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

[ QUOTE ]
Always concidered the J class as a classic, just shows how wrong you can be.

Shamrock V was then sold to aviation friend Sir Richard Fairey (Fairey Aviation) who again was a keen yachtsman who campaigned it in company of two new steel J's built during 1933 - 1934 - Velsheda and Endeavour

Shamrock is the only remaing J that was built in wood, that's just taken most of the J class out of being a classic.


Live and learn

Brian

[/ QUOTE ]

Hey! I am just expressing my personal point of view, I aint asking you to subscribe to it, so what's with the sarcasm /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

To Searush, no I aint being a "Wood Snob" I aint snobby about anything, it's is simply that wood is a medium I am happy with, and am used to working with. I find GRP a horrible material to work with, don't mean I can't do it, just means I don't like the bloody stuff.

The other thing that strikes me about plastic boats is that they all look like they have been turned out on an assembly line, there is hardly any individuality about them. To put it another way.....One Westerly Pentland, is much the same as any other Westerly Pentland, bound to really aint they? After all, they all came from the same mould, and from the same factory.

Well I have really said all I want to say on this one, so I will leave ya with it.

Best to all, Charlie.
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

Have to put my groat's worth in here...

I reckon a MkI Corribee could be considered a classic. It's the lines, the look, the sea-keeping abilities, etc.

And of the J class, there's Lulworth that is wood, languished on the mud in the Hamble for many years, but has now been restored to full sailing and even racing order.

Both these are, in my opinion, worthy of study and immitation to some degree.

Both exhibit time-proven qualities.
And for me that makes them classic.

Ron
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

Smiffy, you're not doing a hit & run are you, you wimp!

Coz most 35 year old boats, even when they have come out of the same mould (no different to being built of wood to same set of plans) will be very different due to various owner's attempts to "improve" them.

You might just as well say all Vertues look the same - which they do of course. All Fifers are so alike they can be identified a mile away. So I don't accept your suggestion that Westerlies can't be classics as they all look alike. That doesn't necessarily mean that they are all classics tho'.
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

Nope, just said all I can say on the subject, no point in flogging it to death. I reckon there are probably as many different opinions on this subject as there are boats!

It's all very subjective anyway, onew mans meat etc.
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

[ QUOTE ]
Hey! I am just expressing my personal point of view, I aint asking you to subscribe to it, so what's with the sarcasm /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Sorry not ment to be sarcastic, just put a point.

Prior to buying Halcyon, we had a survey on a SCOD, pulled out when we found it needed around £10,000 rebuild due to rotten wood, and I did not have the time myself for the job.
Found the Halcyon in a yard, it looked right, felt right, had sailing ability as it had 2 trans-Atlantic crossing under her belt. If had been wood with a good survey I would have bought it, as it was it was plastic with a good survey so we bought it.
The funny thing is that Halcyon looks nothing like a standard one, and I like a standard one far less, Halcyon Dreams is very customised.

Still look at a yacht, if it looks and feels right it's a classic, be it wood, steel, concrete or fibreglass.

Brian
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

No problem Brian, how about a pic of this non standard Halcyon of yours? /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

[ QUOTE ]
Have to put my groat's worth in here...
(snip)
Ron

[/ QUOTE ]

A measly Groat!! Ya cheapskate! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

[ QUOTE ]
(cut)
It's all very subjective anyway, onew mans meat etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

Absolutely, why do you think I started the thread! /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

It's good to see what others think. It helps to put one's own thoughts in perspective. In case you hadn't worked it out yet, I enjoy a good discussion (whoops, nearly said argument there /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif)
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

Should be Halcyon Dreams

H27.jpg


Brian
 
Re: Definition of a \"Classic\"

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry still on the large side, try a smaller size again next time.

Brian

[/ QUOTE ]

It's ok Brian, big is beautiful!......so they tell me /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif Is that a Quartermaster type windvane a danglin' on her stern? If so, how do you get on with it, does it have enough power for her?
 
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